Part 39 of Post Your Tough Questions Regarding Christianity

giff is wrong and now you are wrong and two wrongs don't make it right especially when it's a giff and mirk doing the wrongs...lol

FYI when quoting Scripture it is proper to note the Bible from which the quote came from, that way it will ensure one is not adding/deleting words. It appears your 1 Kings 11:7 quote came from the NIV Bible and your 2 Kings 18:4 quote came from the NET but it also appears you added [Hezekiah] into the quote. But if you didn't please note what Bible the quote came from.

Below are all the pertinent verses from Scripture from three Bibles, the NLT, NET and NIV since they are what appears to be the Bibles we are getting our quotes from. I myself use the NLT Bible a lot but at other times I do use other Bibles.

We Read in Scripture:

Solomon Builds the Temple

3 So Solomon began to build the Temple of the Lord in Jerusalem on Mount Moriah, where the Lord had appeared to David, his father. The Temple was built on the threshing floor of Araunah[a] the Jebusite, the site that David had selected. 2 Chronicles 3:1 NLT

The Building of the Temple

3 Solomon began building the Lord’s temple in Jerusalem on Mount Moriah, where the Lord[a] had appeared to his father David. This was the place that David prepared at the threshing floor of Ornan the Jebusite. 2 Chronicles 3:1 NET

Solomon Builds the Temple

3 Then Solomon began to build the temple of the Lord in Jerusalem on Mount Moriah, where the Lord had appeared to his father David. It was on the threshing floor of Araunah[a] the Jebusite, the place provided by David. 2 Chronicles 3:1 NIV

7 On the Mount of Olives, east of Jerusalem,[a] he even built a pagan shrine for Chemosh, the detestable god of Moab, and another for Molech, the detestable god of the Ammonites. 1Kings 11:7 NLT

7 Furthermore,[a] on the hill east of Jerusalem Solomon built a high place[c] for the detestable Moabite god Chemosh[d] and for the detestable Ammonite god Milcom.[e] 1 Kings 11:7 NET

On a hill east of Jerusalem, Solomon built a high place for Chemosh the detestable god of Moab, and for Molek the detestable god of the Ammonites. 1 Kings 11:7 NIV

4 He removed the pagan shrines, smashed the sacred pillars, and cut down the Asherah poles. He broke up the bronze serpent that Moses had made, because the people of Israel had been offering sacrifices to it. The bronze serpent was called Nehushtan.[a] 2 Kings 18:4 NLT

4 He eliminated the high places, smashed the sacred pillars to bits, and cut down the Asherah pole.[a] He also demolished the bronze serpent that Moses had made, for up to that time the Israelites had been offering incense to it; it was called Nehushtan.[c] 2 Kings 18:4 NET

4 He removed the high places, smashed the sacred stones and cut down the Asherah poles. He broke into pieces the bronze snake Moses had made, for up to that time the Israelites had been burning incense to it. (It was called Nehushtan.[a]) 2 Kings 18:4 NIV

It is very clear from the verses above, King Solomon built only one Temple the Temple of the Lord in Jerusalem on Mount Moriah and he also built pagan shrines (high places). One for the pagan god Chemosh, the detestable god of Moab, and another for the pagan god Molech, the detestable god of the Ammonite.

I guess if you insist a shrine (high place) is the same as a Temple then I guess you would also insist that building a canoe is the same as building a war ship...lol

Lesson here is read Scripture very carefully that way it will help you to not misinterpret what you're reading. Helps if you have average to above average reading comprehension skills otherwise if not maybe taking a course to improve your reading comprehension is not out of the question. I've said it numerous of times before, the Holy Bible is not for the interpretation impaired.

Um....Oooops there it is!

 

Your skill at dodging and deflecting is noted and your unconditional surrender is accepted.

 

Lorl...sorry for laughing out real loud.

 

The fact that you're unable to provide a cogent or coherent response is proof that what I say is true. You just don't want to believe it.

Leviticus 16:29 “This is to be a permanent statute for you: In the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month you are to practice self-denial and do no work, both the native and the alien who resides among you. 16:30 Atonement will be made for you on this day to cleanse you, and you will be clean from all your sins before the Lord.

See? All my sins are cleansed before the Yahweh-Jesus-thing by an ordinary Joe who became High Priest after someone smeared oil on his head and made him a messiach, you know, a christ.

Are you calling Yahweh a liar? Because that's the same as calling Jesus a liar.

 

Jesus was confused. He says all you have to do is love everyone.

In Luke 18:18-22 he modifies that. If you committed adultery, you can't get into heaven, because you have comply with the 10 Commandments, plus you have to sell everything you have and give to the poor.

But, before that, in Luke 14:26-33 Jesus says that you have to hate your father and mother and your spouse and your children and your bothers and sisters and you have to hate yourself, plus you have to give up everything.

Then, in John 6:53-54 he says you have to do all that plus drink his blood and eat his flesh.

In Matthew 5:17-20, Jesus says you have to do all that plus your righteousness has to surpass that of the Pharisees or you will not get into heaven.

That would mean you have to comply with all 613 laws of the Mitzvot (which includes the 10 Commandments -- ie there are 613 Commandments.)

I like pork, but that's okay because my sins get cleansed every year on the Day of Atonement.

 

Sounds like you are essentially saying that the Bible and the God therein is bunk. And even were it true that I am "completely lost with regard to scripture", I am not lost to God. He has visited me in spirit, filled my heart with peace, filled my mind with his pure light, opened heaven to my eyes and stirred me to a remembrance of him in truth. I know he lives and that Jesus Christ is the savior of myself and mankind by their choice. By this revelation, followed by baptism and the gift of the Holy Ghost, he has conceived himself in me, and I am become reborn to a new beginning. I am the same me, but with a new cause. In a former post you told me that I had no clue what it means to be born again. But I have every clue. And it is in fact you who has no clue, belief or faith in these matters. Not that you're a bad person or not smart...just wrong. It's okay to be wrong.

 

This parable appears in all stories ... and is much misunderstood 1) Jesus does stress works - but doesn't say you have to sell everything.

What is said here .. the dude asks a question .. Jesus answers .. dude persists . "Well - if you want to be perfect" sell everything and follow me. Perfection however is not required. Question is .. so where is the bar ? "more righteous than the pharisees and law-givers" .. who Jesus hated .. so bar is rather low ... main rule .. don't do to others what you hate ..

"Blessed are the Poor in Spirit - For theirs is the Kingdom" -- So you is sittin Pretty according to Jah Rastafa

and does not refer to Jewish Law .. Jesus himself violated that .. The "Commands" and Jewish law are two separate things .. although the commands could be considered part of Jewish law .. Jewish Law is not part of the commands .. those given by El .. El Shaddai . El Elyon .The Supreme one .. which ain't YHWH ..

So gobble that swine .. and worry not .. and if you want to drink the Blood of a God .. eat his flesh .. I will not condemn you.

 

Why ye be tarring Jesus with the sins of YHWH ? LOOK here .. and listen

1) "The Father" - God of Abraham - is not YHWH so God of Jesus - is not YHWH

2) Jesus is not the Father. "My God My God -- why have you forsaken me" not of the same mind "Take this cup from my hand"

 

Another laughable joke of a post ... splitting hairs in desperate attempt to avoid the fact that Solomon Worshiped Pagan Gods ..

What difference does it make whether Solomon worshiped these other Gods at a temple .. or by sacrificing children at a religious shrine "High Place"

King Solomon was a big pagan .. didn't care that much for YHWH .. Temple or High place ..

 

I'm listening to x-tians who claim Jesus is Yahweh.

That's the whole Trinity nonsense.

If Yahweh is god and Jesus is god then that is polytheism.

As I have explained repeatedly ad nauseum, all civilizations, tribes, ethnic groups or whatever -- and that includes the Hebrews -- were polytheistic then evolved over centuries/millennia to henotheism, then evolved centuries later to monolatry -- which is not monotheism.

Those civilizations, tribes, ethnic groups included the Goths, Germans, Huns, Avars and all the others who had also progressed to monolatry and thus they flat out rejected the polytheistic Yahweh and Jesus abomination.

The Trinity was the only way to get those groups to drink the Kool-Aid®.

The issue is that x-tians must accept Yahweh as god, because the claim is that Jesus is the messiah because he fulfilled the prophecies in the Hebrew text and the prophesies are the infallible word of Yahweh god.

One cannot reject Yahweh without rejecting the prophecies by Yahweh.

There's also the illogical lies spewed by x-tians.

It is x-tians who claim Mary was impregnated by Yahweh, which means Jesus is the product of a god and human, thus Jesus can only be a demi-god and not a god.

Had the x-tians not lied, there wouldn't be a need for a Trinity, because there's nothing polytheistic about a god and a demi-god.

The other thorn in the side is that if the virgin birth is rejected, and the Protestant sects largely reject it, then that means Jesus was an ordinary human.

If dying and coming back to life makes one a god, then we all can look forward to being gods ourselves.

The god of Abram/Abraham was Ninurta (Sumerian), El Shaddai (Akkadian), Teshub (Hurrian) etc.

Abram/Abraham was born in the city of Ur as the Hebrew text clearly states. His father Terah was priest for Ninurta/El Shaddai, because that was the only temple in Ur, and for those who doubt, the city has been excavated and that is the only temple.

As I have stated repeatedly ad nauseum, Terah takes his son Abram/Abraham and his daughter Serai/Sarah (she had a different mother) and they go to the Hurrian city of Haran.

Well, duh! Haran is the cult center principle city for Teshub, which is Ninurta/El Shaddai in the Hurrian language.

Jesus is not anything, other than lover of dictatorships, slavery and keeping women in their place.

 

No .. the God of Abraham was not "Ninurta" - although there are resemblences between this God and YHWH .. so thanks for bringing it up.

Ninurta is the Son of the God of Abraham ( El - El Shaddai - Elyon - Enlil - Ellil ) Chief God of the Sumerian Pantheon .. "The Father" "Creator" the big cheese on earth until Marduk takes over .. after which EL -- is still the Most High .. but Most High "in the sky" .. Marduk taking the reigns on Earth.

So Marduk . and all these other Sons of the Gods ... (El had 70 .. as per proper reading of Deut 32:8 .. references on request) Nabu, YHWH Ninurta, Baal, Chemosh, and on and on .. battled it out for supremacy .. This is the story of the OT -- YHWH forever battling against the other "Sons of God" .. finally gaining supremacy (according to the writer of Psalm 82) which was around Solomon's time .. YHWH is winning and so of course he gains the position... https://www.scripture4all.org/OnlineInterlinear/OTpdf/psa82.pdf

Read the inside .. not the outside .. notice the proper name "EL" later on referred to as "The Supreme One"
We know this is not YHWH .. because YHWH is addressing the "Sons of the Supreme one"

"I say you are Gods .. all of you .. Children of the Supreme one .. but you shall die like men" and thus YHWH gains the title over the other Sons of God.

Pardon the long digression .. but we know it was El . just go to Encyclopedia Britannica "Abraham" .. That is the scholarly and archaeological and Historical consensus..

Now the God of Jesus .. is the same God .. God of Abraham .. God of the Cannanite Priest King of Jerusalem Melchizedek .. Zedek being the name of the patron God of Jerusalem .. Zedek and Jesus being one in the same .. or Jesus and Mechizedek .. depending on how one looks at things .. but either or.

That is where one needs start the journey .. at the beginning .. Who is this Cannanite Priest King of Jerusalem .. to whom Abraham Tilths .. and they make offerings to the same most high .. have the same God .. .. Things that should make you go .. hmmmm

and Yes .. Abe came from Ur .. Babylon .. and chief God of the Sumerian pantheon was ... ding ding .. you guessed it . Enlil .. EL the one who Isra - EL struggled with

 

Sorry mate but no, Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ the Son of God has never been confused. When one reads the Bible and interprets what they read incorrectly that's when the confusion comes in and so the one who misinterprets is really the one who is confused.

He did say to love everyone including one's enemies but He did not say that alone will get you eternal life if that's what you're implying nor did He say by loving everyone it was alright to have adulterous relationships or other kinky sinful sexual habits if that's another thing you're implying.

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

Teaching about Love for Enemies

43 “You have heard the law that says, ‘Love your neighbor’[a] and hate your enemy. 44 But I say, love your enemies! Pray for those who persecute you! 45 In that way, you will be acting as true children of your Father in heaven. For he gives his sunlight to both the evil and the good, and he sends rain on the just and the unjust alike. 46 If you love only those who love you, what reward is there for that? Even corrupt tax collectors do that much. 47 If you are kind only to your friends,[c] how are you different from anyone else? Even pagans do that. 48 But you are to be perfect, even as your Father in heaven is perfect. Matthew 5:43-48 NLT

Sorry mate by no, He did not modify anything...it's just you again misinterpreting.

First let me bring up that entire passage in Scripture of The Rich Man which is where those verses you cite comes from, then I will explain the meaning of the passage to help clear up your confusion/misinterpretation. Your confusion happens when you take verses out of context, you got to read the entire Chapter to see/understand the Biblical message the passage is conveying over to the reader.

We Read in Scripture:

The Rich Man

18 Once a religious leader asked Jesus this question: “Good Teacher, what should I do to inherit eternal life?”
19 “Why do you call me good?” Jesus asked him. “Only God is truly good. 20 But to answer your question, you know the commandments: ‘You must not commit adultery. You must not murder. You must not steal. You must not testify falsely. Honor your father and mother.’[a]”
21 The man replied, “I’ve obeyed all these commandments since I was young.”
22 When Jesus heard his answer, he said, “There is still one thing you haven’t done. Sell all your possessions and give the money to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
23 But when the man heard this he became very sad, for he was very rich.
24 When Jesus saw this, he said, “How hard it is for the rich to enter the Kingdom of God! 25 In fact, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the Kingdom of God!”
26 Those who heard this said, “Then who in the world can be saved?”
27 He replied, “What is impossible for people is possible with God.”
28 Peter said, “We’ve left our homes to follow you.”
29 “Yes,” Jesus replied, “and I assure you that everyone who has given up house or wife or brothers or parents or children, for the sake of the Kingdom of God, 30 will be repaid many times over in this life, and will have eternal life in the world to come.” Luke 18:18-30 NLT

So let me give you the correct interpretation here because yours is way off the mark.

When one reads the Gospels of the Holy Bible one will note that Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ uses a technique called hyperbole at times, which is a figure of speech that exaggerates for emphasis. But of course there will always be others who will not note this, these are the people who continually misinterpret Scripture.

When Our Lord said, “In fact, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the Kingdom of God!” (verse 25)

What did He mean in verse 25? Of course He didn't mean what He said literally in regards to the camel. So here He was using hyperbole.

And His message is clear, it is impossible for anyone to be saved on their own merits. Since wealth was seen as proof of God’s approval, it was commonly taught by the rabbis that rich people were blessed by God and were, therefore, the most likely candidates for heaven.

Our Lord destroyed that concept, and along with it, the idea that anyone can earn eternal life. Those who heard the Lord's statement had the appropriate response to His startling statement. They asked, “Then who in the world can be saved?” (verse 26) If the wealthy among them, which included the spiritual Pharisees and scribes, were unworthy of heaven, what hope was there for a poor man?

Our Lord's answer is the basis of the Gospel: “What is impossible for people is possible with God.” (verse 27)

We are saved through God’s gifts of grace, mercy, and faith.

We Read in Scripture:

8 God saved you by his grace when you believed. And you can’t take credit for this; it is a gift from God. 9 Salvation is not a reward for the good things we have done, so none of us can boast about it. Ephesians 2:8-9 NLT

Nothing we do earns salvation for us. It is the poor in spirit who inherit the kingdom of God, those who recognize their spiritual poverty and their utter inability to do anything to justify themselves to a holy God.

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

8 God blesses those whose hearts are pure, for they will see God. Matthew 5:8 NLT

The rich man so often is blind to his spiritual poverty because he is proud of his accomplishments and has contented himself with his wealth. He is as likely to humble himself before God as a camel is to crawl through the eye of a needle.

So mirc your interpretation as I've already said earlier is way off the mark.

So your statement, "If you committed adultery, you can't get into heaven, because you have comply with the 10 Commandments, plus you have to sell everything you have and give to the poor."

is...what else...a misinterpretation that is way off the mark, that is not the Biblical message that one should come away with. What I presented is the Biblical message.

 

This idea of "incorrectly" interpreting the Bible is the source of serious contention among Christians, obviously. If this weren't the case, the Christians would agree with each other - rather than have large numbers of disagreeing subdivisions.

So, I would say that claims by any one person that THEY are interpreting the Bible correctly while others are not is WEAK.

As for how we treat others, Jesus went WAY beyond saying we should love each other. He said we should be searching out those in prison, in poverty, in hospitals, etc., and helping those people. In fact, he stated that failure to do that would be punished by everlasting hell.

And, your comments on sex appear to me to be hard to support. Jesus didn't lay down rules on sex or specify how one could go to hell for breaking some rule about sex. And, we know that God richly rewarded the drunken sex Lot had with his daughters.

 

Sorry mirc but here is another misinterpretation of yours. You are missing the Biblical message here, which is way deeper than what you interpret it to be.

So once again let me bring up the passage you cite in Luke in its entirety which is titled "The Cost of Being a Disciple".

We Read in Scripture:

The Cost of Being a Disciple

25 A large crowd was following Jesus. He turned around and said to them, 26 “If you want to be my disciple, you must, by comparison, hate everyone else—your father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters—yes, even your own life. Otherwise, you cannot be my disciple. 27 And if you do not carry your own cross and follow me, you cannot be my disciple.
28 “But don’t begin until you count the cost. For who would begin construction of a building without first calculating the cost to see if there is enough money to finish it? 29 Otherwise, you might complete only the foundation before running out of money, and then everyone would laugh at you. 30 They would say, ‘There’s the person who started that building and couldn’t afford to finish it!’
31 “Or what king would go to war against another king without first sitting down with his counselors to discuss whether his army of 10,000 could defeat the 20,000 soldiers marching against him? 32 And if he can’t, he will send a delegation to discuss terms of peace while the enemy is still far away. 33 So you cannot become my disciple without giving up everything you own.
34 “Salt is good for seasoning. But if it loses its flavor, how do you make it salty again? 35 Flavorless salt is good neither for the soil nor for the manure pile. It is thrown away. Anyone with ears to hear should listen and understand!” Luke 14:25-35 NLT

In this passage Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ lays out the terms of being a disciple of His. The passage begins by a large crowd following Him. They followed Him because they loved the miracles, healing, and free food that Our Lord provided to them. But He knew their hearts, they desired the benefits of what He did rather than an understanding of who He was. They loved His gifts, not the life He was calling them to. And so He explained to them what it takes to be one of His disciples/followers. So verses 26 through 33 He lays out the terms of being a disciple/follower.

Our Lord put an end to the idea that He offered some kind of welfare program. Although the gift of eternal life is free to anyone who asks for it.

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

16 “For this is how God loved the world: He gave[a] his one and only Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life. John 3:16 NLT

The asking of this eternal life requires a transfer of ownership.

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

23 Then he said to the crowd, “If any of you wants to be my follower, you must give up your own way, take up your cross daily, and follow me. Luke 9:23 NLT

24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have nailed the passions and desires of their sinful nature to his cross and crucified them there. Galatians 5:24 NLT

“Count the cost” (verse 28 ) means recognizing and agreeing to some terms first. In following Our Lord, we cannot simply follow our own inclinations. We cannot follow Him and the sinful world’s way at the same time.

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

The Narrow Gate

13 “You can enter God’s Kingdom only through the narrow gate. The highway to hell[a] is broad, and its gate is wide for the many who choose that way. 14 But the gateway to life is very narrow and the road is difficult, and only a few ever find it. Matthew 7:13-14 NLT

Following Him may mean we lose relationships, dreams, material things, or even our lives. Those who are following Him simply for what they can get won’t stick around when the going gets tough. When God’s way conflicts with our way, we will feel betrayed by the shallow, me-first faith we have bought into. If we have not counted the cost of being His child, we will turn away at the threat of sacrifice and find something else to gratify our selfish desires.

We Read in Scripture:

15 The seed that fell on the footpath represents those who hear the message, only to have Satan come at once and take it away. 16 The seed on the rocky soil represents those who hear the message and immediately receive it with joy. 17 But since they don’t have deep roots, they don’t last long. They fall away as soon as they have problems or are persecuted for believing God’s word. Mark 4:15-17 NLT

In Our Lord's earthly ministry, there came a time when the free food stopped and public opinion turned ugly. The cheering crowds became jeering crowds. And Our Lord knew ahead of time that would happen.

Our Lord ended His description of the cost of discipleship with a breathtaking statement: "So you cannot become my disciple without giving up everything you own" (verse 33).

"Giving up everything" may mean we give up something physically, but more often it means we let go emotionally so that what we possess no longer possesses us. When we become one of His, we cannot continue to belong to this world.

We Read in Scripture:

Do Not Love This World

15 Do not love this world nor the things it offers you, for when you love the world, you do not have the love of the Father in you. 16 For the world offers only a craving for physical pleasure, a craving for everything we see, and pride in our achievements and possessions. These are not from the Father, but are from this world. 17 And this world is fading away, along with everything that people crave. But anyone who does what pleases God will live forever. 1 John 2:15-17 NLT

We must make a choice, for we cannot serve both God and Mammon.

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

24 “No one can serve two masters. For you will hate one and love the other; you will be devoted to one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and be enslaved to money. Matthew 6:24 NLT

The rich young ruler..."The Rich Man"...that we read about in Luke 18:18-25 when confronted with that choice, turned his back on Our Lord.

Many people approach Christianity the same way. They love the idea of eternal life, escaping hell, and having Our Lord at their beck and call. But they are not willing to leave the life they now live. Their desires, lifestyle, and sinful habits are too precious to them. Their lives may exhibit a token change...starting to attend church or giving up a major sin....but they want to retain ownership of everything else. Our Lord is speaking in Luke 14 to those with that mindset.

We cannot earn salvation by lifestyle change or any other good deed (Ephesians 2:8-9). But when we choose to follow Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ, we are releasing control of our lives. When Our Lord is in control, pure living results.

We Read in Scripture:

4 Everyone who sins is breaking God’s law, for all sin is contrary to the law of God. 5 And you know that Jesus came to take away our sins, and there is no sin in him. 6 Anyone who continues to live in him will not sin. But anyone who keeps on sinning does not know him or understand who he is.
7 Dear children, don’t let anyone deceive you about this: When people do what is right, it shows that they are righteous, even as Christ is righteous. 8 But when people keep on sinning, it shows that they belong to the devil, who has been sinning since the beginning. But the Son of God came to destroy the works of the devil. 9 Those who have been born into God’s family do not make a practice of sinning, because God’s life[a] is in them. So they can’t keep on sinning, because they are children of God. 10 So now we can tell who are children of God and who are children of the devil. Anyone who does not live righteously and does not love other believers does not belong to God. 1 John 3:4-10 NLT

17 This means that anyone who belongs to Christ has become a new person. The old life is gone; a new life has begun! 2 Corinthians 5:17 NLT

So If we are going to be disciples of Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ, we must first count the cost of following Him. It is a difficult task the gateway to life is very narrow and the road is difficult, and only a few ever find it (Narrow Gate, Matthew 7:13-14).

 

Not literally...that's why you're confused mate, just as those who Our Lord spoke to initially were confused. Here Our Lord is speaking metaphorically, not literally.
So let me bring up the passage titled "Jesus, the Bread of Life" where the verses you cite originate from in Scripture. Then as usual I will explain thoroughly the Biblical message of the passage after we read the entirety of the passage. But again I remind you, you can't take a verse/verses out of context, you must read the entire passage to get the Biblical message otherwise you are just going to misinterpret those few verses you focus on. Below I'm just going to present verses 22 through 71 of John 6 but one should read the entire chapter which starts with Our Lord feeding 5,000 people that way it will help you understand the entire chapter better.

We Read in Scripture:

Jesus, the Bread of Life

22 The next day the crowd that had stayed on the far shore saw that the disciples had taken the only boat, and they realized Jesus had not gone with them. 23 Several boats from Tiberias landed near the place where the Lord had blessed the bread and the people had eaten. 24 So when the crowd saw that neither Jesus nor his disciples were there, they got into the boats and went across to Capernaum to look for him. 25 They found him on the other side of the lake and asked, “Rabbi, when did you get here?”

26 Jesus replied, “I tell you the truth, you want to be with me because I fed you, not because you understood the miraculous signs. 27 But don’t be so concerned about perishable things like food. Spend your energy seeking the eternal life that the Son of Man[a] can give you. For God the Father has given me the seal of his approval.”

28 They replied, “We want to perform God’s works, too. What should we do?”

29 Jesus told them, “This is the only work God wants from you: Believe in the one he has sent.”

30 They answered, “Show us a miraculous sign if you want us to believe in you. What can you do? 31 After all, our ancestors ate manna while they journeyed through the wilderness! The Scriptures say, ‘Moses gave them bread from heaven to eat.’”

32 Jesus said, “I tell you the truth, Moses didn’t give you bread from heaven. My Father did. And now he offers you the true bread from heaven. 33 The true bread of God is the one who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world.”

34 “Sir,” they said, “give us that bread every day.”

35 Jesus replied, “I am the bread of life. Whoever comes to me will never be hungry again. Whoever believes in me will never be thirsty. 36 But you haven’t believed in me even though you have seen me. 37 However, those the Father has given me will come to me, and I will never reject them. 38 For I have come down from heaven to do the will of God who sent me, not to do my own will. 39 And this is the will of God, that I should not lose even one of all those he has given me, but that I should raise them up at the last day. 40 For it is my Father’s will that all who see his Son and believe in him should have eternal life. I will raise them up at the last day.”

41 Then the people[c] began to murmur in disagreement because he had said, “I am the bread that came down from heaven.” 42 They said, “Isn’t this Jesus, the son of Joseph? We know his father and mother. How can he say, ‘I came down from heaven’?”

43 But Jesus replied, “Stop complaining about what I said. 44 For no one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them to me, and at the last day I will raise them up. 45 As it is written in the Scriptures,[d] ‘They will all be taught by God.’ Everyone who listens to the Father and learns from him comes to me. 46 (Not that anyone has ever seen the Father; only I, who was sent from God, have seen him.)

47 “I tell you the truth, anyone who believes has eternal life. 48 Yes, I am the bread of life! 49 Your ancestors ate manna in the wilderness, but they all died. 50 Anyone who eats the bread from heaven, however, will never die. 51 I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Anyone who eats this bread will live forever; and this bread, which I will offer so the world may live, is my flesh.”

52 Then the people began arguing with each other about what he meant. “How can this man give us his flesh to eat?” they asked.

53 So Jesus said again, “I tell you the truth, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you cannot have eternal life within you. 54 But anyone who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise that person at the last day. 55 For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink. 56 Anyone who eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me, and I in him. 57 I live because of the living Father who sent me; in the same way, anyone who feeds on me will live because of me. 58 I am the true bread that came down from heaven. Anyone who eats this bread will not die as your ancestors did (even though they ate the manna) but will live forever.” 59 He said these things while he was teaching in the synagogue in Capernaum.

Many Disciples Desert Jesus

60 Many of his disciples said, “This is very hard to understand. How can anyone accept it?”

61 Jesus was aware that his disciples were complaining, so he said to them, “Does this offend you? 62 Then what will you think if you see the Son of Man ascend to heaven again? 63 The Spirit alone gives eternal life. Human effort accomplishes nothing. And the very words I have spoken to you are spirit and life. 64 But some of you do not believe me.” (For Jesus knew from the beginning which ones didn’t believe, and he knew who would betray him.) 65 Then he said, “That is why I said that people can’t come to me unless the Father gives them to me.”

66 At this point many of his disciples turned away and deserted him. 67 Then Jesus turned to the Twelve and asked, “Are you also going to leave?”

68 Simon Peter replied, “Lord, to whom would we go? You have the words that give eternal life. 69 We believe, and we know you are the Holy One of God.[a]”

70 Then Jesus said, “I chose the twelve of you, but one is a devil.” 71 He was speaking of Judas, son of Simon Iscariot, one of the Twelve, who would later betray him. John 6:22-71 NLT

After one reads the entire chapter of this passage in Scripture (including the 21 verses I left out) we find that many of Our Lord's followers stopped following Him that day after He said all those things while He was teaching in the synagogue in Capernaum.

Many of his disciples said, “This is very hard to understand. How can anyone accept it?” (verse 60)

At this point many of his disciples turned away and deserted him. (verse 66)

Our Lord's graphic language about eating His flesh and drinking His blood is no doubt very puzzling at first. We must consider everything in context of what Our Lord said and did in John 6 to help us understand what He is saying so that the meaning of His words becomes very clear.

When reading earlier in the chapter of John 6, we discover that Our Lord fed 5,000 people. The next day, people continued to follow Him...(why?)..for another free meal.
Our Lord pointed out their short-sightedness...they were only seeking physical bread, but there was something more important.

And what was it that was more important?

Our Lord told them don't be so concerned about perishable things like food. They should spend their energy seeking eternal life that He could give them.

So in other words He was telling them to turn their perspective away from physical sustenance to their true need which was spiritual.

"But don’t be so concerned about perishable things like food. Spend your energy seeking the eternal life that the Son of Man[a] can give you. For God the Father has given me the seal of his approval" (verse 27).

This contrast between physical food and spiritual food sets the stage for Our Lord's statement that we must eat His flesh and drink His blood. He explains that it is not physical bread that the world needs, but spiritual bread. Our Lord three times identifies Himself as that spiritual bread.

“I am the bread of life. Whoever comes to me will never be hungry again. Whoever believes in me will never be thirsty. (verse 35)

Yes, I am the bread of life! (verse 48 )

I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Anyone who eats this bread will live forever; and this bread, which I will offer so the world may live, is my flesh.” (verse 51)

And we see that twice He emphasizes faith...a spiritual action...as the key to salvation.

For it is my Father’s will that all who see his Son and believe in him should have eternal life. I will raise them up at the last day” (verse 40).

"I tell you the truth, anyone who believes has eternal life" (verse 47).

Our Lord then compares and contrasts Himself to the manna that Israel had eaten in the time of Moses:

"Your ancestors ate manna in the wilderness, but they all died. Anyone who eats the bread from heaven, however, will never die" (verses 49-50).

Like manna, Our Lord came down from heaven; and, like manna, Our Lord gives life. Unlike manna, the life Our Lord gives lasts for eternity.

"I am the true bread that came down from heaven. Anyone who eats this bread will not die as your ancestors did (even though they ate the manna) but will live forever" (verse 58 ).

So in this way, Our Lord is greater than Moses.

We Read in Scripture:

3 But Jesus deserves far more glory than Moses, just as a person who builds a house deserves more praise than the house itself. Hebrews 3:3 NLT

After Our Lord established His metaphor...and the fact that He is speaking of faith in Him...He then presses the symbolism further by saying:

"I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Anyone who eats this bread will live forever; and this bread, which I will offer so the world may live, is my flesh. “I tell you the truth, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you cannot have eternal life within you. But anyone who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise that person at the last day. For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink. Anyone who eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me, and I in him " (verses 51,53,54,55,56).

To prevent being misunderstood, Our Lord specifies that He has been speaking metaphorically:

"The Spirit alone gives eternal life. Human effort accomplishes nothing. And the very words I have spoken to you are spirit and life" (verse 63).

Those who misunderstood Our Lord and were offended by His talk about eating His flesh and drinking His blood were stuck in a physical mindset, ignoring the things of the Spirit. They were concerned with getting another physical meal, so Our Lord uses the realm of the physical to teach a vital spiritual truth.

Those who couldn’t make the jump from the physical to the spiritual turned their backs on Our Lord and walked away:

At this point many of his disciples turned away and deserted him (verse 66).

At the Last Supper, Our Lord gives a similar message and one that complements His words in John 6—when the disciples gather to break bread and drink the cup, they are announcing the Lord's death until He comes again.

We Read in Scripture:

26 For every time you eat this bread and drink this cup, you are announcing the Lord’s death until he comes again. 1 Corinthians 11:26 NLT

In fact, Our Lord said that the bread broken at the table is His body, and the cup they drink is the new covenant in His blood, shed for the forgiveness of sins.

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

26 As they were eating, Jesus took some bread and blessed it. Then he broke it in pieces and gave it to the disciples, saying, “Take this and eat it, for this is my body.”
27 And he took a cup of wine and gave thanks to God for it. He gave it to them and said, “Each of you drink from it, 28 for this is my blood, which confirms the covenant[a] between God and his people. It is poured out as a sacrifice to forgive the sins of many. Matthew 26:26-28 NLT

Their act of eating and drinking was to be a symbol of their faith in Our Lord. Just as physical food gives earthly life, Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ's sacrifice on the cross gives heavenly life.

Some people believe that the bread and wine of communion are somehow transformed into Our Lord's actual flesh and blood, or that Our Lord somehow imbues these substances with His real presence. These ideas, called transubstantiation (professed by the Catholic and Orthodox churches) and consubstantiation (held by Lutherans), ignore Our Lord's statement:

"The Spirit alone gives eternal life. Human effort accomplishes nothing. And the very words I have spoken to you are spirit and life" (verse 63).

The majority of Protestants understand that Our Lord was speaking metaphorically about His flesh and blood and hold that the bread and wine are symbolic of the spiritual bond created with Him through faith.

When Our Lord said:

“I tell you the truth, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you cannot have eternal life within you" (verse 53).

He spoke, as He often did, in parabolic terms. We must receive Him by faith.

We Read in Scripture:

12 But to all who believed him and accepted him, he gave the right to become children of God. John 1:12 NLT

We understand that we need physical food and drink; Our Lord wants us to understand that we also need spiritual food and drink...and that is what His sacrifice provides.

Although physical blood sustains physical life, Our Lord's lifeblood is the only blood that provides eternal life, through His crucifixion and resurrection.

So mirc I hope everything I presented here clears your confusion up and thanks for your post, it was a pleasure for me to respond to it very thoroughly.

 

Wasn't Judas related to the Jesus character? After all, Jesus said that a man's enemies will be those of his own household (Matthew 10:36).

And then in Matthew 19:28-30, Jesus tells the twelve, including Judas, that they will sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. (Notice that he doesn't mention anything about Gentiles).

 

He doesn't say that. How are the uneducated or less-intelligent supposed to know that, or was Jesus just preaching to the intellectuals?

Jesus condemned everyone in Capernaum to Hell.

Yes, I'm sure it was quite orgasmic for you.

Which is your first clue that religion and god-things were invented by men for men.

 

Then, by your own admission and actions, you are not a disciple.

 

Yes, he has. He isn't sure which day he was actually crucified.

You missed the whole point, which is Jesus obfuscates and never gives a direct answer to any of the questions he was asked about how one gets eternal life.

 

The Bible tells how gods are created =https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=wisdom+14:1-31&version=CEB

Pay special attention to verses 15 & 16 =
"15 Imagine a father overcome with grief at the untimely death of his child. In his grief, he makes an image of the child. The person who was once a corpse he now honors as a god. He passes it on to those under his authority, along with certain mysteries and special ceremonies.16 As time goes by, his godless custom becomes tradition. Eventually, his custom becomes law, and rulers order the people to worship these carved images."

Apply that passage to the Jesus character.

 

If you're referring to the Judas who betrayed Our Lord then no, he wasn't related to Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ.

In the New Testament there are several other Judas mentioned, the name Judas was a very common name in that era. There was another disciple named Judas, and Our Lord's own half-brother was also named Judas but to differentiate from Our Lord's betrayer Judas, the betrayer Judas is referred to as "Judas, son of Simon Iscariot".

We Read in Scripture:

22 Judas (not Judas Iscariot, but the other disciple with that name) said to him, “Lord, why are you going to reveal yourself only to us and not to the world at large?” John 14:22 NLT

3 Then they scoffed, “He’s just a carpenter, the son of Mary[a] and the brother of James, Joseph, Judas, and Simon. And his sisters live right here among us.” They were deeply offended and refused to believe in him. Mark 6:3 NLT

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

70 Then Jesus said, “I chose the twelve of you, but one is a devil.” 71 He was speaking of Judas, son of Simon Iscariot, one of the Twelve, who would later betray him. John 6:70-71 NLT

Sorry gawd but you're misinterpreting again.

So let me give you the right interpretation. Since your interpretation is way off the mark by you thinking this verse 36 of Matthew 10 must be an affirmation that Judas the betrayer Iscariot was related to Our Lord.

Let me first bring up that verse you cite along with the two previous verses in Matthew 10. And btw Our Lord did not say, "A man's enemies will be those of his own household" but He did say, "Your enemies will be right in your own household". And so obviously Our Lord wasn't referring to His own enemies in His own household but He was referring to His disciples/followers enemies in their own households.

So be careful how you read Scripture gawd, when you're not careful that's what causes you to misinterpret.

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

34 “Don’t imagine that I came to bring peace to the earth! I came not to bring peace, but a sword. 35 ‘I have come to set a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law. 36 Your enemies will be right in your own household!’[a] Matthew 10:34-36 NLT

So these 3 verses I presented above describes Our Lord telling His disciples that He came not to bring peace to the world, but a sword. Now this "sword" is not to be mistaken to be literal. In fact when the disciple Peter took up a sword to defend Our Lord in the Garden of Gethsemane, Our Lord rebuked him and told him to put away his sword, for all who draw the sword will die by the sword.

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

52 “Put away your sword,” Jesus told him. “Those who use the sword will die by the sword. Matthew 26:52 NLT

So why then did Our Lord say:

“Don’t imagine that I came to bring peace to the earth! I came not to bring peace, but a sword (verse 34).

And what kind of sword did He come to bring?

Among the names of Jesus Christ is that of Prince of Peace.

We Read in Scripture:

6 For a child is born to us, a son is given to us. The government will rest on his shoulders. And he will be called: Wonderful Counselor,[a] Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. Isaiah 9:6 NLT

14 “Glory to God in highest heaven, and peace on earth to those with whom God is pleased.” Luke 2:14 NLT

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

27 “I am leaving you with a gift—peace of mind and heart. And the peace I give is a gift the world cannot give. So don’t be troubled or afraid. John 14:27 NLT

Such verses as Isaiah 9:6, Luke 2:14, and John 14:27 I presented above make it clear that Our Lord came to bring peace, but that peace is between the believer and God.
Those who reject God and the only way of salvation through Our Lord will find themselves at war with God.

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

6 Jesus told him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one can come to the Father except through me. John 14:6 NLT

But those who come to Him in repentance will find themselves at peace with God. Because of Our Lord's sacrifice, we are restored to a relationship of peace with God.

We Read in Scripture:

Faith Brings Joy

5 Therefore, since we have been made right in God’s sight by faith, we have peace[a] with God because of what Jesus Christ our Lord has done for us. Romans 5:1 NLT

Inevitably there will still be conflict between good and evil, Our Lord the Christ and the antichrist, the light and the darkness, the children of God (believers) and the children of the devil (unbelievers who refuse/reject Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ).

Conflict must arise between the two groups, and this can and does happen within a family in which some are believers and others are not. We should seek to be at peace with all men but should never forget that Our Lord warned we will be hated for His sake. Because those who reject Him hate Him, they will hate His followers as well.

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

The World’s Hatred

18 “If the world hates you, remember that it hated me first. John 15:18 NLT

In Matthew 10:34–36, Our Lord said He had come at this time not to bring peace to the earth, but a sword, a weapon which divides and severs. As a result of His visit to the earth, some children would be set against parents and a man’s enemies might be those within their own household. This is because many who choose to follow Our Lord are hated by their family members. This may be part of the cost of discipleship, for love of family should not be greater than love for the Lord.

A true disciple must take up his cross and follow Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ.

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

24 Then Jesus said to his disciples, “If any of you wants to be my follower, you must give up your own way, take up your cross, and follow me. Matthew 16:24 NLT

They must be willing to face not only family hatred, but also death, like a criminal carrying his cross to his own execution. True followers of Our Lord must be willing to give up, even to the point of “hating” all that is in our lives, even our own families, if we are to be worthy of Him.

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

37 “If you love your father or mother more than you love me, you are not worthy of being mine; or if you love your son or daughter more than me, you are not worthy of being mine. 38 If you refuse to take up your cross and follow me, you are not worthy of being mine. 39 If you cling to your life, you will lose it; but if you give up your life for me, you will find it. Matthew 10:37-39 NLT

In so doing, we find our lives in return for having given them up to Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ.

Yes, you're right gawd, Matthew 19:28-30 doesn't mention anything about Gentiles. However notice the verses below that I furnished. Our Lord told His disciples to make disciples of all nations. All nations means all peoples, in other words Jews and Gentiles alike. See after the word "nations" there is a footnote [a], well this footnote is denoting "Or all peoples".

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

18 Jesus came and told his disciples, “I have been given all authority in heaven and on earth. 19 Therefore, go and make disciples of all the nations,[a] baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. 20 Teach these new disciples to obey all the commands I have given you. And be sure of this: I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” Matthew 28:18-20 NLT

Read full chapter
Footnotes
a. 28:19 Or all peoples.

Ok gawd thanks for your post, it was a pleasure for me to respond to it and I hope you learned a thing or two....or three...lol

 

As you pointed out, Simon was one of Jesus's brothers. The word "Iscariot " could have meant "the Wimp" or the "Dirty One". Put on your thinking cap. Why is Judas and Simon the only characters in the Bible with two names? Why didn't Jacob, Moses, Jeremiah, Jesus, Peter, Matthew, Paul, or any of the other characters have surnames?

You might read scripture but it is obvious that you never analyze any of it. Remember how one of the Joseph's is described?

 

Huh? I'm not quite following you...are you trying now to claim Our Lord's own half-brother Simon was Our Lord's enemy from within His own household? First it was Judas Iscariot, now are you saying it's Simon?...c'mon gawd you're being inconsistent if that's what you're saying now. And no, the word "Iscariot" definitely didn't mean "the Wimp" or the "Dirty One".

FYI Judas Iscariot’s name was given to him to designate his native place, Carioth, or Kerioth, a small town in the tribe of Judah.

Yes gawd put on your thinking cap. Don't forget unbelievers like yourself are in peril of facing eternal punishment for your sins so I sincerely advise you to put that thinking cap of yours on. Our time here on God's green earth is temporal but our after-life is eternal.

There are others with two names besides Judas and Simon which makes your statement false. I could give you 2 names right now to prove your statement false..."Jesus Christ".

Boy gawd, how could you have made that blunder?

First of all, it's true that people in the Bible really didn't have last names like we think of last names in today's world. They frequently went by something similar to "Simon, son of John".

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

17 Jesus replied, “You are blessed, Simon son of John,[a] because my Father in heaven has revealed this to you. You did not learn this from any human being. Matthew 16:17 NLT

Read full chapter
Footnotes
a. 16:17 Greek Simon bar-Jonah; see John 1:42; 21:15-17

The phrase “son of John” identified Simon as a different Simon than all the other Simons by this family connection. This functioned very close to a last name. Today, our last names use the same distinction. John Carpenter identifies John as a part of the Carpenter family.

Then sometimes a person was identified by their tribe, such as "Aaron, the Levite", which differentiated that particular Aaron from the Aarons in other tribes.

We Read in Scripture:

14 Then the Lord became angry with Moses. “All right,” he said. “What about your brother, Aaron the Levite? I know he speaks well. And look! He is on his way to meet you now. He will be delighted to see you. Exodus 4:14 NLT

In this same way, Our Lord was called Jesus of Nazareth to indicate His hometown.

We Read in Scripture:

71 Later, out by the gate, another servant girl noticed him and said to those standing around, “This man was with Jesus of Nazareth.[a]” Matthew 26:7 NLT

Read full chapter
Footnotes
a. 26:71 Or Jesus the Nazarene.

Then we have others in Biblical times who used their occupations as a functional last name, such as "Simon the tanner". “Tanner” wasn’t his last name, but a way to distinguish him from other Simons in the area who had a different occupation.

We Read in Scripture:

6 He is staying with Simon, a tanner who lives near the seashore.” Acts 10:6 NLT

Then we have Matthew, one of the Twelve Disciples and author of the gospel bearing his name, refers to himself as “Matthew the tax-collector”, which reveals not only his occupation, but the astounding fact that even someone as lowly and despised as a tax collector could be chosen by Our Lord to become His follower.

We Read in Scripture:

3 Philip,
Bartholomew,
Thomas,
Matthew (the tax collector),
James (son of Alphaeus),
Thaddaeus,[a] Matthew 10:3 NLT

We sometimes think the name “Jesus Christ” refers to His first and last names. But it really means “Jesus, who is the Christ, the Messiah.” Originally, the title took the form of “Jesus, the Christ,” but it has become common usage to shorten His name to Jesus Christ. This holy name means “Jesus, the Christ who is the Messiah, the anointed one who saves His people from their sins.”

Yes, I read Scripture and I interpret Scripture correctly that's why I'm a Christian, a follower of Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ. But as for you and most other unbelievers, you might read Scripture but the problem y'all have is that you misinterpret it, you never analyze any of it without setting aside your biases, your real motivations/intentions are to discredit the Holy Bible.

I guess that's your way of feeling comfortable if you believe you have discredited the Holy Bible, makes you believe that you're on the right side of the faith totem pole. But the reality is none of you have really discredited the Holy Bible, after all the Holy Bible is the inerrant, infallible Word of God!

Well ok gawd, thanks for your post and it was a pleasure for me to respond to it.

 

Good try, Matt, but you missed the ark again.

The Jesus character didn't get the name until about 1631 AD. It is an alias. And the word christ is a title, not a name.

As usual, one of the Bible writers' favorite hobbies was changing the characters' names to add to the confusion factor. The passage about a man's enemies being those of his own household (Matthew 10:34-36) is clearly included to set the stage for Judas, Jesus's nephew by Simon, to betray Jesus in the future.

The writers added the word Iscariot next to Simon and Judas in order to throw of the listener/reader of the fairy tale. If it was otherwise they would have used completely different names, like they did for the minor characters.

BTW, do you know how many Simons there are in the Bible?