Why can't a president convicted of felonies can be incarcerated?

I've heard a few folks on this forum declare that they will never put Trump in prison if he is convicted. Hmmmm.....

I was watching MSNBC today, and it appears that the entire panel, Lawrence O'donnell, Stephanie Ruhle, Alex Wagner, Ari Melber, and Chris Hayes, believe that a former president cannot ever be put in jail. I wondered about this, but I'm not seeing why he cannot be. I do understand there will be some logistics issues regarding the Secret Service, but that's not a constitutional issue, which means it is FIXABLE.

So....

The legal and protective circumstances surrounding a president who becomes a convict offers a compelling subplot. The law does not create a protective bubble around a president who has committed a felony, immune from the reach of incarceration. This common misconception often arises from a blend of tradition and guidelines rather than concrete legal barriers. The Department of Justice has long held a policy suggesting that indicting a sitting president would severely disrupt the executive branch. However, this policy is merely a guideline and not enshrined in law, reflecting a concern for governance rather than granting immunity from legal consequences.

Once a president’s term concludes, the protective mantle of the office fades, leaving them just as vulnerable to prosecution as any other citizen. If convicted, a former president would face the prospect of prison, not unlike anyone else found guilty of similar charges. However, their unique past role complicates matters. By law, former presidents are entitled to lifetime Secret Service protection, a stipulation designed to safeguard their post-presidential lives due to the sensitive nature of the information they possessed and the roles they executed.

The predicament of providing Secret Service protection within the confines of a correctional facility is uncharted territory. This scenario would necessitate a delicate balance, possibly leading to unprecedented logistical arrangements. The Secret Service might need to integrate their protective efforts with prison security measures, tailoring their protocols to suit the constraints of the environment while still upholding their duty. Such an arrangement would require meticulous planning and negotiation among the Secret Service, the Department of Justice, and penal authorities, crafting a solution that adheres to the security needs without overriding the punitive aspects of imprisonment.

This intersection of law, order, and presidential aftercare underscores a broader truth about our governance system: it is designed with checks and balances, including those that apply to its highest officers. A president is, at the end of the day, a citizen, vested with great power but also bound by the law’s reach. The mere consideration of such scenarios reflects the ongoing American experiment’s complexity and its continual quest for a balanced, fair governance system. Thus this issue finds its place not at the extremes but in a thoughtful, legally grounded center, illustrating the continuous dialogue between authority, responsibility, and citizenry protection.

Aside from the Secret Service issue, I'm not seeing a compelling reason why he can't be sitting in prison, like anyone else. No one is above the law, and why should Trump be given any special treatment? Perhaps they could empty out an entire wing, and reserve it for Trump and his Secret Service to guard him. (And that is better treatment than everyone else). I do understand that they are not about have him share a cell within a guy named Bubba . So, Orange on Orange, works for me.

And yes, I've heard the 'confinement to Mar-a-lago' option. No, that's too much of 'special treatment', that is, if the crime convicted would bring a regular person a prison sentence. This might work for the hush money conviction, but not the Smith conviction (if he is convicted). In fact, if Bragg wins, I think Trump will just get a big fine, as a first time offender (but Cohen got at least one year for his campaign finance violation, so, maybe not). But, the Smith trials will be far more serious.

What do you think?

 

I think they could and will put a President in jail, but you have to admit the security aspects are enormous. If you are talking about serious prison time it's likely you would need an entire wing of a prison dedicated to the myriad security concerns and Secret Service personnel involved. Has New York State done ANY Prep work to prepare for Trump's incarceration? I've not heard of any.

 

Well, I don't think it would take that much time, if he is convicted.

 

I don't think it's that they can't. It's that they believe they won't. Just to avoid the visuals. Internationally, it might not look good.

I don't know if they will or not. But we should be prepared for the possibility that he might get House Arrest. For the sake of the Secret Service. Which will probably be the excuse.

 

I don’t think any judge would order it.

Look how they are handling him with kids gloves, he is basically threatening judges and their families — as well as jurors — and the most he has gotten is a sternly written statement.

Had any of us here behaved the way he has we would be in jail pending trial. Look what they did with the judgements against his assets and the multiple extensions and decreases.

 

The protective detail IS the reason Trump won't go to prison, not a real prison and certainly not placed in general population.

A former president wouldn't be placed in general population even without a protective detail.

Former presidents know stuff. They have information stored in their heads that could possibly make it worthwhile for another inmate to blackmail him with the threat of physical violence.

It would be the ideal scenario for an assassination.

I know the anti-Trumpers would love nothing more than for Trump to get murdered in prison, but they need to get over themselves and accept the fact that he isn't going to prison.

 

He never threatened anyone. Stop repeating that lie.

 

This whole thing doesn't look good. The people can see right through it.

 

And then there's a riot and the inmates take control of the entire facility, even the wing housing the president. That possibility is why a former president will never be detained in an actual prison compound.

 

The only reason that if convicted T**** doesn't do time is that the hope will be he's an anomaly and we can't really need to stop a later president from acting the same by making it a risk to their freedom. Eventually Americans will get back to squeaky clean being a prerequisite.

I hope.

 

https://doccs.ny.gov/location/edgecombe-residential-treatment-facility

https://doccs.ny.gov/location/queensboro-correctional-facility

https://doccs.ny.gov/location/lakeview-shock-incarceration-correctional-facility

New York State minimum security facilities.

 

Of course no other president will be subjected to the same lawfare. In that sense, it is an anomaly.

 

I find it rather disgusting that people in this country are more concerned over making one man suffer than they are about the country itself. I find it quite SICK and SPITEFUL. I cannot wait for the karma!
Tag for election - #trump2024

 

Given that it's likely he's convicted in this New York case, we may find out soon.

 

Well that sounds like a dream scenario for the forum left. Can you imagine how ecstatic the lefties on this forum would be if Trump was murdered in prison? It's the ultimate in banana republicanism.

 

As soon as the appeals are done. You may send him to jail not before. That assumes they whole damn thing isn't over turned which it certainly should be.

 

Absolutely! It's all about hatred, not justice.

 

Were you concerned for Melania's suffering and humiliation she experienced when her husband was found out that he fornicated with a playboy playmate while Melania was pregnant and then he fornicated again with a porn star just after Melania, as a newlywed, gave birth four months prior?

Were you concerned about suffering of the 8000 in the class action lawsuit who were scammed out of millions in the fake Trump 'university'?

You were concerned about the suffering of the lighting contractor for Trump Taj Mahal Casino, who was forced into bankruptcy when Trump decided not to pay the $1,000,000 he owed him for the lighting he provided, not to mention not returning the lighting?

Were you concerned for the suffering of the parents of Trump's toddler grand-nephew who had cerebral palsy, the suffering they experienced whom he kicked the toddler off the family health plan just because he had a legal dispute with his deceased brother's estate, mainly his niece, Mary Trump?

Were you concerned about the suffering of estate of Fred Trump's son, who died, and Donald Trump tricked his father, Fred, while he was on his deathbed, into signing a new will which cut Trump's deceased brother's estate out of the will, which also excluded Mary, his niece, so that, instead of 1/5th of his father's inheritance, he got 1/4th?

Were you concerned about the suffering he caused a widow who Trump tried to use eminent domain to force her from her home so that he could build a limo garage?

Were you concerned about suffering and humiliation 5 black and latino boys experience who were charged with rape, but who were found innocent, but despite that exoneration, Trump bought full page ads in NYPost and other local publications in NY that called for their execution?

Were you concerned about the good elderly citizens of Aberdeen Scotland, whose access to water was cut of because of the Golf Course Trump built there?

I got tons more, if you are really that 'concerned' about 'suffering'.

AS for 'karma', that is occuring today, tomorrow, and the ensuing weeks and months he will be sitting in trials, awaiting conviction and incarceration for the suffering he has inflicted on thousands.

Maybe then, or someday, you'll realize the nonsense you are spewing today and if you can manage to realize it sooner, you can make amends by voting for Joe Biden.

 

Trump "fornicated" with Stormy Daniels? Cool story. So she was lying when she denied an affair? So I guess its safe for me to assume you don't BELIEVE WOMEN ?

 

Why? Most criminals are incarcerated after conviction of serious crimes (the GA and Wash DC and Mar a lago crimes are serious) and file appeals while in prison. Why should Trump be treated any differently? I can see maybe in the Bragg case, but not the GA , Wash DC and FLA cases.

 

It's safe to assume you are not paying attention. She clearly said she signed the statement under fear of being harmed given she was threatened, that it was a lie. Yes, I believe her when she said that.

 

Really, Lil Mike? I thought you were better than spewing biased left-hating hypotheticals. Guess I was wrong.

 

Well Clinton was convicted and he never went to jail?

 

It is certainly possible for a former president to be convicted of a felony and be sentenced to a prison term. However, it seems highly improbable that a former president be indicted under our nominal system of justice as founded in the Constitution of a felony committed after he was president, but if so would be less likely get a prison sentence. It is even more improbable of a felony committed while president unless maybe also impeached. It is near impossible to be convicted of a felony committed before he was president; otherwise that would have happened already. None the less, it is much more probable under our current system of justice which now resembles more like Stalinist USSR and many third world countries.

 

Hyperbole on parade. Wonderful.

Cohen was convicted of three crimes, for three years in prison, one crime of which was related directly to the Stormy Daniels affair in which Trump was listed as 'individual-1', whose name was largely stripped from the more damning aspects of the indictment to due pressure on the SDNY from Bill Barr (acting under Trump's request). Therefore, it is reasonable to presume one of those years in prison was due to Trump. So, if Cohen can serve one year, why should Trump, for the same crime, being the initiator of the crime where Cohen was just an accomplice, why should Trump get special treatment and not serve at least one year?