Religion is Silly Fairy Tales

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by Bob0627, Aug 8, 2021.

  1. Dirty Rotten Imbecile

    Dirty Rotten Imbecile Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2016
    Messages:
    2,158
    Likes Received:
    869
    Trophy Points:
    113
    He’s over-rated
     
  2. Bob0627

    Bob0627 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Messages:
    8,576
    Likes Received:
    2,337
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Sure Koko, I pray to no god every chance I get.

    Yeah tell that to the billions of people who worship a deity that theirs is not necessarily a religion.

    Count for what? I can't speak for them. I was tricked into a religion as a child because I didn't know any better. No one tricked me out of any religion, I volunteered because I grew up and figured out the stories are fairy tales. I intuitively knew that even as a child but I couldn't reject it all because everyone around me told me the stories in the Bible are all true.

    Yeah the Bible is not a book of silly fairy tales, all the stories are 100% true. A god created the Universe in 6 days, it's all on YouTube.
     
  3. Bob0627

    Bob0627 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Messages:
    8,576
    Likes Received:
    2,337
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You mean he had made a lucrative career out of seeking approval, comedy and earned a fortune doing it. Many evangelists also seek approval and make a fortune doing that. The difference is they recite silly fairy tales to their followers. I probably would characterize that as comic if it weren't so pathetically tragic.
     
    JET3534 and Cosmo like this.
  4. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2012
    Messages:
    12,831
    Likes Received:
    5,961
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Like Jefferson was suggesting, they give truth a bad name, and impetus to disbelief.
     
  5. Jolly Penguin

    Jolly Penguin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2020
    Messages:
    8,210
    Likes Received:
    3,844
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The difference is Carlin was both clever and funny, and wrote his own material. Not so much with most priests.
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2021
    Cosmo and Bob0627 like this.
  6. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    23,673
    Likes Received:
    1,771
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Count for being tricked by people making false claims about G/god(s), or not.
    You cant be tricked into something unless there is intent to deceive you, so are your parents deceitful Bob?
    Of course to prove that you need to prove also that no God can exist.
    So if we compare that to history, where do you go to insure everything is true Bob?
    But Bob G/god is not required for 'religion'.
    Atheism is a religion bob. Ive shown this to you before. You said you included all mainstream religions, but then your posts seem to completely leave out and apologize, even become evangelistic proselytism.

    The religiously unaffiliated, called "nones," are growing significantly. They’re the second largest religious group in North America and most of Europe.
    https://www.nationalgeographic.com/...theism-agnostic-secular-nones-rising-religion

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_for_Atheists

    The asumption that becaasue you are an atheist you have no religion is false on its face. Its been abandoned for a long time.

    Sure Bob, you are totally free to pray to the void god.

    People also ask
    Can you pray without believing in God?

    One does not need to believe in God for prayer to work. ... This makes sense because you do not need to subscribe to any particular religion or believe in any God to meditate. Though Harris does not realise it, the same is true of prayer. It is possible to be a praying atheist, a “pray-theist” if you like.Dec 10, 2018

    Prayer for Atheists: a helpful practise even if you don't believe ...


    Most atheists pray to Erebus

    Seems our board neoatheists are living in the stone age!
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2021
  7. Bob0627

    Bob0627 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Messages:
    8,576
    Likes Received:
    2,337
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Tricked into making false claims or tricked into not making false claims. Right, that makes a lot of sense.

    Yes (were), so were my teachers.

    No I don't. One who cannot recognize a fairy tale is either a child, mentally incompetent or has been tricked (or a combination). No one needs to prove a fairy tale is a fairy tale to know it's a fairy tale. Of course those who feel they need to are free to knock themselves out.

    I don't compare the Bible to history but not everything in mainstream history is true, obviously. History is written by the victors. See prior response.

    True but it is a part of religions that are followed by billions of people and this thread addresses those religions that are based on silly fairy tales.

    No it isn't and no you haven't done any such thing because you can't.

    Whatever that means.

    I can't read the article unless I subscribe and I have no intention of doing so. Either way, "nones" are not what this thread is about.


    The rest, including my sarcastic response, has nothing to do with what this thread is about.
     
    Cosmo likes this.
  8. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    23,673
    Likes Received:
    1,771
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Odd, I didnt have to subscribe
    It means there are serious defects in your presentation that you need to address and have not.
    Bob you are confusing your refusal to accept the reality with the thing in itself.

    https://www.theatlantic.com › archive › 2018/05 › amer...
    May 31, 2018 — Atheists Are Sometimes More Religious Than Christians ... A new study shows how poorly we understand the beliefs of people who identify as atheist ...

    https://en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Atheism
    Criticism of religionAtheism is not mutually exclusive with respect to some religious and spiritual belief systems, including Hinduism, Jainism, Buddhism ...
    Definitions and types · ‎Etymology · ‎Arguments · ‎Religion and morality



    Its all over the interweb Bob that atheism is a religion, just a religion without a God.

    So it goes without saying that when you condemn 'religion' you also condemn yourself.

    Atheism does not give you a free pass.

    What is prayer for an atheist?

    For the atheist, such as myself, there is no great chance that God is listening or will respond, but that does not matter. One does not need to believe in God for prayer to work. ... Though Harris does not realise it, the same is true of prayer. It is possible to be a praying atheist, a “pray-theist” if you like.Dec 10, 2018

    Prayer for Atheists: a helpful practise even if you don't believe ...
    https://iai.tv › articles › prayer-for-atheists-auid-1181

    Search for: What is prayer for an

     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2021
  9. Bob0627

    Bob0627 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Messages:
    8,576
    Likes Received:
    2,337
    Trophy Points:
    113
    My "presentation" is actually an article ("Religion is Silly Fairy Tales") someone else wrote that I agree with wholeheartedly because that's what religion is. If there are "serious defects" with it, that's your opinion, I disagree.

    You can keep peddling that atheism is a religion all you want, it's of no consequence to me. I don't believe in the existence of the mythical god (or any god) central to several religions that billions follow and some spend their entire lives living the myth. If you want to call that atheism (as popularly called) and to you it's a "religion", or a "no god religion" for whatever reason gives you some sense of comfort, I'm ok with it. It's not the topic of this discussion, the discussion and the reality is still "Religion is Silly Fairy Tales". These fairy tales are embodied in the Bible and the Quran (all works of fiction written by several authors), central and "holy" to 3 major religions and their variations and followed by billions of people all over the planet.
     
    Cosmo and Jolly Penguin like this.
  10. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    23,673
    Likes Received:
    1,771
    Trophy Points:
    113
    bob just because a nobody news paper editor voices his opinion using an outdated definition for religion it does not make it true or even credible for that matter.

    James A. Haught (Charleston, WV) is the editor of the Charleston Gazette, West Virginia's largest newspaper. He is the author of 2000 Years of Disbelief


    Like I said, you shoot yourself in the foot, because if you have so much as one belief that cant be proven in court, you have a religion. Lets see, we start with atheism, you hold atheism to be true, that deities are bullshit, and that fine, but its not fine to come out here pretending that atheism is not a religion contrary to the courts and to philosophy and other scholars.

    In other words you condemn yourself right along with the people you are so prejudiced against.
    I'm only telling you where this is at academically man.
    No Bob everybody who has done any degree of research on the issue knows atheism is in fact a religion, even by any other name.
    But Bob, there are secular records, do you feel this is some sort of conspiracy against atheists? How could you possibly overlook that?

    Unanswered questionsChristianity
    What is the historical evidence that Jesus Christ lived and died?
    Today some claim that Jesus is just an idea, rather than a real historical figure, but there is a good deal of written evidence for his existence 2,000 years ago

    How confident can we be that Jesus Christ actually lived?

    The historical evidence for Jesus of Nazareth is both long-established and widespread. Within a few decades of his supposed lifetime, he is mentioned by Jewish and Roman historians, as well as by dozens of Christian writings. Compare that with, for example, King Arthur, who supposedly lived around AD500.

    Roman politicians Pliny and Tacitus, who held some of the highest offices of state at the beginning of the second century AD. From Tacitus we learn that Jesus was executed while Pontius Pilate was the Roman prefect in charge of Judaea (AD26-36) and Tiberius was emperor (AD14-37) – reports that fit with the timeframe of the gospels. Pliny contributes the information that, where he was governor in northern Turkey, Christians worshipped Christ as a god. Neither of them liked Christians – Pliny writes of their “pig-headed obstinacy” and Tacitus calls their religion a destructive superstition. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...cal-evidence-that-jesus-christ-lived-and-died
     
  11. Bob0627

    Bob0627 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Messages:
    8,576
    Likes Received:
    2,337
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Correct, except it is true for me. Not for you? That's ok Koko.

    You can tell me whatever you want for any reason you want, I'm not buying what you're peddling (if you haven't figured that out yet).

    If you say so. No one I know believes atheism is a religion because it isn't. If it is for you that's ok with me.

    Yeah 2,000 years ago. I believe the first book of the New Testament was written by some guy more than 2 decades (some claim over 7 decades) after Jesus' alleged death. There are allegedly several independent authors of the fiction works collectively known as the New Testament. It's possible he lived and if he did he was most likely born and died a Jew since he lived in a region inhabited by mostly Jews (according to the myth). Whether he lived or didn't is inconsequential, the entire Jesus myth is just that, a silly fairy tale. It's even sillier considering the conundrum that he is the father, the son and the holy ghost according to the myth. And billions bought and still buy that bridge. But to not believe that silliness is a "religion" in your world. I'm shocked you didn't buy that 3 WTC towers "collapsed" on 9/11 if you buy that nonsense. To each his own I guess.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2021
    Cosmo and Jolly Penguin like this.
  12. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    23,673
    Likes Received:
    1,771
    Trophy Points:
    113
    truth is truth, it cant rationally be true for you unless you first off start off proving no G/gods exist since you are using the 'religion' as a synonym for belief in a deity. Its is not.

    Religion is nothing more than the practice of whatever it is you chose to believe. Its nothing more than a philosophical belief until you practice it, then its your religion.

    I'm giving you very well documented contrarian evidence to your claims, since the christians on here seem to be pretty lame in the natural realm and for whatever reason cant hold their ground.

    You are ignoring evidence given to you. I gave you secular history that proves JC did in fact live in the exact timeframe of his death. you fail to address it Bob.

    This does prove that JC was in fact real, regardless of your so-called truth', which appears to take the form of blind denial, since you are dodging everything contrary.
    Bob no one you know posted evidence on the destruction of 911, yet you believe them.
    Atheism being a religion does not have to be believed by some tiny circle of your friends to be true Bob, that is not the correct measuring stick to use to come up with the correct answe.


    Religion
    .
    A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being, (or beings, for polytheistic faiths) nor must it be a mainstream faith.” Thus, the court concluded, atheism is equivalent to religion for purposes of the First Amendment and Kaufman should have been given the right to meet to discuss atheism ...

    EDITORIAL Is Atheism a Religion? Recent Judicial ...


    Bob, look at the Jains, Budhism, branches of quakers, and there are several more.

    Is Atheism a Religion? | The Banner
    https://www.thebanner.org › columns › 2019/01 › is-at...

    Jan 21, 2019 — Atheism is a religious worldview because it claims to know something fundamental about reality that hasn't been—or can't be—proven.


    Now the atheists on the other hand get it all wrong, as usual, they conflate the worship of a deity as a religion, it is not. Worshiping a deity alone is not a religion.

    https://www.atheists.org › Activism › Resources
    Atheism is one thing: A lack of belief in gods. It is not an affirmative belief that there is no god nor does it answer any other question about a person.

    When a book was written has exactly nothing to do with nothing to support your claims bob. As long as they are referenced and they are, in the secular records no less you are on the hook if you expect anyone else on the planet to believe what you believe.

    You are dead wrong Bob, his actual living gives credibility to the other records, standing on a soap box yelling nah nah neener all fairy tales is false on its face since the life of JC has been valieated byyour believe system.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2021
  13. Bob0627

    Bob0627 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Messages:
    8,576
    Likes Received:
    2,337
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Yep it is.

    I don't have to do any such thing no more than I need to prove Santa and the Tooth Fairy don't exist. Whether a god exists or not is immaterial, the Universe and life is the same either way and the stories about such a god are still silly fairy tales.

    A religion is a belief but a belief is not necessarily a religion for the same reason that if one believes the sky is blue it does not mean the belief that the sky is blue is a religion. In other words the term religion is a subset of the term belief, not the other way around.

    You can give me anything you want, it's your prerogative. I'm pretty sure flat earthers can also provide "evidence" that the Earth is flat.

    Nope I did address it, you even quoted me:


    Nope, it's not proof, it's circumstantial evidence that he might have lived. And it's definitely not proof that the silly fairy tales surrounding the mythical Jesus are fact/real.

    I believe in science, common sense and my own eyes. I also believe there is a lot more that we don't know or understand, but silly fairy tales are still silly fairy tales unless and until proven otherwise. And for me there is no proof that a god exists or that religion is something more than based on silly fairy tales.

    True. Atheism is merely a label attributed to those who do not buy the god myth, nothing more. Some such as you want to expand the term to whatever it is you want to expand it to. That's ok with me, for me it's still nothing more than a label, same as "truther" is nothing more than a label. In fact it's literally someone who seeks the truth but has been weaponized to be a derogatory term. Imagine that, people ridiculing those who seek the truth. I guess that's somewhat like ridiculing those who don't believe in a god or the silly fairy tales being peddled in religious circles.
     
  14. Jolly Penguin

    Jolly Penguin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2020
    Messages:
    8,210
    Likes Received:
    3,844
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Note that Koko thinks we choose to believe or not to believe Gods exist. He even told me that if he wanted to, he could make himself believe he is an elephant.

    So it should be no surprise that he can convince himself that he has provided us convincing evidence that Jesus is more than mythology.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2021
  15. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    23,673
    Likes Received:
    1,771
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Note that the bird projects that humans are brain-dead autonomatons incapable of choosing what they believe.
    Most people with so much as 1 picogram of integrity would file that claim under a bald faced lie since what Koko told you is quoted below and it exactly the opposite.
    Clearly I neither implied nor told you any such thing, 100% fabrication.

    Like it or not scholars, which you have sufficiently proven you are NOT are in agreement that Jesus Christ did in fact walk the face of this earth, confirmed by testimony from nonjewish secular sources as well as biblical.

    https://www.history.com/news/was-jesus-real-historical-evidence


    “The reality is that we don’t have archaeological records for virtually anyone who lived in Jesus’s time and place,” says University of North Carolina religious studies professor Bart D. Ehrman, author of Did Jesus Exist? The Historical Argument for Jesus of Nazareth. “The lack of [archaeological] evidence does not mean a person at the time didn’t exist. It means that she or he, like 99.99% of the rest of the world at the time, made no impact on the archaeological record.” [clarifying emphasis added]


    Yep, I agree with the scholars, based on the conditions of that time period in history that there is sufficient evidence to believe Jesus Christ did walk the face of this earth.

    But than I am not hell bent on misapplying modern day methodology to situations of antiquity, hence I am agnostic for other reasons, but not for the reason JC did not exist, the evidence is quite clear he did.

    Bob, why would anyone desire to get on board with the neoatheist religion when they dont hesitate to unapologetically stoop to a clear falsification the record?
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2021
  16. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    23,673
    Likes Received:
    1,771
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Sure you do Bob, you are claiming the bible is all myths and fairy tales, and as an atheist that believes in the scientific method you cant prove your hypothesis? Why should anyone take you seriously if you make claims you cant prove?
    False, God is the core claim of the bible. It most certainly is relevant, like 500% relevant, espcially since you claim its a fairy tale.
    True, but now if you start offing sacrifices, worshiping, and praying to that blue sky and you believe with your heart and soul that the blue sky is God, its indisputably a religion.
    False, you have that bassackwards.
    I quoted that you did not address it on point lol
    Bob they will haul people to the electric chair on circumstantial evidence, do you feel circumstantial evidence is not bonafide evidence to believe something is true?
    Well your own eye did not see George Washington either Bob. You didnt witness the signing of the constitution, so its not true?
    Since its a well known fact that atheism is a religion, then you include yourself in these fairy tales I presume? ___or do you get a special pass?
    Labels have an attached meaning Bob, so its much more than a 'label'.
     
  17. Jolly Penguin

    Jolly Penguin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2020
    Messages:
    8,210
    Likes Received:
    3,844
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You clearly say in what you quote there that "you" COULD choose to believe and pursuade yourself that you are an elephant.

    Did you mean that only crazy people can make that choice and the sane people can't make that choice? If so, then you could have been a lot clearer, and you would have been agreeing with me that (sane) people don't choose if they believe such things or not.

    I can not will myself to believe I am an elephant. I also can not will myself to believe there are faeries, Gods, or space aliens abducting my pets. Not until I am convinced such a things are so. I asked if you were saying you can do so, and you responded with the above.... which obviously implies that you think you can choose to do so.

    Not very convincingly. And I do note your appeal to authority fallacy here.

    That doesn't say Jesus existed. You need to work on your reading comprehension. And I've read some of Ehrman. He isn't as adamant as you seem to think.

    https://www.npr.org/2012/04/01/149462376/did-jesus-exist-a-historian-makes-his-case

    He does think Jesus probably existed, but mostly just because the story isn't what you would expect people to make up.

    That's hardly conclusive evidence. It isn't evidence at all really. it is just an odd turn of events.

    And Ehrman goes on to say that if Jesus did exist, the Christians probably got him very wrong (which makes sense)

    It does make sense that a man named Jesus (or many such men) could have existed. They could have been simple people around whom a myth was built, or a group of people with myths built around them combined into one, like King Arthur is thought to be.

    You lose me at the "Christ" part. You lose Ehrman too. There is zero reason other than religious programming to think that Christ ever existed, even if a man called Yeshua around whom a myth was built did, and even that isn't certain.

    That's also a fallacy. Not only didn't I fabricate anything, and not only am I not a "neoatheist" in a "neoatheist religion", but even if I was a neoatheist and the biggest liar who ever lied, it wouldn't invalidate anything neoatheists believe (whatever you think that is). To say it would, is a classic example of ad hominem fallacy. If Hitler says 1 + 1 = 2, that doesn't make it incorrect. To invalidate what neoatheists claim, you'd have to get claims from neoatheists and prove them wrong, regardless of who the neoatheist are or what their personal flaws, if any, are.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2021
  18. Jolly Penguin

    Jolly Penguin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2020
    Messages:
    8,210
    Likes Received:
    3,844
    Trophy Points:
    113
    He's right Bob. You can't prove the Tooth Fairy doesn't exist. Millions of teeth disappear from under children's pillows every year. You cant prove it is all parents and never faeries. You also can't prove there isn't an invisible weightless space alien siting on your shoulder right now knitting space mittens either. You also can't prove big foot doesn't do my taxes every year from his forest hideaway. Hell, you probably can't even prove that Koko and myself aren't computer programs pretending to be human beings. Oh dear. Is not believing those things tantamount to religions?

    That's a good point. But we do have a lot more evidence that George Washington existed than that Jesus did.

    In both cases, we probably get a lot wrong today about who these people were (if Jesus existed). The story about Washington and the cherry tree, for example, has no actual evidence behind it and is almost certainly fabricated myth.

    But nobody claims George Washington walked on water, was God in the flesh, or was the celestial saviour of humanity. The claims about Washington, are not only backed with much more evidence, but are not nearly as extreme. The more extreme and implausible the claim, the more and better evidence is needed. Washington has more evidence for him, and less extreme claims said about him.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2021
    Bob0627 likes this.
  19. MiaBleu

    MiaBleu Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2017
    Messages:
    8,042
    Likes Received:
    6,767
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female

    Is that your "belief" .....;-)



    For some the belief in the existence of "god" is part of their life philosophy. For others........... who do no t buy into any of these religions.............. the whole idea is is quite irrelevant.


    Life philosophy can be framed on humanitarian principles............. and that works very well for may. The "god" thing is a religious construct..........

    the notion of "gods " has existed for centuries........... and the "gods" have changed wit time. ..........

    There is a very good book called " The God Delusion" that looks at t his whole notion in a very pragmatic and logical way.


    For many "beliefs " serve a purpose ........and that is fine. For others not so. The problem starts when one group wants to foist their beliefs on others.............Or that their beliefs are somehow better than others. A certain belief can thrive in a certain culture........and beliefs vary depending on the culture. Each cultures "believes" that their belief is better than another............... while it is just different.

    Beliefs also foster "group think".........and this becomes self reinforcing.......
     
  20. Jolly Penguin

    Jolly Penguin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2020
    Messages:
    8,210
    Likes Received:
    3,844
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I find it curious that "how the eagle got his wings" in Iroquois spirituality is so easily dismissed as mythology without any respect for the Iroquois people, but then the same people hold up the bible and expect us not to see it as equally silly fairy tales.
     
    MiaBleu likes this.
  21. MiaBleu

    MiaBleu Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2017
    Messages:
    8,042
    Likes Received:
    6,767
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female


    Jesus probably existed. He acquired "god like qualities to the mythical proportions after his Crucifixion............ and did he himself not say "he was the son of "god"??.............. which would make him delusional ) But that is how "religions " are created........ particularly after the Romans adopted Xtianity as their formal religion............and that morphed into various types. ( Catholicism being one......... and a rather successful one.............becoming one of the richest organizations on the planet.

    The Catholic "guilt" factor has created many psychological problems in peple........ but has a powerful hold on them.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2021
  22. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    23,673
    Likes Received:
    1,771
    Trophy Points:
    113
    FALSE I said "you" as in someone could choose not me.

    to interpret that statement as me as in Koko, then it would be stated with using 'I' not 'you'!

    you seem to have unimaginably incredible difficulties with the most simple English.
    here again same problem you don't understand English metaphors, analogies, idioms, phrases or euphemisms.

    a room padded with foam rubber for the confinement of a violent mentally ill person.

    Rubber room Definition & Meaning | Dictionary.com


    If something is beyond your comprehension look it up or ask what it means, dont make **** up and falsify what people post, that is totally dishonest debate tactics.
    yes you can, under the conditions I stated.
    once again you're doubling and tripling down on your mistake and failure to comprehend what was said.
    it's not an appeal to authority it's appeal to fact, there are several secular sources that have nothing to do with the Jewish religion in fact one of those secular sources talked about Jesus Christ and his execution as a well-known fact and a pejorative to the atheist mindset.
    just because he isn't beating you over the head with a 2x4 doesn't mean he is not adamant about his professional historical judgment that Jesus Christ lived and walked the face of this Earth despite your blind denial and no proof to the contrary.
    again that's the professional opinion of legitimate authoritative scholarly sources, something you have proven beyond a shadow of doubt that you are not.
    and this is just nonsense that is totally irrelevant rhetoric that only expresses your denial with no evidence to the contrary.
    typical, every time you claim somebody said something and you don't quote it turns out your claim isn't true, ever notice that?
    let's see the quote prove up the claim.

    which doesn't mean we don't have enough to prove Jesus Christ existed, you just ignore the fact that we have evidence, in fact we have very good evidence, it doesn't need to be a stack of paperwork 10 ft high to make it true as you would purport
    well you've been proven to be wrong in most cases I would agree with that.
    doesn't matter what the claim is proof is proof it only takes one thing one statement one item of qualified evidence to justifiably prove something again it doesn't take a mountain or a stack of paperwork 10 ft high to prove something.
    Bullshit you know nothing about evidence to make such a nonsense claim
    But you did and I proved it at the top of this page, everyone can see you simply deny everything and disregard all the facts contrary to your politics.
    But you said you are an atheist and you argue that Flew is valid in the thread and that is a central element of the irrational neoatheist religion

    Here I am proving to you that I understand your FLew arguments
    Seems discussion honesty is vacuous in the other thread you post in as well as this one.
    YOu are when you advocate the neoatheist mantra as you have done for pages in the thread
    Been there done that bought a zillion t shirts, doesnt help them, they still run around in denial
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2021
  23. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    23,673
    Likes Received:
    1,771
    Trophy Points:
    113
    .
    while parts may be, to summarily make that claim as you and Bob are doing is 100% bullshit on its face since we have legitimate evidence JC did in fact walk the face of this earth and was crucified
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2021
  24. Jolly Penguin

    Jolly Penguin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2020
    Messages:
    8,210
    Likes Received:
    3,844
    Trophy Points:
    113
    No, I can't. I am not a crazy person. Can you? I don't think you can, but note how you dodged the question.

    You said that we choose to believe or not. I said it is not a choice for me. I asked if it is a choice for you. You respond by saying "you" (which could mean me personally or people generally) can. Now you clarify that you meant crazy people can choose to believe.... That doesn't answer the question. If you were very motivated to, could you bring yourself to do so? I can not. So I don't make any choice.

    If all you are saying is that crazy people can do it, that doesn't show that we all choose, which was your initial claim.

    No, it isn't. If you actually look into it, you will find that most such entries are written after the fact about what Christians believed at the time, rather than as actual first hand accounts of the Christ, his miracles, etc.

    I don't think you have read him. He has many caveats and makes the case that he can, while acknowledging full well that the opposite case is also quite plausible.

    More blind appeal to authoritu fallacy. If you had an argument, you could make it, regardless of where you got it from. Claiming others who are not present and whose arguments you don't show back up your empty claim doesn't get you anywhere.

    No evidence to the contrary is correct. You also can't prove I am not a computer program, that faeries don't live in your socks, or that the tooth fairy isn't real. So what? That doesn't mean these things exist.

    I gave you the quote, right beside what you just quoted from my post. Are you blind?

    Yes it does matter what the claim is. When it claimed that somebody walked on water and rose themselves from the dead, "one statement" is most definitely not enough. You are quite the fool if you think it is. Extraordinary claims do require extraordinary evidence.

    I am an atheist. And I also understand that you refuse to understand what I mean by that word and like to pretend I mean something else. That's your prerogative.

    No I didn't. We never got that far. All I did was point out you contradicting yourself, and point out that some people use different definitions of words than you do. Bickering over terminology is not an argument. There was never an actual argument in that thread.

    I very much doubt that based on what I have read so far from you, but maybe you have. But if you have, that doesn't make this case of you accusing me of being a liar in an attempt to take down "neo-atheism" (whatever that means to you) any less of an ad hominem fallacy.
     
  25. Jolly Penguin

    Jolly Penguin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2020
    Messages:
    8,210
    Likes Received:
    3,844
    Trophy Points:
    113
    We have better evidence that eagles have wings.

    And no, the Bible is not 100% fiction. Very few fictional works are. Spiderman comic books have a lot of factual information in them. New York is a real city. Bethlehem was a real town. That doesn't mean Spiderman is swinging through the skyline or that a guy named Yeshua was the Christ and rose from the dead.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2021
    Bob0627 likes this.

Share This Page