Islam has no case

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUZ4IfTWZR4&feature=channel_video_title"]Nadir Ahmed vs. David Wood (2 of 3): "Does Islam Promote Violence Towards Non-Muslims?" - YouTube[/ame]

When it comes to open dabate and discussion by setting down all the cards, Bible and the Koran book to book, phrase by phrase Islam has no case. Islam dislike Christians for criticisng their religion inspite of the fact that Islam was the one who first came out to claim and attack the Bible that the Bible is wrong andf corrupt and yet Islam have refused to allow Christian to present their case the only voice Islam wants to be heard is theirs.

The only way Islam can proove that their religion is what they say it is that is it is peace it is tolerant and it is freedom is when Islamic countries start to allow Christians the same rights and freedom in Muslim lands the same rights and freedom that we in the West have allowed Muslims to enjoy.

 

Have you bothered to find out for yourself?

 

Has it occured to you that a book-to-book comparison of the Bible and the Koran is not a case anyway.

 

Yes, I have I learn that never turn your back on Islam because you don't know when they'll stab you at the back or when you're sleeping.

Wrong, Koran has took the initiative of claiming the Bible is false by plagiarising the Book and Koran have been using this as a mean to justify their religion it is but proper for the Bible to speak up and face Koran's accussation and that is what the Bible followers have been doing for centuries unfortunately the Koran followers have refused to accept such discussion their respond has always been jihad it is according to them their right to self defense and part of that self defense is to fight anyone who dare to question their Koran.

That is why all these Western-Muslims dare not or would not go to Muslim lands and teach Muslims there to give Christians the same rights that Christians have given to Muslims in Christian lands because Muslims in general have an alterior motive of being Islamofacist.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPimaisocv4&feature=channel_video_title"]Cat Stevens Sentencing Rushdie to Death - Stewart - Colbert Restoring Sanity? (Yusuf islam) - YouTube[/ame]

Even Cat Steven who claim to be a peaceful Muslim believe that it is his duty as a Muslim to kill anyone who insult their Mohammed.

 

Jews claim the Christians are wrong... When has any Muslim stabbed you in the back?

 

The Quran recognizes Christianity and Judaism as Holy religions, following Allah SWT (God) words.

Islam recognizes the Bible and Torah are relevations from Allah SWT, therefore recognizes the other Abrahamic religions.

When it claims the Bible is corrupt, it is talking about the Bible being re-written by man.

The Quran hasn't been changed throughout it's existance.

If you'd like, I can go more indepth with this and include some Quranic quotes about the topic.

Salam.

 

60:7 It may be that Allah will grant love (and friendship) [mawadda] between you and those whom ye (now) hold as enemies. For Allah has power (over all things); and Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

 

Surat al-Baqarah: "Say ye: 'We believe in God and the revelation given to us and to Abraham, Ismail, Isaac, Jacob, and the Tribes, and that given to Moses and Jesus, and that given to (all) Prophets from their Lord. We make no difference between one and another of them, and we bow to God.' "

Surat an-Nisa: "That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah.;- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not."

Surat al-Ma'idah: "From those, too, who call themselves Christians, We did take a covenant, but they forgot a good part of the message that was sent them: so we estranged them, with enmity and hatred between the one and the other, to the day of judgment. And soon will Allah show them what it is they have done."

Surat al-Ma'idah: "Those who believe (in the Qur'an), those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Sabians and the Christians,- any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness,- on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve."

Surat al-Ma'idah: "They do blaspheme who say: "(Allah) is Christ the son of Mary." But said Christ: "O Children of Israel! worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord." Whoever joins other gods with Allah,- Allah will forbid him the garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There will for the wrong-doers be no one to help."

Surat al-Tawba: "The Jews call 'Uzair a son of Allah, and the Christians call Christ the son of Allah. That is a saying from their mouth; (in this) they but imitate what the unbelievers of old used to say. Allah's curse be on them: how they are deluded away from the Truth!"

 

That is always the typical selling point of Islam but when you ask them, so does Islam believe Jesus Christ is God? their answer is flat NO, so where is the recognition and similarity??? None it is all smoke and mirror, Islam is the anti Christ. The Pharasees tried to destroy Jesus by having Him crucified they failed, the Romans tried to exterminate all Christians by feeding them to the lions they failed and then came Islam that went after both the spirit and body of God to destroy Chrsitianity and they too have failed.

Another deception, Islam clearly claim it is Ishmael the chosen one not Isaac, the Torah and Bible follows the Isaac lineage not Ishmael. While Islam claim to follow Ishmael lineage and yet they shift into Isaac's lineage by declaring all the Isaac prophets are actually talking about Islam when it is very clear that Isaac descendants are talking about the Jews, while in the Bible the continuation of the Torah with the coming of God Himself in Jesus Christ. This, Islam do not recognize the most important part.

The Bible was written by man who were all inspired by God and visited by God's angels. The Koran was written by man who have no direct communication with God but only through Mohammed who has a totally demonizing experience with a suppossed angel name Gabriel a Gabriel angel that was totally uncharacteristically very aggressive and intimidating not the same Gabriel that appeared to Daniel and Mary.

Quran has change many times in fact the koran of today is probably not the same Koran that the original writters have written, several version of the Koran was burn during the time of Uthman the great conqueror he saw it in himself to expand his version of the Koran.

Islamic history can confirm this burning that is why there are so many Islamic sects and all claiming to be the true Islam.

 

John 20:30
Then Jesus told him, "Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed."
John 6:20
And a great crowd of people followed him because they saw the miraculous signs he had performed on the sick.

Gospel of St. Matthew 5:3-10
"Blessed are the poor in spirit,
for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

Blessed are they who mourn,
for they shall be comforted.

Blessed are the meek,
for they shall inherit the earth.

Blessed are they who hunger and thirst for righteousness,
for they shall be satisfied.

Blessed are the merciful,
for they shall obtain mercy.

Blessed are the pure of heart,
for they shall see God.

Blessed are the peacemakers,
for they shall be called children of God.

Blessed are they who are persecuted for the sake of righteousness,
for theirs is the kingdom of heaven."

 

Jesus PBUH is God or the son of God? I'm confused now....

The recognition is in the Quran, and some of the quotes I posted. When did Islam try and destroy Christianity? Haha I could make things up too, but I guess I like being right too much.... Anyway...

Do you know anything about Islam? Isaac is just as important as Ishmael in Islam. The Bible and Torah are books from Allah SWT (God) just like the Quran.

Islam is not Christianity, of course there will be differences.... Main difference is you believe Jesus PBUH is the son of God, in Islam he is a prophet of God.

I'll get into the Quran burning later.

 

Muhammad PBUH would of written the Quran himself, if he wasn't illiterate. But he was, so he recited it to people who wrote what he told them. I'm not going to comment on your thoughts on Gabriel, it's just a waste of time.... Anyway, now on to the more important stuff.

First, Uthman didn't burn the original Qurans. He made copies of the original, sent them to other countries, and burned the others. And secondly, in Islam it is vital to memorize every word and every verse of the Quran (in Arabic) for every Muslim. At this time, many Muslims had the Quran memorized so if he changed anything it would of been known.

You can do some research on what Uthman really did, then maybe understand how you are wrong instead of me just saying "you're wrong".

As for the different sect, it has nothing to do with the Quran.

Sunni's (such as myself) believe Mohammed PBUH is the messanger of Allah SWT, and the Hadiths are an important part of Islam along with the Quran.

Shia's believe Mohammed PBUH is the messanger of Allah SWT, but the don't consider the Hadith to be important and instead think Ali ibn Abi Talib PBUH is another holy figure in Islam behind only the Prophet Mohammed PBUH.

Since Sunni and Shia Islam are the two largest sects, I will focus mainly on those. There are a few minors ones, such as Wahhabism, Sufism, etc but I don't want to get into that right now.

I recommend you do some research on the two main sects of Islam though

Salam

 

Now you understand why Islam and Christianity are not the same, Christian accept and believe Jesus Christ is God, Islam does not that is why you are confuse.

By changing the main character of Jesus Christ is God that is how Islam is destroying Christianity by down grading Jesus Christ the God to just mere human.

I know about Islam, do you know about Islam? I doubt. Isaac importance is just another deception Islam claim they are both important but it claim Ishmael is the chosen one that alone is directly changing or down grading the importance of Isaac.

There you go, so there is no identical between Islam and Christianity it is totally different. The only identical are the names but not the core not the essence. Islam use all the Biblical names but gave them all different stories and role.

The Bible has been around thousand of years and was authored by people from different generations while the Koran was authored by one man who had exposure to the Bible and the Torah. Authors of the Bible were exposed only to God and His angels.

 

Both. In the Christian concept of trinity Father, Son and Holy Spirit are one God. I have to admit that it is a slightly confusing concept. St. Patrick is said to have explained it by using a shamrock.

I'd guess that like many other posters here he/she only knows what can be read on various islamophobic hate-sites that flourished after 9/11. They are consumed by the kind of people who swallowed bin Laden's bait, hook, line and sinker and are obsessed with the idea that every single Muslim is out to destroy Western society and wants us to live under Taliban rule or die. Bush's talk of a 'crusade' and his constant fear-mongering to justify throwing money at the American weapon's industry in needless wars didn't help either.
You can try and counter that kind of paranoia with facts, but in my experience that won't help these brainwashed victims and avid disciples of Robert Spencer and co. to overcome their cherished prejudices.
Please continue though, because so far, I've enjoyed reading your posts quite a lot.

 

No, I'm confused because I have another member here who keeps saying Jesus PBUH is the son of God and because Islam doesn't recognize this it's a false religion.

Now I have you saying Islam is wrong because it doesn't recongize Jesus PBUH is God....

So which is it? Is Jesus PBUH God or God's son?

Oh no, I know nothing about Islam obviously.... I'm just a Muslim, but it means nothing. Lol.

Here: http://www.mostmerciful.com/deception.htm

That will help explain the Isaac-Ismael dilemma. I know I'm wasting my time posting this, and you are automatically going to accuse it as being wrong, but worth a shot....

There are differences because they are different religions. Is this such a shock? If they were identical then we'd be following the same religion with different names....

The Prophet Mohammed PBUH was illiterate. If you're trying to say he plagarized the Bible and Torah, explain how a illiterate in that time could do that? He was given the Quran from Allah SWT through an angel, not by people.

The Bible has also been changed by man, many times. Before you say it (yeah, I already know what you are going to say....), did you find out what Uthman really did?

Salam

 

So he's the Son of God but at the same time represents God? Is that it? I think I understand now (if that was right)....

That is so true. There seems to be no reasoning with people who read on Jihad Watch, Religion of Peace, Answering Islam, Wiki Islam.... Coincidentially the same type of websites that Breivik b@stard went on.

But I appreciate that I'm not putting in this effort for nothing. Glad to hear somebody is atleast reading with anopen mind. Thank you

Salam

 

I disagreed with him on many issues, but reading your posts makes me miss the late Pope John Paul II. Here's the speech he held when he visited the Omayyad Mosque of Damascus on May 6, 2001:

Read more: http://www.sweetspeeches.com/s/1741...s-at-omayyad-mosque-of-damascus#ixzz1YRyiVwVK

 

Yes, I think that's about right. Another Christian way of putting it is that when Jesus walked the earth God became flesh and showed his love for us by suffering like flesh does.

 

All good, I think I understand now. Didn't make much sense, having Quantrill saying he's the son of God then this guy saying he is God. So just to make sure I do understand (because I want to know), Jesus PBUH isn't literally God, but God is in Jesus PBUH's body when he was being crucified?

 

Is it true that the Prophet Mohammed (PBUH) really made a Night Journey to the City of Jerusalem on a Winged Horse?

 

This is your fairy tale nonsense of a story, nothing more.

The Biblical stories were repeated often during Muhammad's time. He simply took the parts of Judaism and Christianity that worked with the made up story he concocted to gain a following. Once he had that, he became the bloodthirsty warlord that we all knew him to be. Granted he was smart. Not too many illiterate men of that time were able to become rich, powerful, and spoken about 1400 years after their deaths (not always in a good way, of course).

You have no way of knowing if the Bible has been changed, nor do you know that the Qur'an has not been changed. That's just the Islamic supremacist propaganda you've been fed your whole life. Muslims attempt to convince Christians that Islam is the correct religion, similar to how Christians tried to convince Jews thousands of years ago. Of course, Muslims are a lot more violent about it, which is demonstrated on an almost daily basis in the Muslim world. Convert or be killed. Just like the Qur'an says.

So feel free to continue proselytizing to Christians, knowing fully well that Christians doing the same thing would result in their death in the Muslim world by your good brothers of the ummah. Must be a source of pride for you to be involved in such a destructive death cult.

 

Yeah, Mohammed PBUH prayed in the "Farthest Mosque" (aka Al Aqsa) during it.

Thank you for putting PBUH

 

I think your sarcasm detector is broken.

We don't need to conform to Sharia by adding PBUH after Muhammad's name. Sorry to disappoint you. Maybe when you and your future wife have 8 kids, and millions more Muslims inhabit the West, you can force us to do it. Wouldn't that be swell?

 

rofl......

 

Well, anybody who studied Christian Theology at a proper university could tell you all about how it was decided which books should enter the canon and how to find out which codices are probably the oldest, which parts have probably been added later by other authors etc.
Personally I'm too tired and too lazy to bother right now. Good night.