Uvalde shooting investigation focuses on police response

The chief’s decision — and the officers’ apparent willingness to follow his directives against established active-shooter protocols — prompted questions about whether more lives were lost because officers did not act faster to stop the gunman, and who should be held responsible.​

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/uvalde-shooting-investigation-focuses-on-police-response

Nineteen well-trained good guys with a gun were not able to stop ONE bad guy with a gun.

And there were even those who thought that teachers would be able to do what professional trained police haven't been able to do.

So that's the end of those narratives...

The officers who responded to this emergency are taking all the heat. But the investigation is just starting. So we need to wait and see the results.

I wouldn't be so quick to point a finger at the police. Sure... they made huge mistakes. However, I think it's more profound than that. I just think that there are too many possible scenarios in which it's just not possible for armed cops to stop a shooter. And, of course, the protocol will change. But will it be better? I mean, what if in the future 19 cops storm a classroom only to get MORE kids (and most of the cops themselves) killed.

There is no clear answer. The only clear answer is to make it harder for the shooter. A cop should not even have to be asked to confront this type of armament. They will be asked, of course, no matter what. But we CAN reduce the number of instances.

 

They waited 45 minutes to breach the room while children were bleeding out.
So its either cowardice or incompetence.
But thats what you get when you push to defund and prosecute cops.

 

He represents about the same thinking as about 5% of extreme leftist ideology.
Which is the very same lack of thinking that brought us these 18 and 19 year old mentally deficient killers

Every kid gets a trophy
Never spank a child
Remove corporal punishment in schools
Teach 5 year olds trans and gay sexuality issues
Introduce kindergarteners to Trans story time
Defund the police
Support 576 riots killing Americans and teach your kids to do the same thing
Tear down every statue you don't like to defend your wokeism
Get rid of the 2nd amendment
Promote open borders and the drugs and gangbangers that provides
And if you against any of it your a fascist.

That about sums it up

 

40% of Uvalde's annual budget is spent on police...there was no 'defunding' there.

 

Wait and see the Results ? ! -
Isn't that what a herd of Yellow Pigs in white hats did ?

They waited & while they waited - they busied themselves arresting, cuffing, tasing
and beating up,tthe frantic Parents of the Children who were - at that time - being
.................... Murdered - making desperate 911 calls - being shot and Bleeding Out

.......

A town of 1600 has to assign 40% of its Budget to these useless Yellow Swine ?
.......... WHAT IS THE MATTER WITH YOU PEOPLE?

Texas Cops Didn't Rush To Find Gunman Because :
.....as one white hat explained .... "they could have been shot"
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ys-Uvalde-officers-retreated-gunman-shot.html


Law Enforcement's Attempt To Cover Its Own Ass
In The Robb Elementary Tragedy Is Unforgivable
https://www.esquire.com/news-politi...blic-safety-robb-elementary-press-conference/

 

Can you tell us what percent of a towns budget would have made these officers do anything to protect the children? Maybe 60%?

If these officers were given complete immunity from all laws and speaking ill of them was a felony would that have done it?

So all we need to do is bootlick harder and they will stop killing innocent people and actually serve and protect? Right? I never knew Texas was such an anti-cop state.

 

You and your ilk love nothing more than to accuse cops every time they are involved in a shooting.
Any time there is anyone involved that is a minority the left goes on their rants about racist cops murdering minorities.
So don't even think for a second you can come on here and dispute it.

 

Yes! But we're not trained cops. WE can wait. Not sure that kids in schools can wait until the next shooting occurs, though.

Point is that there will always be ... something (incompetence, cowardice, lack of information, lack of training... something)... that impedes this mythical "good guy with a gun" from stopping the bad guy from killing people.

And it's for THAT reason that preventing (reducing the number of instances and/or the number of dead) starts with limiting access to guns.

This is not the first time. There were people with guns at Virginia Tech. A "good guy with a gun" would never have stopped the Colorado shooting....

A peer-reviewed study published in JAMA found that the rate of death in schools with an armed guard was almost 3 times higher than in those without an armed guard.
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2776515

It's obvious that a good guy (or 19) with a gun, is of very little help to stop a bad guy with a gun.

 

Yet you call police (with a gun) to handle an active shooter?

Heres some more mythical good guys with guns stopping bad guys with guns

August 2019
Bryan Whittle and Juan Carlos Nazario pulled their firearm and was holding the man at gun point and stopped a Walmart shooter

Jonathan Morales, the armed citizen who took out the synagogue shooter in Poway, Calif

Schlenker Automotive in Rockledge, Fla where Don Smith and Nathan Taylor returned fire, wounded the shooter, and held him at gunpoint until the police arrived.

FBI reveals how many active shooters were stopped by citizens
The FBI announced on May 27, 2022, that citizens stopped six active shooters in 2021
https://www.bizpacreview.com/2022/0...ve-shooters-were-stopped-by-citizens-1243098/

69 mass shootings have been stopped by armed civilians
At least 69 mass shootings have been stopped by armed civilians since 1990, data collected by the Crime Prevention Research Center shows. This flies in the face of the media (examples here, here, and here) arguing mass shootings are caused by lack of gun control. The truth is, armed civilians stop mass shootings regularly
https://www.one-armed-man.com/2021/04/69-mass-shootings-have-been-stopped-by-armed-civilians/

Heres some more of those Mythical good guy with a gun stops a bad guy

1. November 2017– A man started firing in a parking lot of a crowded auto repair shop in Rockledge, FL killing one and paralyzing another. Two of the employees had concealed carry permits and fought back, shooting and injuring the attacker and preventing any more damage.

2. November 2017– An off-duty Kansas City police captain shot an armed man in a local Costco when he announced “I’m an off-duty U.S. Marshal, I’m here to kill people”. The off-duty cop told him to drop the gun and not to move. When the gunman aimed his pistol at the officer, he shot him. No other injuries were reported.

3. September 2017– A masked man entered a Nashville church and shot 7 people, killing one. A church usher was able to run to his car, grab a handgun and confront the shooter, saving untold lives.

4. May 2017– A man entered a bar in Arlington, TX yelling incoherently and began shooting, killing one. A customer with a concealed carry handgun engaged the shooter and prevented further injuries or deaths. There were more than a dozen customers in the bar, plus employees.

5. June 2016– A man began shooting outside a bar in Lyman, South Carolina. He shot 3 people before a fourth with a concealed weapons permit fired back, preventing more bloodshed.

6. July 2015– A Cincinnati man fired at 4 people, including a 1-year-old boy. One of the victims had a concealed weapons permit and shot back, hitting the attacker in the leg. No one died.

7. May 2015– In New Holland, SC a man pulled into a crowded fire department parking lot filled with children and firefighters and began firing into the air and pointing the gun at people. Two firefighters with concealed carry permits confronted the shooter and got him to put down his weapon. While no one was injured, this likely prevented a mass shooting.

8. April 2015– An Uber Driver with a concealed carry permit shot and injured a man firing a pistol into a group of people on a Logan Square sidewalk in Chicago.

9. March 2015– Police say a man likely saved the lives of several people when he shot and killed a gunman inside a West Philadelphia barbershop. During an argument, the man pulled out a gun and began shooting customers and barbers, there were even kids inside. Another man who had a legal weapons permit heard the shots from outside, rushed in and killed the shooter, likely saving lives.

10. July 2014– A psychiatric patient opened fire at a Pennsylvania hospital, killing one case worker. A doctor with a concealed weapons permit fired back and hit the shooter three times, allowing hospital personnel to tackle and subdue him. The police chief said “without a doubt, I believe the doctor saved lives. Without that firearm, [the shooter] could have went out in the hallway and just walked down the offices until he ran out of ammunition,”

11. July 2014– A military service member with a concealed carry permit shot and injured a man who fired at and threatened a group of four people outside a party in Chicago.

12. January 2014– After being turned away from a Portland strip club, a man returned with a gun and shot and critically injured the bouncer and proceeded to enter the club. Another bouncer with a concealed carry permit shot the attacker. There were 30 people inside.

13. December 2012– A man with a stolen AR-15 rifle entered the Clackamas Mall in Oregon and began shooting, killing 2 and critically injuring a third. Another man with a concealed carry permit confronted the shooter but didn’t fire because he feared he might shoot innocent bystanders. However, he claims the shooter saw him and this likely stopped the shooting spree, as he then ran into a stairwell and the next bullet the gunman fired was to kill himself. It’s debatable whether this mass shooting was stopped by this action, but there is evidence to support it.

14. April 2012– A man chased and shot at multiple church members in a church parking lot in Aurora, CO, killing one. An off-duty police officer happened to be there and shot the gunman, stopping the attack.

15. March 2012– A man kicked in and entered a side door in a Spartanburg, SC church with a shotgun and pointed it at the pastor and congregation. Another church member, a concealed weapon holder, acted quickly to subdue the attacker. No one was injured.

16. May 2009– During a birthday party two masked gunmen broke into an apartment in College Park, GA filled with 11 people. They separated the men from women, stole their wallets and cell phones, then proceeded to attempt to rape the women, mentioning they would kill them afterwards. One of the victims managed to grab his bag with a gun in it, then shot and chased off the attackers. The resident of the apartment said if not for the intervention, all the party goers would likely have been killed.

17. May 2008– A man entered a crowded bar near Reno, NV and fatally shot two brothers, as well as injuring others. When stopping to reload, another patron with a concealed weapons permit shot and killed him.

18. December 2007– After killing two at one Colorado church, a gunman drove to the New Life Church in Colorado Springs and began shooting members leaving a Sunday service. As the gunman entered the church, a woman stepped out from a doorway, confronted the gunman and then fired 10 shots from 63 feet away, hitting the attacker once in the wrist and twice in a leg. He died in the hallway, barely 40 feet from where he entered.

19. February 2007– A man with a shotgun and backpack full of ammunition opened fire at Trolley Square in Salt Lake City, killing 5 and wounding 4. The shooter was quickly and soundly stopped by the Salt Lake City SWAT, but not before an off-duty police officer with a gun had cornered him and engaged in a gun battle, preventing untold deaths to others.

20. January 2002– A distressed student facing suspension entered the campus of Appalachian School of Law and killed three people, including the dean, and injured three others. He was stopped and wrestled to the ground by three students who were trained police officers. One of which ran to his car to get his service pistol before confronting the attacker.

21. July 1999– After a man rented a semi-automatic rifle at a gun club, he held three employees hostage and threatened to kill them. One had a concealed handgun and shot the gunman. While he only directly threatened three people (not technically a mass shooting), his suicide note detailed his desire to take many other lives, so this likely prevented that.

22. April 1998– A middle school student took his father’s handgun and went to his middle school dance. He shot and killed one teacher and wounded 3 others. The owner of the dance hall grabbed his shotgun after hearing the shots and confronted and disarmed the shooter outside. It’s debatable whether or not this prevented any more deaths, as the student had stopped shooting, but he was still armed and capable to shoot more people.

23. October 1997– The Pearl High School shooting in Mississippi, which killed 2 and injured 7, was stopped by the assistant principal who got a pistol he kept in his truck to subdue the shooter.

24. December 1991– Two armed men herded 20 customers and employees of a Shoney’s restaurant in Anniston, Ala., into the walk-in refrigerator and locked it. Continuing to hold the manager at gunpoint, the men began robbing the restaurant. They were stopped by another customer, legally armed with a .45 semi-automatic pistol, who was hiding under a table. He fired five shots into that robber’s chest and abdomen, killing him instantly. It’s debatable if this would have been a mass shooting, but it was a hostage situation endangering at least 20 lives.

 

Your examples show lots of people killed. So if we remove guns from the equation, ZERO mass shooting will be stopped because there will be ZERO mass shootings to stop in the first place. And the good part: no people killed.

 

What I showed is your claim is mythical in itself. Which is how I find most of your post

But I do appreciate your attempt to run from your own post because you couldn't defend it.

 

How many mass shootings are there every year compared to persons who defend their life or the life of others with a firearm? If you are going to make this demand you should know and what tradeoffs are you willing to make?

 

You might should check my post history there bub. I support massive increases in both training for our officers as well as their base salary.

But I also demand accountability.
They should be governed by the same laws as civilians are.

You are your “ilk” are the ones screaming how dare everyone not give them mindless and unwavering support regardless of what they do or don’t do (unless it is protecting the US Capitol).

 

That is a patently false statement, but then we expect nothing less from you.

They made no attempt to stop the shooter.

So, that's the end of your false narrative.

You don't need to be a trained cop. You just need to be trained in self-defense.

So you say totally ignoring the fact that 1,000s of weapons are smuggled into the US on weekly basis.

 

..... . UVALDE: Cops ADMIT
They Were Too Scared To Confront Gunman
.. ... They MIGHT Have Gotten Shot

So they sealed off the classroom where they KNEW the Perp to
be and they allowed the MURDERS to continue within ear shot
.................................... as children called out for HELP and Bled Out !!!


Watching these useless Lumps of Blubber standing around in their Mr DressUp
Heroic White Cowboy Hats, trying to Justify their abject Cowardice is enough
.......................................................................................................................... to make U Puke

Will anybody beyond some POS-PIG ScapeGoat ever be held accountable ?

Were they trying to maximize the number of casualties so that they could make it a Gun Control issue ?
One thing for sure, I would not want the only people who had guns to be the kind of Thugs, Goons, and
..................................................................... over militarized Yellow Pigs who now call themselves LEOs

 

Then why do you call a cop? To sing to them?

 

Haven't seen the leftist media complain about cops murdering am active shooter killing people. Have a link?

 

What do you mean by this? That it would be impossible to stop a shooter under those circumstances?

 

When you can quote me saying that, you let me know
Deflection noted

 

Sorry, your post alone don't represent the entire mindless left.
And cops are governed by the same laws as civilians. lol
How you guys come up with such is beyond me

 

If that moron teacher hadn't propped the door open, this would have gone much differently. That teacher should be prosecuted.

 

There is no procedure and no amount of training that can compensate for cowardice. Courage is required to be a "good guy with a gun."

 

Sure thing.

Condor says :

So you say this situation is a direct result of liberals crying to prosecute police misconduct. How would that affect this situation? I'm not aware of any instance of an officer being prosecuted for engaging with an active shooter. So then, why were the police afraid to storm the door if no cop has ever been prosecuted in an active shooter situation?

 

How does that prove your statement

Thats deflection number 1

Nope, another deflection
Thats two in a row

Never made that claim
Another deflection
Thats 3 in a row

Never claimed anything about a cop being prosecuted in an active shooter situation
Another deflection
Thats 4 in a row

What I said was, this is what you get when you defund the police and and prosecute cops.
Meaning, nobody wants to take a chance being accused by the left for something.

But just like the left, you like to twist peoples post to something you can argue about because you can't argue the facts.

 

Nope. You made all those claims, but don't want to admit it.

If cops don't want to be accused by the left, why are they still cops. You entire argument falls apart right there. If I was afraid if being targeted at my job, I would turn in my papers the next day. Then we see that the cops are located in a red state in a very red district, so I don't see many liberals chasing after them.

Let's face it. You have no facts to discuss and everything you say is based on emotion. In fact, lack of prosecution can lead to more instances like this. If I can collect a nice paycheck with qualified immunity, why would I rush into a school and risk my life? Any cop would rather get fired, but whatever because the next cop chasing a paycheck with zero accountability can take there place. Rinse and repeat.