My View: "Give The Middle Class A Fighting Chance"

Sound and fury signifying nothing.

Hey Trinnity- I see you have 15,000 PF credits. Care to bet them against me? I got Obama- you can take everyone and anyone else.

 

Let's take this one at a time.

How exactly did the New Deal lead "to tremendous growth in the middle-class?"

 

Just curious, but what country are you from that only Doctors, Lawyers, and unionist make good wages?

 

why does the middle class think they have no power and must stand by and let corporations pass taxes onto them?

these voters have the power to force corporations to accept a loss in profits and pay more taxes for the national debts but that means giving government more power to set prices in the market

 

One is naturally perplexed at the prospect of trying to carry on a reasoned debate with someone who cannot construct a lucid paragraph (or even a coherent sentence).

Nonetheless, I will try.

The meaningless use of the phrase, "of course," does not absolve the speaker of any responsibility to show constitutional authority for his assertion, as regarding the (supposed) chief purpose of the federal government.

And your (admitted) affection for "a socialist system"--it is "optimal," you have asserted, since it obviates any possibility of "envy or class warfare" (such as, say, President Obama is currently stoking)--firmly establishes the fact that you are not "liberal," as your moniker would seem to indicate--but socialist.

Presumably, you would not disagree with that assessment.

Uh, as I recall, the Bank of America incident had nothing to do with higher taxes. Rather, it was about a new government regulation as concerning debit-card fees, which is certain to cost the company more money.

The uproar (which was quite understandable) was probably grounded in the fact that many customers were outraged at the fact that they would suddenly be charged a fee to access their own money. (In this regard, the new charge would have really been quite similar to so-called "surrender fees" that are attendant to withdrawals from most annuities.)

Alas, Bank of America--and other financial institutions also--will doubtless extract this money from their customers. Just using different methods.

For more on this matter, it might be prudent to consult the February 2012 issue of Consumer Reports...

 

Only because we choose to be.

 

Because you do have the power........and you excercise it everytime you buy something. Which is why your home is filled with a plethora of foreign made and corporate made merchandise........

Well those corporations w/jobs also have a right to pull up stakes and leave The Divided Socialist States of ObamAmerica ......

.....if your not out of a job yet....keep voting Democrat.
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incorrect assessment, the motive of federal government actions is to be favorable to the middle class as the US is a democracy so government must work for the people

the bank of america incident served as an example that when government attempts to control big business and makes them have higher costs to do business the people don't neccessarily have to accept those costs being passed onto them

there is some sort of republican myth going around that people are held by their trousers to the whims of big corporations and that is simply not true, the government can force big businesses to absorb higher expenses associated with taxation and government regulations if the people cannot boycott them into action like they did with bank of america. that is why they bank of america caved they know in the end the people hold all the cards even though they are ignorant by republicans and rich controlled media

 

the middle class has no power, they can't afford not to shop at walmart even if they didn't want to

 

....which is why your home is filled with a plethora of foreign made goods.

......which is why your expressing your hatred for Corporations on your corporate made Keyboard.

Now the Democrat solution to our economic and trade ills.......is to FORCE Americans to buy American.......

....how do you think that is going to work out for this country and economy?
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Are you at all familiar with the logical fallacy known as a non sequitur?

(Quite tellingly, you have not attempted to cite any constitutional authority to backup your position, as I had requested. Presumably, you do not intend to attempt to do the impossible...)

As a right-wing populist, I certainly have no affection for Big Business.

Nonetheless, I will attempt a response here.

In a free society, business ought not be subordinate to government, anymore than government ought to be subordinate to business. I would really not wish to reside in the sort of society that celebrates either Big Business or Big Government--or that supposes that one should attempt to control the other.

And, to reiterate--please refer to my earlier post in this thread, for more on this--it is surely the very apotheosis of naivete to imagine that additional bank fees have been magically made to disappear through some recent, consumer insurgency. They will simply take another form now.

In order to diminish the possibility of one's being stuck with these new (or higher) fees, it might be wise to consider moving one's liquid assets from a bank to a credit union...

 

Trinnity's points look spot-on to me.

 

Trinity, the follwing video explains why you've no middle class left; vulture capitalists, not hards working capitalism - the kind which we working class people like and want:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEwGvyGFGfQ&feature=related"]Palin To Romney: Show Us Your Tax Returns, Proove You Created 100K Jobs - YouTube[/ame]

 

No thank you. I prefer to give them away to friends and those I admire. I recently gave away 20,000 to FearandLoathing because his posts are so darn good.

I'm sure you'll find others who wish to wager them with you. Have a pleasant evening.

 

that was not non sequitur for constitutional authority the general welfare clause of the constitutation states the government must provide for our needs so that is another example of governments duty to the middle class

please do not attempt to distance the right wing philosophy away from the interests of big business, their ideology supports big business freedoms but those freedoms are a luxury and not a right granted by the middle class the sooner they learn that the better for them.

the middle class will get nowhere under their populist ideas of business freedoms, the people must take control of business using big government as seen in the bank of america consumer uprising and push for higher taxes on their profits to force them into submission and pay for our national debts. government can force them to absorb extra tax expenses and not pass them onto the middle class consumer as well

 

It would probably be lost upon you if I were to attempt to point out that "our needs" (which some people tend to confuse with our desires) is not a synonym for "the middle class."

As for the infinitely elastic view some appear to have as regarding the General Welfare Clause of the Constitution, well, suffice it to say that it is most unlikely that the Founders ever intended for it to be interpreted in such an enormously expansive way...

Say what?

I have attempted to elucidate my own beliefs in this regard.

It is simply not incumbent upon me to attempt to defend that portion of "right[-]wing philosophy" that does not comport with my own views...

No "class" actually "grant" rights. Rights are derived from two valid sources--and from those two sources only: (1) natural rights (which derive from natural law); and (2) the social compact (or social contract, if you prefer). John Locke--whose writings undergird our Declaration of Independence--had a great deal to say on this subject.

Oh, by the way: Government does not "grant" rights, either. In fact, in a free society, government is inherently subordinate, authoritatively, to the general citizenry--not the other way around.

Now there is a scary thought.

(Actually, there are two scary thoughts, cobbled together...)

Ah, the fertile imagination of the militant left, as it imagines that it is storming the Bastille--metaphorically speaking, at least...