Manchin offered to be independent if he was a "problem"

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by submarinepainter, Oct 21, 2021.

  1. submarinepainter

    submarinepainter Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  2. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    Whatever it takes, the duopoly should be abolished, but I know it ain't gonna happen. All the best to Joe Manchin.
     
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  3. submarinepainter

    submarinepainter Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I hoped it would of happened by now ,
     
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  4. Chrizton

    Chrizton Well-Known Member

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    That was just a polite way to say you won't be able to play if I take my football and go home.
     
  5. 61falcon

    61falcon Well-Known Member

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    Manchin and Sinema are voting with their financial campaign interests in mind, she with Big Pharma who finance her campaigns and he with the energy industry which finance his campaigns.
     
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  6. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    Maybe. I hear Sinema is working to help make sure everything is paid for.
     
  7. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    You know what's kind of unfortunate? Manchin and Sinema are doing what the Republicans should be doing by moderating the spending package. Instead of doing this, Republicans have gone full obstructionist and radical right instead.
     
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  8. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    West Virginia is a little bit of an unusual area and creates a problem for the rest of the Democratic Party.

    It's very much a poorer "unsophisticated" conservative working class demographic, but has traditionally leaned Democrat, in large part because of the poverty and their financial circumstances, and because they never really left the Democratic Party from older times when the Democratic Party used to control the South (West Virginia is part of "the South" culturally)
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2021
  9. Hey Now

    Hey Now Well-Known Member

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    Spot on post. They should be working together for the benefit of as many Americans as possible. The American election cycles are too damn long and expensive for proper governance.
     
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  10. submarinepainter

    submarinepainter Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    sounds like you are not holding all of the left to the same Standard
     
  11. perotista

    perotista Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Manchin is an old fashioned moderate Democrat. He certainly doesn't fit in today's progressive Democratic Party nor does he fit into the pro-Trump Republican Party. Manchin has said he would continue to caucus with the Democrats. So they wouldn't lose control of the senate. But he'd be a real independent and not one in name only like Sanders and King.

    No one looks at Sanders and King as Independents anyway. They looked on as die hard Democrats. In fact Sanders has voted the Democratic Party line more than any other Democratic senator with one exception. Manchin is the last of a dying breed of moderate Democrats. The Democratic Party doesn't want anyone except progressives these days. The time of the Democratic Party being the big tent party is long gone.

    What Manchin does, he does. But I suspect someone like Manchin represents the views of more Americans in general than either the pro-Trump Republican Party or the progressive Democratic Party. Perhaps this is why independents have risen from 30% of the electorate in 2006 to 41% today. Too many litmus tests to belong to either major party.
     
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  12. submarinepainter

    submarinepainter Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I know Collins and Golden have crossed the aisle more than Sanders or King, Anus
     
  13. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    I haven't seen them behave similarly.
     
  14. Pro_Line_FL

    Pro_Line_FL Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If there were 150 such reps, things would improve very quickly.
     
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  15. submarinepainter

    submarinepainter Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    So Democrats never lie or cheat ?
     
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  16. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    Maybe. They may simply understand how harmful this proposed spending is. The point is you don't know.
     
  17. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    I didn't comment on lying and cheating. I said:

     
  18. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    Republicans most likely don't want any part of the proposed overspending. They want not less of it but none of it.
     
  19. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    It's badly needed and highly beneficial spending, actually. Republicans could play a part in ensuring that includes things they want (they do spend when they're in power, and typically do so without bothering to fund it) and that it is funded, and they could rein it in where they deem it necessary.

    Instead they pander to people who think along the lines of your post, which is foolish, extreme and hypocritical.
     
  20. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    I disagree completely with your premise. Rather than being badly needed and highly beneficial I view it as the opposite and I view all of it beyond the appropriate role of federal government. Republicans may agree with you but I disagree very very strongly.l This bill is a horror for me.
     
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  21. joesnagg

    joesnagg Banned

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    Only if they never open their mouths or get the chance to. ;)
     
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  22. submarinepainter

    submarinepainter Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    you're not funded it is all speculation , what about the interest ? and you know there will be cost over runs and you are correct about the R's
     
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  23. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    Amazing how a $Trillion or two can metastasize to $6.5 trillion.

    At this rate, one way or another, the Pentagon will eventually be defunded.

    “OVERSIGHT BY CONGRESS:

    Date Congress authorized U.S. forces to go after culprits in Sept. 11, 2001 attacks: Sept. 18, 2001.
    Number of times U.S. lawmakers have voted to declare war in Afghanistan: 0.
    Number of times lawmakers in Senate Appropriations defense subcommittee addressed costs of Vietnam War, during that conflict: 42
    Number of times lawmakers in same subcommittee have mentioned costs of Afghanistan and Iraq wars: 5.
    Number of times lawmakers in Senate Finance Committee have mentioned costs of Afghanistan and Iraq wars, since Sept. 11, 2001: 1.

    PAYING FOR A WAR ON CREDIT, NOT IN CASH: ...
    Estimated amount of direct Afghanistan and Iraq war costs that the United States has debt-financed as of 2020: $2 trillion.
    Estimated interest payments on that $2 trillion so far (based on a higher-end estimate of interest rates): $925 billion.
    Estimated interest costs by 2030: $2 trillion.
    Estimated interest costs by 2050: $6.5 trillion.

    THE WARS END. THE COSTS DON'T:
    Amount Bilmes estimates the United States has committed to pay in health care, disability, burial and other costs for roughly 4 million Afghanistan and Iraq veterans: $1.6 to $1.8 trillion.
    Period those costs will peak: after 2048.”
    ABC NEWS, The cost of the Afghanistan war, in lives and dollars, The nearly 20-year American combat mission in Afghanistan was the United States’ longest war, By ELLEN KNICKMEYER, Associated Press, July 12, 2021.
    https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/cost-afghanistan-war-lives-dollars-78802965

    Somebody is sure getting rich off all these scams.
     
  24. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    he should register as something other than democrat
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2021
  25. yabberefugee

    yabberefugee Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    They just shuttle everything around so it appears that way.....doesn't anyone see that? They are growing government!
     
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