Sola fide

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by Talon, Sep 20, 2022.

  1. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Thats hilarious mate .. is the real God the one who's name you can't manage to figure out ? What was the name of the God of Abraham again .. Thats the real one right ? and the name of this God is .. :) :) :)
     
  2. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    No I'm not saying that God isn't real. I agreed with you that some people invent Gods for various reasons. But that doesn't mean that there is no true God. It only means that an invented God is invented. If one tells a lie, can't another tell the truth?
     
  3. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    I don't know what it is.
     
  4. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    My answers are clear. It is your comprehension and honesty in question, and more so by the word.
     
  5. Battle3

    Battle3 Well-Known Member

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    Your concept of a “universal god” is that god is whatever each person wants god to be - in other words there is no god. there is no Truth, god is a creation of a persons imagination.

    If 2 people each create gods which are totally incompatible with each other, both cannot be real.
     
  6. Battle3

    Battle3 Well-Known Member

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    There is one True God, but that does not mean everyone believes in God.

    At one time a lot of people believed the earth was flat, while others believed it was round. They were all certain their belief was correct, but the flat earthers were still wrong.
     
  7. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Now you are talking Truth ... Bible says El .. Chief God of Canaanite Pantheon - well .. and Mesopotamian Pantheon in general - especially during that time period. El was "The Most High" . God of Mountain - Creator - Flood God - Cheif Diety on Earth .. head of the Pantheon .. the "Divine Council" .. so Holy -- some of the lesser divinities could not look upon him. .. Mentioned by name .. at least 5 or more times in the OT. and thats what the Encyclopedia Brittanica will tell you.

    Everyone knew who El was ..during Abraham's day .. specially a Young Lad from Ur. ...

    While I am in general agreement with Scholarship - this is not quite how I have it figured out.

    So Melchizedek .. High Priest and King of Jerusalem .. who blesses Abe - and to whome Abe Tithes 1/10th .. the"most high" in that interlude is EL "The Supreme One" .. this priesthood " Zedek" the City God of Jerusalem .. a representation of Justice - Righeousness - Wizdom .. very "EA" like characteristics ... El and EA are the Big Two ... .. sons of "ANU and "Earth Mother" .. but these are in heavenly realm .. El and Enki Run the show on Earth .. .. at this period of time ..

    Notice this Priesthood - Abe is around 1800 BC .. runs all the way down to 1000 BC when David takes Jerusalem .. the Kings name "AdoniZedek" .. the name of the Chief Priest at the time David takes over "Zadok" .. and they keep him around ... ends up being the one to annoint Solomon.. This Canaanite Priest .. from this ancient Priesthood.

    And that is the story of the God of Abe.. in a nutshell .. an interesting God .. but not quite my perspective on the God of Jesus .. although Close
     
  8. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    How is your concept of god any different ? .. "Whatever each person wants god to be" "2 people - 2 gods incompatible - both cannot be real .. and in fact it is likely that both are not real .. well .. a near certainty. .. Right :)
     
  9. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    But Christians have many gods.
    You still can't decide which is the real one.
    You quote the OT a lot but the god of the OT has a completely different character than in the NT.
    Then you can't decide if this god is happy with mere faith or wants an active expression of faith.
    Then you still don't know if this god wants you to think for yourself or slavishly follow what you think the bible ( which half) says.
    You are constantly recreating this god, which you say is universal but isn't because other faiths understand him to be different.
    This seems to me not only to be an invented god but one ehich is constantly being invented.
     
  10. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    The earth can be measured.
    An abstract idea cannot.
    There MAY be one true god but so far, no one knows what that is. There are many descriptions/creations of it...how do you know which is the right one ?
     
  11. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    Bingo!
    And this thread is about two people whose ideas of God are incompatible. That is why the OP discusses two interpretations of a quite fundamental aspect of a gods nature. There are 2000 years of incompatibility in defining God. Look back to all the declarations by Popes discussions divisions even within the Christian family, the major schism of the Reformation, the various theological disagreements, all resulting in many versions of God.
    All created by man.
    So which is the true god?
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2022
  12. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    But you keep reinventing this god!
     
  13. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    So you havent decided which is the True God.
    You are still creating it.
    Does that mean it isn't real?
     
  14. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    That isn't true. You have me confused with or superimposed by another. Such that what I say, you hear another and skew it to your own agenda as a coping mechanism. I understand that. But criminality in the surround as an excuse for the absolvement of personal duty is riotous, and takes nothing away from the higher standard.

    Yes I see the chaos and fraud. But I know that God is real, lives and is divine. I know because he, in charity, allowed me to recognize and remember him by the visitation of his spirit. So I don't know about him at arms length as a scholar might know. I actually know him in heart, mind, body, spirit, and soul. He has poured the milk and honey of peace to my cup and nourishment. I may grope for words to convey the truth. But I don't reach to create an image for the cause of deceit, and pull down condemnation on my own head in eventuality. I speak well of God to his honor, not mine. And if I aspire to put down lies about him, it is not to my enlargement but to his glory, that I might abide in his peace and favor, and that others may know he lives and that their faith isn't in vain.
     
  15. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Its like the example I provided. If someone goes to a sandwich shop looking to buy a carburetor, hopefully someone will tell them the sandwich shop doesn't sell auto parts. Then the person can decide whether or not they're hungry for a sandwich. They're not unwelcome, they're just in the wrong place to buy a carburetor.
     
  16. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Offering another perspective is also done with the intent of hoping to change someone's mind...
     
  17. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    Though gossip and rumors about a divine thing may collectively be considered babel. It is clearly not representative of the truth, but that there is no truth in the collective in regards to the genesis of it. And I seldom quote the Bible. My testimony is not scripturally based. It is founded on the visitation of Gods spirit. I knew nothing of scripture at the time.
     
  18. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    But you still have no idea who God is, what he is like or since he is constantly redescribed, whether or not he is merely your own creation.
    Much of your post is contradictory. How can you share your God if you don't know what he is?
    Para. 1...what criminality? What duty? It keeps changing. The OP here talks about the two options of duty, just faith or active faith. I am told there is still conflict as to which is the duty. So how can you do duty if you don't know what it is??
    You create your own version. Bur it might not be God's version. It might be the one you were told by someone who created their own interpretation. And they may be completely wrong. I do know that the nature of gods existence is very different from jehovah's witnesses to any other Christian sect. What if they are wrong?? That they created that God you adhere to?
     
  19. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    I suspect since you were being influenced by someone, it was not only God who inspired you.
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2022
  20. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    Will you please stop trying to create motives I do not have
    It is germane to discussion and debate that several perspectives are trepresented.
    You may be out there to change people's minds
    I am here to encourage them to think further than their restricted mental space.
    Once more and I will have to consider your are calling me a liar.
     
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  21. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    My testimony is a gift from God. It is not of mine or another's construction or influence. I am not some wild eyed, bible toting revivalist, smeared in holy crisco, driven by the whip of doctrine. I was not born into a religious family, and have no indoctrination from which to rebel. The visitation of Gods spirit and learning that he is real was a complete astonishment to me. And were it not for the fact that I recognized and remembered his spirit and that it was good, I would have rejected it in favor of my life.
     
  22. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    But you don't know the nature of God!
    Is it the vengeful god of the OT? The god of Islam? The Hebrews? Or of your own construction?
    I have no issue with someone who says they have been made happier by the awareness of "god" .
    I do have issues with those who spend hours trying to define him. You can't. And you can't because the minute you try to captivate one element you reject all others. And that immediately discredits the idea of a universal God. There is no purpose in trying to discern the one true permanent and undeniable character of god.
    So if you can't factually logically describe god you are left with the emotion.
    Which you cannot confirm or deny. Hence the role of faith. But it is a faith in something you create in your head because there are no facts to confirm it. You have faith in what you believe. But you have crafted that belief.

    As I said I have no issue with those who believe. I do take issue with those who say that god is an identifiable thing defined by close reading and interpretation of text that is contradictory and unclear.

    IMO ones relationship with your god is yours alone. Its doesnt have to be explained or reasoned or proven or justified. It doesn't need fancy churches or wars or corruption or fireworks or astrophysics to enforce it. It doesn't need minute examination or routine or sermons or ritual.
    It is just a one to one friendship.

    Let it be.
     
  23. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    This is a debate forum.
    Where people come to debate and give all kinds of ideas.
    This is the correct place.
    So, I still don't understand what you're trying to do or say about other posters posting in a debate forum.
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2022
  24. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    No. I have no intent, just like the other poster, to change anyone's mind.
    At best, perhaps enhance one's mind is the best one could hope for.
     
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  25. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    I leave an offering.
    I dont try to force you to take it.
    Whether you take it up is entirely up to you.
     
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