Complaining about Taxes is pointless

Taxes have always been the way the ruling class have extorted money and wealth from the governed. What can change it? Eliminating the government overhead that demands the taxes in the first place. Democrats will clutch at their imaginary pearls....

 

China has income taxes up to 45% and sales tax up to 17%. Iran rates go up to 37%.

There is no way around it. There could be flat tax, or consumption tax like Huckabee pushed for, but they are still taxes.

Empires of the past got much of their funding by expanding the empire and taking (stealing) the wealth from those places, but even the Romans had a tax system, as did the British.

 

So you claim to be rich, but to not own any of the things that make almost all the rich rich...? Riiight...

 

Yes, taxation is inevitable because even though government is inherently evil it is also necessary so government spending is necessary.
But most government programs are just an option. There are other ways to spend the revenue and meet most critical needs.

 

Communism seems to be super expensive. Right Comrade?

 

I never said that.

 

if FDR had not corrupted the supreme court, our federal spending wouldn't be the current disaster

 

FDR and Hoover were naive rookies.

"All Government employees should realize that the process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service," Franklin D. Roosevelt

 

Did you ever get a job from a poor man? I worked for a man for 27 years. He was a regional manager for a large critical power company. His bosses screwed him over on a home sale when he moved for them. He started his own company. Almost 1/2 of his employees make a 6 figure income. The first time he sold the company for $23M, customers begged him to start up again after his non-compete clause expired and take their business. He did it and doubled his money again. He still owns my company's facilities and leases them to the company. I know dozens of people who owe him huge thanks for their careers, including me. He is rich and he earned it. He even hired a former employee with cancer and got him health coverage. He took any tax break he found and shared it with his employees or used it to attract customers. Why would I want to deny him tax breaks and subsidies? He used his sports season tickets, RV, boats, etc..... to entertain customers and took the tax deductions. He shared those perks with employees also.

Companies don't pay taxes anyway. They pass the cost of the taxes on to their customers.

 

What does that have to do with anything?

Do you really think that person is typical of the rich? Most of the rich got that way by pocketing publicly created land value.

No, that is incorrect. Taxes are shifted according to the relevant elasticities of supply and demand. Google "tax incidence" and start reading.

 

Then what do you disingenuously claim to be saying?

 

No, requiring the privileged to repay the subsidies they are given. We need taxes to pay for the things that the market can't provide efficiently. We just need to require those who pocket the value taxes create to repay what they are taking. Not rocket science.

 

There are also better ways to obtain public revenue: "In my opinion the least bad tax is the property tax on the unimproved value of land, the Henry George argument of many, many years ago." -- Nobel Economics laureate Milton Friedman

 

Americans exercising their collective "wisdom" jumped through every kind of hoop and over every obstacle to amend the COTUS and shoulder the yoke of an income tax.
The income tax will never go away.

But our elected representatives do have the power right now to divert that flow of revenue from government programs and entities to vested accounts controlled by individual Americans. Would voters support candidates that supported legislation to transfer much of that Nile River of wealth from government to their personal youth?
Yes. So is that kind of reform likely to ever happen? No.

 

Hmm.. so folks like student loan debt defaulters you mean,... Your suggestion is novel for sure...

 

Student loan debt defaulters typically don't have a lot of asset value. The privileged do.

 

Then you missed the point at which those who receive social welfare are then obligated to produce to be taxed to repay their social welfare which was the assertion that was responded to.

 

Oh? Their "social welfare" is a modest amount that is mostly taken by the privileged.

 

Hmm... so not all social welfare is created equally I see.... But the assertion made that I responded to didn't attach a limit at which that view of taxation could be evaluated from. So, from your response, folks who might vote for you, for example because you forgave their student loan debt, should be exempt from the expectation that large investments of social welfare be taxed. Is that a fair characteririation of your position here?

 

he wants to claim that those who are the most industrious are the "most privileged". in my book the most privileged are those who are suckling on the public teat that others are forced to provide the milk for

 

No one is calling for 'no taxes.' What people want is tax reform. First and foremost, we need a system that doesnt let the rich off the hook. With 80000 pages of tax code on the books, all written by law firms and thinktanks on the payroll of the rich, the rich are the only ones who can afford to hire people to find all the loopholes they had written to exempt themselves. Everyone should be complaining about that (except for the rich, i guess). Beyond that, theres no reason taxes have to be compulsory. Thomas Jefferson envisioned a government funded by luxury and import taxes. His vision of govt would be funded by rich people buying luxury and imported goods. Granted his vision of govt was far smaller than what we have today... but it was functional (unless you prefer a large dependent class that need the govt to provide the bulk of their safety and well-being, perhaps, but that was never sposed to be America).

 

No, that's just another outright fabrication on your part.

Which is why you are wrong. The most privileged are those who actually get the benefit of what others are forced to pay for -- i.e., the privileged. See the difference?

 

Why should they repay it? They already have to give it all to the privileged, especially landowners.

 

Jefferson supported the Articles of Confederation, which made the federal government completely dependent on land value taxation, which has been known to be the fairest and most efficient form of taxation for centuries.

 

no government or almost no government means the least able starve. the modern welfare state not only grossly benefits the unable, it encourages their extensive breeding