Buffalo shooting: Ten dead in attack at New York state supermarket

I'm not the posting hilarious falsehoods. Where did you come up with this, for instance?

"The LAST thing I want is some asinine hero wannabe blazing away at all and sundry and setting up a crossfire that everybody gets killed in."

So you don't want a bad guy getting shot by a good guy. You cannot presume to know how every criminal shooting is going down. You don't even understand the police become involved. Do you have any idea how many times a good guy got involved and something went wrong vs when things went well? Cuz I don't think you have any idea. That's not an insult, that's how your conversations stay on these topics.

 

You just keep making assumptions.

There are steps that can be taken to reduce this problem of feeding weapons to criminals.

They include methods of making gun owners more responsible for the uses their guns are put to, making guns less useful to other than their owner, better tracking gun sales, actually requiring background checks, doing real policing of gun shops, etc., etc.

All these allow you to own the lethal weapon you seem to think is required for you to survive, while reducing the number who are killed by these weapons.

 

As usual, we're concerned with the tool used to kill people, not the larger issue of why they kill. The truth is that we will NEVER end killing and violence by passing more strict laws. This is no legal solution here, there is only a spiritual/moral solution.

This morning I listened to an interview of a black pastor who leads missions and congregation in both Rochester where I live and in Buffalo where I once lived. One comment he made really struck a chord with me. He said "what is wrong with a family where a child can collect an armory of firearms in his bedroom with no one knowing or intervening?" There is something very wrong spiritually there." I would also ask what is wrong with a community that gets as many signs of mental instability as the town of Conklin got and still not intervene.

It is a truism that when a society loses it's moral foundations there is no amount of government in the world that would be able to maintain a safe civil society. America is there and needs a strong moral revival.

 

I don't agree with the predicate here.

We absolutely CAN do something about this problem.

I'm supportive of all directions. If someone can convert everyone to a pacifist religion, or whatever, then GREAT.

But, we CAN address this problem directly.

 

Remember. I'm supportive of attempts to turn America peaceful, regardless of the overall futility of that.

But, suggesting there is nothing else to do is ridiculous.

 

You'll keep failing until there's a complete collapse of our society.

 

good news. We’re already doing all of those things except making the gun less useless to anyone but the owner. I’m not sure how anyone could manage that. Gun owners are already legally responsible for their weapons. Everything you said is already in place.
Now we’re still here. Right where we were.

 

Well, of course that's possible.

But, I'm not going to restrict my actions to kumbaya.

There is more than one possible direction, and the issue is important enough to take all possible approaches.

 

@The Scotsman

Let's do this again.

Here's the murderer....a Neo-Nazi:



And he's a big fan of Ukraine's Nazis

 

You're just sadly uninformed.

For just one example, federal law depends on the NICS which is not a robust screening as it is a limited database. Further, there is the Charleston loophole. Beyond that, many states do not require background checks for sales by those not licensed as gun vendors.

 

Firearms keep you alive.

 

The gun people buy for self defence is more likely to be used on the owner or friend/relative of the owner than on an intruder or other threat

 

Not so. In addition, firearms most often don't have to be actually used to prevent crime. Letting someone who is threatening you know you have a gun and are willing to use it is enough to neutralize a threat.

 

If you take his manifesto at face value. He admitted as such.

I guess we could also say it is a false flag against conservatives like y’all think everything else is when a right winger loses it.

 

...yeah we have them to....so...?

 

That’s debatable. It depends on what number you plug into the equation to represent defensive use. If you use the very lowest estimates of defensive gun use it’s about equal. Around 100,000 each of defensive and injurious (intentional and unintentional) episodes. If one were to take the defensive uses out of the tally of total injurious data that would push things towards the more defensive use side. When the CDC studied the issue they came up with around 2,000,000 defensive uses. As I said, it’s debatable. We really don’t know what the number of defensive uses is so we can’t know if firearms are more likely to be used defensively or not. Most likely they are used more defensively based on available data.


But none of that is really relevant to my point. I’m taking into account the effect firearms have on food production, funding of nationwide outdoor recreational opportunities, national defense, geopolitical reductions in violent conflict, etc.

 

Law abiding people aren't active shooters.

 

Semantic quibbling. If you're shot by an "law-abiding person" you're still dead.

 

No doubt. Firearms properly wielded by trained and authorized people. Otherwise they threaten our lives and our rights

 

If you're shot, it won't be by a "law abiding citizen"...lol. If you are shot by a law abiding citizen, you are a criminal and had it coming.

 

People like this?
https://www.vox.com/platform/amp/2015/5/23/8649675/timothy-russell-malissa-williams-police-shooting

 

Exactly.

Time after time we see the most trained users of guns in public kill people with NO justification, NO conviction and NO commitment to a total overhaul of training.

As if that isn't absolutely horrendous enough, I'm supposed to be happy when people with ZERO training of ANY KIND buy multiple guns each and carry them into the public.

 

In case you haven't heard, mankind is not perfect. Out of 6 billion people, there will always be those who are psychotic while nothing can change or stop the small percentage of psychotic people who lash out and commit heinous crimes. It is not a race thing, but a psychological issue. Now, people who are sheep to the mass media machine will create mass paranoia blaming anything or everything for the causes of those psychotic peoples actions. Everyone is a king of their own minds and think they are right. I am sure you think you are right and think you have a higher morality regarding these situations blaming one race over another race. In reality, it is not race, but an individuals psychosis propagated by mass media.

 

Would you like to post some stories like that involving concealed carry permit holders or other lawful carriers?

 

This is as close as I can get…

https://www.npr.org/2020/05/06/8516...vestigate-the-killing-of-an-unarmed-black-man