The birther thread to end all birther threads

wong you're just a dick..

 

And you're probably correct, too. If the 70mln Americans have voted an absolute nobody, unvetted community organizer with murky past, with America hating pastor for spiritual advisor and the toilet blowing domestic terrorist for political advisor into the White House, they can probably vote the child of a couple of Al Qaeda operatives into the White House as well. As long as he promise hope and change, free gas and mortgage and can read the tele[prompter, that is...

 

You have been arguing Blackstone's definition of natural born. And his definition
IS natural born "SUBJECT"So now that we have determined we are not subjects that only leaves Vattel's definition of natural born "CITIZEN" which as everyone knows is a person born of citizens of the nation.

 

Still dancing away from responding to the issue like a talented ballerina.


If the ballerina shoe fits...

 

Thankfully, neither Iran or Venezuela or North Korea can veto who our President is, so that voters can chose a 'community organizer' or a retired actor or a peanut farmer to be President if the voters do so choose.

So in the end, regardless of the efforts of Birthers, the voters will make the choice.

 

Guess its a good thing that Vattel is irrelevant when it comes to who is a Natural Born Citizen in the United States then.

 

What crap is that? Decipher it for me please, so I can understand what you're talking about? What in the world can Iran or Venezuela or North Korea do with our presidents?

 

nope. only a handfull of fringe lunatic conspiracy theorists believe that is the definition. the rest of american, including the electoral college, the ENTIRE congress and the ENTIRE judiciary, know that anyone born on US soil, regardless of their parents status(unless they are foreign diplomats with immunity, or an invading army)is a natural born citizen.

 

That's not true from what I have been reading and hearing. From my research and discussion with several attorneys in the office next door here in downtown Mobile, a natural born citizen is a higher subset of a citizen, born to two citizen parents. History shows that all presidents post grandfather clause were born to two citizen parents. Chester Author is questionable because there isn't enough conclusive information on him. In other words, we don't know. They pointed that out to me. One attorney told me several post grandfather clause were born to one foreign born parent married to a U.S. citizen here in the states but the foreign born parent became a naturalized U.S. Citizen before that future president was born therefore making him a natural born citizen. This is fascinating stuff the more I read up on this.

 

There is no Vattel definition.

As to "subject" vs. "citizen," I refer you again to the decision in Wong Kim Ark in which Justice Gray calls bullsh*t on your pathetic quibble.

 

That cannot possibly be true. There is no conceivable way "several attorneys" all in one spot could all be that incompetent. Even known Birther lawyers never congregate more than two to a room before they start suing each other.

Wrong. We do know. Arthur was 13 years old when his father naturalized.

Not that it matters.

 

don't bother...

 

Like I said- Birthers can't face the logical consequences of their new definitions for Natural Born citizen.

If you use the Birthers definition that a Natural Born Citizen cannot be born with dual citizenship- then all any country that wanted to cause harm to the U.S. would have to do is declare every person born in the U.S. a citizen a dual citizen of Venezuala or Iran or North Korea- whatever. Within a generation or two, no more natural born citizens.

If you use another Birther definition- that no President can be a dual citizen- then any of those same countries can really have fun- waiting until the Republicans name their candidate, and simply make that candidate a citizen of their country.

Because Birthers believe that other countries laws are superior to the United State's, even within the United States. That is how unpatriotic Birthers are.

 

do you believe this is the birther thread to end all birther threads ?

maybe you're unpatriotic for trying to block investigation... why doesn't the constitution say anyone can be president ? was frederick douglas eligible ?

 

What research have you done? Have you researched anything other than Birther websites?

Even more so- what were you taught growing up? If you grew up here in the United States, you were taught the same thing the rest of us were taught- that anyone born in the United States can aspire to grow up and be elected President. I still remember my very conservative evangelical 8th grade teacher pounding that into us.

Seriously- history shows?

History shows that every President prior to Barack Obama had two white parents- does that mean that a Natural Born Citizen must have two white parents?

History shows that every President prior to Barack Obama was male- does that mean a woman can't be a natural born citizen?

Using History as an example is particularly cruel to Birthers.

I still remember when Kennedy was running for President- and History showed that no previous President had been Catholic....

We don't know what? That his father wasn't a U.S. Citizen when he was born? Yes- we do know that- and it was known when he was elected, just as it was known when Obama was elected.

Patriotic Informer- I am really trying hard to assume that you are open to honest dialogue here. If you are- answer these questions and we can continue discussion:

a) When you were growing up who were you taught was eligible to be the United States President?

b) Why are you having these questions now? Why was this not a concern of yours prior to the election?

c) What is your belief as to why the majority of voters, the Electoral College, Congress and Chief Justice Roberts all elected, confirmed or swore in Barack Obama if you think that there is any such controversy as to whether his father's citizenship affected his eligibility?

d) Why do you believe that none of his political opponents- John McCain, Hilary Clinton, the RNC- expressed any doubt as to his eligiblity?

e) Why do you think that not a single Secretary of State for any of the 50 States refused to put Barack Obama on the ballot because they believed he was not eligible?

To me, the above makes it clear, that no one but a small- very, very small fringe group of political malcontents are promoting this new definition of natural born citizen, and that the clear consensus opinion within the United States is that anyone born in the United States can aspire to rise to the highest office in our country.

I look forward to your reply.

 

I will point out that once again Wash pirouettes away like a prima Ballerina from actually responding to the question

Do you think Hugo Chavez should be able to have veto power over who is eligible to be our President?

Watch the dance continue....

 

Nah ... Wash is now branching out... He's now into canadian bashing in current event section...

Or maybe it's the booze talking... yet again...

 

He is by nature an unpatriotic seditionist. He must dance away because he actually does believe Huge Chavez should have that power.

 

Yeap, crap it is; usually you're a bit more coherent, JEFF. Did you ask someone to write this for you, someone high? For your ramblings make no sense, whatsoever.

 

He's not answering because this is such an obvious crap of a question... but I will answer - No, I don't think Hugo Chavez should be able to have veto power over who is eligible to be our President. Now what?

 

Now you join us in arguing against the stupid Birther theory that dual citizens cannot be natural born US citizens.

 

Against? I'm all for it; I just cannot understand JEFF's thought process and the message he's trying to convey... care to give it a shot?

 

Great.

Hugo Chavez has such a veto power if the U.S. were to adopt the Birther's version of Natural Born Citizen, which according to the Birthers means among other things that:
a) the child cannot be born a dual citizen and
b) the candidate cannot be a dual citizen.

So you either support Hugo Chavez having such control or you are against this portion of the Birther agenda to revise the meaning of NBC.

 

Wow... it took you exactly 21 minutes to completely flip flop and contradict yourself.

Perhaps you should consider joining Cirque du Soleis as a contortionist.