Hanging is not a bad thing ..

The death penalty is immoral and barbaric and should never be allowed, for any reason.

 

That is your belief, as a result of which I do not know.

Mine is different. Killing murderers who do not deserve to live is a principle I would live by if I could.

It is simple pragmatism.

 

I am just grateful that neither Australia or New Zealand have the death penalty. Good for us for sparing lives.

 

You would spare Sadam's, Bush's or Gaddafi's life?

Why?

 

I would spare anyones life. Lock them in prison but don't kill them. We cannot kill people to show that killing is wrong. We stoop to their level and we are better than that.

 

IMO, you are confused by a false morality. All the people I mentioned are mass murderers.

It is not a question of stooping to their level. It is simply a matter, not of any morality, but of practical utility.

I know many societies have been infused with the notion that killing such people is wrong. That also is a matter of utility. Killing innocent people who have been wrongly "proved" guilty is a live issue in modern societies. It is a fashionable utilitarian idea that, with the help (ironically) of murderous religions, has transmorphed into a misguided moral code. Much adored by those with a predeliction for moral codes. Of which there are far too many.

 

I'm not in favor of the death penalty, myself. I've heard perfectly good arguments in its favor, but it just doesn't feel right to me. Call me a bleeding heart if you want. I don't really see the point.

 

A thirty year old subhuman was executed here in Virginia last night using a new concoction of drugs previously only used on animals. How apropos.

For the bleeding hearts and others whose brains cease to function on tough issues, this gorilla RAPED and MURDERED an 80 YEAR OLD innocent woman who lived a long life raising a family and escaping the dangers of accidents or cancer, only to find herself in the wrong place at the wrong time in the twilight of her days when an animal walking upright decided he wanted a piece of octogenarian action.

 

That demonstrates a key issue with your position. You've decided all of those people are worthy of being executed. Lots of people, even if they agreed with the principal of a death penalty, would disagree on the sentence for those individuals. Some people would press for the death penalty for people you wouldn't want killed, maybe even people you like or love, maybe even you.

The principal of killing people who have been determined to be not worthy of living has led to horrific crimes throughout history.

 

I'm have to agree with Awryly on this one for the truly guilty. I do disagree with whom he is calling a mass murdering in this thread, but that is another discussion.

Why mess with the truly deranged? So, you lock them up in a cell...give them three meals a day...take care of them...make sure they have clean laundry...make sure the are "comfortable"....and force others to take care of them. These people live out their lives without having to deal with the normal stresses of life. They are taken care of so that we can give the appearance of being "moral".

What if they escape and kill more people?

What "moral" concerns did these people have towards their victim?

The "moral" excuse is only to satisfy our own guilt. I say dispose of those that are beyond a doubt guilty of heinous acts in the cheapest means possible.

Executions are not for revenge or even Justice. It is just disposing of something that is undesirable. It is no different then eradicating a virus.

 

Awrly, your idea of "justice" is not justice at all. It is a reactionary, instinctual lust for revenge.

 

Your logic is that we should do it because everyone else is doing it. Bad logic.

 

I am not, as you well know, talking about "killing people who have been determined to be not worthy of living". I am talking about killing mass murderers.

I am not even talking about the blanket killing of murderers. As you also know, there are degrees of murder. Lesser degrees of murder are not deserving of the death penalty.

 

If you even vaguely understood what I have been saying, you would know my logic is impeccable.

Western societies have developed a recognition that there are dangers in administering the dealth penalty because their justice systems so often condemn the innocent. That is a posiition based not on principle but on expediency - wrapped up in false morality.

I am saying that with perfect knowledge of guilt, there is no reason - other than specious so-called moral ones - not to kill the guilty. China is simply a society that errs the other way.

 

... because you've determined them not worthy of living. Your inclusion of George Bush in your list clearly demonstrates the issue with anyone making that determination.

Why not? Why couldn't the basis of determining a criminal of being not worthy of living be having committed any murder?

 

Actually, I'd rather hang. What a morbid thing to say! But seriously, I hate needles and the thought of fighting off impending sleep knowing that I would never wake up. Modern day hanging does not involve strangulation. A mathmatical formula was created whereby the length of a drop is calculated to break the neck without decapitation (drop too long) or strangulation (not long enough). If you watch the vid on the Hussein hanging, you'll notice he was hung using this merciful technique.

 

I'm just taken aback that an avowed leftist like you supports the death penalty. But stereotypes really do go out the window on this subject, don't they? As a Catholic, people expect me to oppose CP, but I don't.

In fact, one of the oldest laws ever given by God concerned the death penalty. He gave this law not to Moses, but to Noah, many centuries before. when this law was given, we had not the benefit of evolved court systems that vigorously defend the rights of the accused, nor forensic evidence, nor complex appeals system. Almost guaranteed was the higher rate in which the innocent would be falsely convicted, and yet God gave that law to Noah in spite of this.

So I would argue that if CP were just in Noah's days, with the higher probability that it would befall those falsely convicted, how much more just is it today where we have virtually eliminated the possibility of error in these convictions?

 

I believe Judge Roy Bean did that study through the "trial and error" method....or was it the "trial then air" method.

 

And we today are the beneficiaries of all those botched hangings. Our method is perfected through their suffering.

 

You hold up images of Christian Piety, yet when it comes to the ultimate act of mercy you deviate from the teachings of Christ.

 

Yeah, if they deserve it.
They'll never--choose one--
Rape a child
Commit murder
Commit high treason
--
again.
And they won't be in the same cell block with any friends, relatives, or plain ole strangers who end up in prison.

 

Do you consider yourself a social conservative?