Major Social Security trust funds could be tapped out by 2033: CBO

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by Joe knows, Jan 22, 2023.

  1. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    you're mistakenly thinking $12,500 is the amount you get

    that is a tier, take 150k, divide by 12, is 12,500- that sets the tier at 12,500 for the 2%

    so anything over 12,500 you get 2% of as your take home ss check, + all the above tiers added together

    90% for the first $1,115
    32% for the remaining earnings up to $6,721
    15% for earnings over $6,721
    2% for earnings over $12,500 but less than the wage cap <---- new for income from $150k to the SS income tax cap

    so if you made 200k (based on the highest 35 yearly (with the wage index) income


    200k divided by 12 = $16,666

    you would get 90% of the 1st $1,115
    etc....
    then 2% for $12,500 trough $16,666 <-- that is the extra 2%

    and then on top of that, more for COLA's and extra years after 67
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2023
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  2. Pro_Line_FL

    Pro_Line_FL Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Ok. Yes, I thought you meant someone might receive that much.
     
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  3. Woolley

    Woolley Well-Known Member

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    I have to admire your faith in your investing abilities. SSI is for everyone, even the ones who are not as good as you are at investing. McCartney wrote a song that is appropriate at this point, it's called I, Me, Mine.
     
  4. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    what happens to the value of the debt as well
     
  5. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    What debt our national debt? Nothing as long as Dems are in power they have no intention of a responsible fiscal policy.
     
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  6. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    if you own a home and inflation happens and wages keep up, much easier to pay the mortgage off

    the min wage constantly rose in the 1900's, it has not kept up in the 2000's, debt has increased because of it

    https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/minimum-wage/history/chart
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2023
  7. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    It doesn't take any exceptional abilities. The calculation I used when comparing was the actual inc/dec in the stockmarket. This over 48 years of steady investing taking advantage of dollar cost averaging and compound returns. There is no period of over ten years where there would not be a solid return let alone a loss in all that time. And that follows any other study you could find on historical returns to investing.

    It take COMMITMENT and a long term view of things. And yes it was MY money. I can even leave some to my kids and grandkids to keep that American dream going in our family. And had I been able to invest just a part of my SS contributions into broadbased index fund I would get and even higher benefit from those funds.

    And THAT is key to resolving the funding crisis SS faces. There needs to be a better return on the money contributed and in the "trust funds", a better return to the person making the contributions. We can't just keep raising the contributions and doing so only on a few other people hoping it will balance out let alone ripping off those other people would not be ethical IMO.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2023
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  8. Alwayssa

    Alwayssa Well-Known Member

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    How do you account for $8 Trillion in debt under Trump when he was in power? Or the doubling of the debt when GWB was in power? Or when Reagan was in power?

    Debt is something that both sides play. And the GOP has done its fair share in increasing the debt as well as the Democrats. This is not an either/or?
     
  9. Alwayssa

    Alwayssa Well-Known Member

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    If you invested in the stock market in 1908 and kept the money in there till today, your rate of return would be around 8% even after the Great Stock Market Crash of 1929 and other fluctuations in the stock market. You are not reinventing the wheel here blues and most people panic when the stock market goes down and pull their investments out as quickly as possible. It is why there is competing strategies with gold and other precious metals, the stock market, and simply annuities with some giving guaranteed rates of return.
     
  10. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    I didn't say I was inventing anything, such investment principles certainly predate me. The fact remains allowing partial investment of your SS contributions into broad based index funds will out perform and return you would see on them kept in the SS system and would place a lower burden on the SS funding itself.
     
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  11. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Trump? The emergency COVID years or do you believe we should not have spent that money? And of course the Dems control the Congress his last two years.

    GWB how do you account for the deficit after hitting $400B in the recovery falling to a paltry $161B heading back to surplus? How do you account for it soaring to $1,400B in just two years with a Democrat Congress that bragged about cutting him out of the process? Why do you attribute those deficits and debt to him?

    How do you account for the fact that Reagan routinely requested less spending that Congress authorized and they would not accept many of his requested spending rescissions?

    Debt is something one side has absolutely no concerning and is FIGHTING to increase it. Guess which one?
     
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  12. fullmetaljack

    fullmetaljack Well-Known Member

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    That would be the Republicans. Funding tax cuts for the rich and for corporations off the middle class, subsidizing corporations, and spending like drunken sailors on the military. And borrowing to do this when tax revenues are not sufficient.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2023
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  13. jcarlilesiu

    jcarlilesiu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If I make $500K a year, clearly I have the means and capability to pay for my own retirement. If the intention is that people get back only what they contributed and this isn't some social program that takes from some to give to others, why does it matter if my full wages are considered for the contribution?
     
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  14. jcarlilesiu

    jcarlilesiu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Define "their fair share"
     
  15. jcarlilesiu

    jcarlilesiu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That's ALWAYS the goal of liberal social policies.

    Take from one to give to another as deemed appropriate by their standard.

    Liberals are nothing more than a bunch of Robin Hoods feeling they are making an impact by stealing the fruits of others labor.

    When liberal progressives ask WHY are republicans so adverse to all their liberal schemes for social engineering. That's why.
     
  16. Alwayssa

    Alwayssa Well-Known Member

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    You missed the point. And yes, you did say invest in the long term. third, you are the ones that want the SS to be changed so that individuals should invest in the stock market.

    But the point I was making was that if you look at the long term you are right. What you are ignoring, as usual, is what most people will do once the stock market goes down, and it will go down, then it will go up, then it will go down, etc.
     
  17. Alwayssa

    Alwayssa Well-Known Member

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    According to Fiscal Conservatives on this site and in Congress, they say "NO." But the point was that with Trump, he had substantial deficits in 2017, 2018, and 2019, during a time when the economy was "booming" according to Trump and the GOP. Then you had Larry Kudlow who said that deficits don't matter. He is not saying that today, but he said that during the Trump administration.

    As for Reagan, he still signed the bills didn't he? It is not a matter of who is in charge of the House or Senate. For 6 years, it was split, a Democratic House and a GOP senate. And the last two years it was all under Democratic control. But Reagan eventually signed all the budget bills as long as he got what he wanted. Namely, his buildup of the US military and a few other things. He was pragmatic, which is why he is considered a better president than Trump will be in day of the week.
     
  18. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    And NOTHING like the deficits of the Dems from 2009-2015. What's your point.

    YES we need more fiscal conservatives and fewer Dems and Rino's.

    So you are a supporter of government shutdowns now? Did Congress pass all his rescissions he submitted? Did he demand the higher spending or did the Dems?

    Do you realize how absurd it is to blame Reagan for those deficits because he did not stop your party from forcing them? AGAIN even with his build up he requested LESS spending that Congress authorized. And when Clinton was President he did the opposite and yet you credit him with the surpluses. You need to get it straight which party wanted what in what came to negotiated budgets. Or do you support a President shutting down government as Biden is promising to do to get the higher spending he and the Dems want NOW. If you are so worried about deficits and debts you DO support getting Congress to pass spending cuts in order to raise the deficits don't you?
     
  19. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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  20. Pro_Line_FL

    Pro_Line_FL Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    They numbers were actually comparable. The biggest difference was that deficits in 2009-2015 were decreasing, while 2017-2020 they increased every year ending in astronomical $4 trillion increase in debt in 2020.

    Force? They granted him the money for the "Star Wars" and other spending which was designed to crack USSR economy. He tripled the debt, but it worked.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2023
  21. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    GWB how do you account for the deficit after hitting $400B in the recovery falling to a paltry $161B heading back to surplus?

    How do you account for it soaring to $1,400B in just two years with a Democrat Congress that bragged about cutting him out of the process? Why do you attribute those deficits and debt to him?
     
  22. fullmetaljack

    fullmetaljack Well-Known Member

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    What are you talking about ? The last surplus was under and because of Clinton. That lasted about a year before we went into the Bush recession.
     
  23. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Gingrich and Kasich passed spending restraint and tax rate cuts along with welfare reform and forced Clinton to sign them the surpluses were in spite of him.

    GWB how do you account for the deficit after hitting $400B in the recovery falling to a paltry $161B heading back to surplus?

    How do you account for it soaring to $1,400B in just two years with a Democrat Congress that bragged about cutting him out of the process? Why do you attribute those deficits and debt to him?
     
  24. fullmetaljack

    fullmetaljack Well-Known Member

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    Actually, the surplus under Clinton was because of huge growth in the tech sector, which promptly ended under the Shrub due to his tax cuts to the wealthy coupled with his war spending.

    You mean , how did the deficit go from $590 Billion in 2016 to $3300 Billion in 2020 under the Orange Stain's incompetent handling of the COVID pandemic ?
    And how did the deficit drop to $1380 Billion in 2022 ?

    As for the national debt, How did it go from $24 Trillion in 2016 to $30 Trillion in 2020 ?
    And how did it go from $30 Trillion in 2020 to $30 Trillion in 2022 ?

    Is that what you're asking ?
     
  25. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    the rich do not pay a ss tax on every dollar they earn, like the other 90% of the country does
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2023

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