2016 Trump Tower Meeting Looks Increasingly Like a Setup by Russian and Clinton Operatives

Exactly. The logic/linear thought disconnect of the left in regards to who REALLY COLLUDED WITH RUSSIA is astounding....

 

Well, I suppose with all that overwhelming evidence, Beauregard had better get off him gnome-like ass and make some indictments...

And I mean now... no time for an investigation..... the evidence is disappearing before our eyes...

Go Jeffy, Go!

 

Mueller made a deal with Flynn, and generally plea deals are beneficial to both sides. Flynn got a significantly lowered charge, and protection from prosecution for his son, for giving Mueller information. We don't know what kind of information Flynn has given Mueller, but we do know that Mueller has delayed Flynn's sentencing more than once, so he probably continued to get information from Flynn, or he's planning to have Flynn testify against someone. Remember Flynn has to tell the truth and do what he agreed to do in the plea bargain, or all the other charges come crashing down on his head, including those against his son. Mueller doesn't want Flynn's deal to be finalized until after he has done as promised.

If Gulen's kidnapping plot was outside Mueller's mandate, he could have referred the case elsewhere, like what happened with Michael Cohen. Mueller is under no obligation to look the other way, if he discovers any crimes outside his mandate. He just wouldn't prosecute them through his office.

 

McCabe was fired outside the normal protocols of FBI procedures. Remember that Wray refused to fire him. That's why Sessions did it.

Why didn't Wray didn't fire them, if that was the appropriate according to FBI protocols? Here's where your argument loses steam… Trump admits why Strzok was fired, and it was because Trump wanted him fired… for the Russia investigation. That's obstruction… again.

Your argument on Russia helping Clinton died at Helsinki…

The Podestas are very different from each other. Sorry that doesn't fit your narrative of them both working for Russia. Should I assume you found no citation to show that John was in bed with the Russians, like there is for his brother Tony?
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If you don't want to believe Woolsey, that's your prerogative. It doesn't mean that what he said happened didn't happen. The FBI used the Gulen incident in Flynn's plea deal, so it seems they believe it happened, and Flynn agreed…. but you're welcome to be skeptical.

I haven't mentioned Brennan in this thread, so I have no need to go there now. Perhaps in another thread, we can discuss him.

 

Answer me this.. .Why didn't Christopher Wray fire either one of them… and did he threaten to resign if there was more political pressure for him to do so?

 

Then answer me this.. Why didn't Christopher Wray fire either one of them? Why was one fired by Sessions and the other fired by Bowditch… and did Wray threaten to quit if he was further pressured to fire them for political reasons?

 

I'm not Mueller. As far as I know, he's been investigating what happened with Putin and Trump, and the whole dossier business, for more than a year and his findings haven't been made public. I urge you to be patient.

There is an old legal saying … Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Just because it hasn't been made public, it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. That is especially true of this investigation. One thing everyone, who talked to the Mueller team, has said, in common, is that Mueller's team knows more about the situation than the people that were there…. and they have documentation to prove it. They have everything- every email, phone call, text message, document.

 

If Mueller were actually investigating the Dossier, it would have led him directly to Hillary Clinton and the DNC and some very suspect actors in the Obama Administration. Mueller is trying to get Trump impeached and keep Hillary (and others) out of prison. It's a one sided completely flawed Special Council.

 

I'm glad you brought that up.

Do you have a source from Wray that said he would resign, or do you have people in the media claiming he said he would resign?

Here's what Wray ACTUALLY said:

http://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...orts-he-threatened-to-resign-over-pressure-to

Wray told NBC News senior justice correspondent Pete Williams in an interview excerpt broadcast on "Nightly News" that he does not feel any political pressure from the White House.

Pressed on whether President Trump has asked the FBI chief to say anything, Wray responded, “He’s never asked me to do anything with the Russian investigation."

“I have been very clear — from the minute I was nominated to the minute I walked in the door to countless opportunities since then — that I am unwaveringly committed to doing this job by the book, independently, following our rules and our processes free from political or partisan influence,” Wray said.

Asked if he was saying that media reports he had threatened to resign were wrong, Wray demurred, saying he was “not going to talk about specific conversations.”

Axios was reporting that Wray was pressuring McCabe to RESIGN

https://www.axios.com/mccabe-pressu...own-9746af2e-bd53-4476-ac09-9214a4b2b139.html

The FBI's Deputy Director, Andrew McCabe, was reportedly pressured by FBI Director Christopher Wray to step down from the bureau, sources told the New York Times. NYT says McCabe was telling people as recently as last week that he had hoped to stay in his role until mid-March, when he becomes eligible for retirement.

If you have a source DIRECTLY QUOTING Wray, then you have evidence of your claim. If you do not, you have evidence of nothing, other than another reporter putting words in his mouth.

No my argument didn't die at Helsinki. Trump has taken far more concrete anti-Russian steps than the previous administration ever did, and was not up to his eyeballs involved in money like the Clintons.

Yes, both the brothers are different people. Different people who were knee deep in multiple tens of millions of dollars investments in Russia right along with the Clintons.

I gave you a well sourced document on those links. Surprise you didn't bother acknowledging them.

 

I can accept that, if in fact Mueller is investigating all of the leads and not, as I suspect, simply targeting Trump.

Mueller and his merry band's history of bankrupting companies and sending innocent people to jail does not engender a lot of hope that that is the case, however.

 

I'm pretty sure the origin of the dossier was addressed in the FISA warrant on Carter Page, where in the footnotes, the FBI said that the dossier came from political entity.

We can either believe that a FISA court judge, appointed by the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court was so naive and legally inexperienced, that the FBI purposefully fooled the judge to get an illegally granted FISA warrant based entirely on one partisan, opposition research document, or we can believe that career professionals did their job and documented appropriately, knowing the potential fallout. When it comes down to believing Nunes or the FBI, I'm going with the FBI. You're welcome to chose for yourself.

Mueller is trying to get to the bottom of what Russia did in the election. If Trump gets impeached over it, then he had something to do with Russia's meddling, and there is proof. It's just like Trey Gowdy told Trump, "If you're innocent, act like it." However, Trump didn't seem to take the advice.

I've addressed Hillary not going to prison many, many times on this forum, and I don't even want to defend her. Bottom line, there was insufficient evidence to charge her, and in this country, guilt has to be proven. That's hard to do without evidence.

The Special Counsel's job is not yet complete, but you've already determined it is completely one-sided and flawed. I predict you're going to be disappointed when his report comes out.

 

If there was a perfect person, that's who would have been chosen to lead this investigation. However, as long as we are human, there's not going to be a perfect person. Mueller has made mistakes. We all do. Hopefully he learned from them and isn't repeating them. It seems to me that he has assembled a strong group of investigators and prosecutors. They know the stakes too, and are likely cross-checking each other's work to prevent problems and errors. Remember that Mueller is a decorated war hero that has turned down higher salaries to serve his country, more than once.

I think Mueller's trying hard to get cooperation from Trump, but Trump isn't cooperating. If he truly knew nothing about the Russians, then that stance makes no sense. The more Trump resists the interview, the less innocent he looks, IMO. We'll soon find out if Mueller intends to play hardball and subpoena Trump.

Something is up though, because Trump's rage-tweeting is out of control. It's like his "tell."

 

Mueller is also close friends and a mentor to Comey, had just applied and been denied to be head of the FBI, and has a team comprised of Hillary Clinton donators and "victory party" attendees.

Also on his team are people who have intentionally withheld exculpatory evidence and sent innocent people to jail.

Mueller's own record in the anthrax case, the Whitey Bulger era and several other cases doesn't help his image either.

I've not seen any evidence that he's looking into any of the other avenues, but I will admit I don't know what all the evidence is.

 

Sorry, I don't buy that for one minute. Mueller is trying to get Trump impeached over "Obstruction of Justice" or anything else he can. The Russia investigation is just to keep the pressure off of the crimes committed inside the Obama Administration.

There was plenty of evidence to indict Hillary Clinton, but the one sided and wholly corrupt FBI investigating her along with the DOJ made sure she skated by, scot free.

This should worry you and all Americans, no matter what your political affiliation is.

 

When asked a direct question about it, Wray didn't deny it. He said this…

“I want to be careful about what I can say about the process,” Wray said of McCabe’s firing. “But I will tell you that my commitment to making sure that our process is followed, that it relies on objective input and that, most importantly, it is not based on political or partisan influence, is something I am utterly unyielding on.”

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/03/21/chris-wray-andrew-mccabe-firing-476785
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Read into that as you will.

When Putin himself, says in a televised news conference, specifically, that he wanted Trump to win, I don't know how you can claim he would rather Hillary had won. Putin hates Hillary.

You did not give me a citation that JOHN Podesta did business with Russia or took money from Russia. I don't doubt that the Clinton Foundation got money from Russians, but I don't see what that has to do with Trump or the investigation to see if Trump's campaign took anything of value from Russians during the campaign… which is a violation of campaign finance laws. There is no Get Out of Jail Free card… because… Hillary!!

 

When all you have is deflection and obfuscation you prove you have nothing to refute the facts.

 

Did the Clinton campaign and the DNC get anything from a foreign agent and Russians? Isn't opposition research something of value? Even if Trump and his campaign had gotten anything out of the meeting wouldn't that have been opposition research too? If not why not?

 

He also said he was not getting political pressure from the white house. I'd say threatening to resign over being asked to fire McCabe would be "political pressure".

I'd also say that since he had already been pressuring McCabe to resign, he was on the same track.

There is zero evidence that Wray said he would resign, and saying he has not been pressured is a clear contradiction to the claim.

You'd be saying the same thing about Putin had he said he "didn't" want Trump to be elected. So now you believe Putin and he's not trying to manipulate us?

See, there's that penchant again talking about Trump, when we know that Clinton spent MILLIONS funding the dossier, then lied about involvement for over a year.

You ignore the case where there is massive evidence of what you're complaining about, to demand we find "if" Trump "might" have gotten something from Russia.

I did give you a document, it was in this post.

 

You gave me a Steve Bannon document- Governmental Accountability Institute was founded by Bannon and financed by the Mercers. Let's not pretend he is a reputable source of information on Hillary Clinton.

Don't you find it the least bit odd that Jeff Sessions, DOJ, fired McCabe, when Wray, FBI, was his boss? McCabe didn't work for the DOJ, he worked for the FBI. Then Bowditch fired Strzok, even though the recommendation was for a suspension and demotion.

The way I see it, people either believe the FBI or they believe Trump. Who you believe is your choice. Trump lies all the time, even when the truth would serve him better. I don't believe him.

We know Putin ordered the cyber attacks- photos and direct surveillance from our Dutch friends. We have Putin saying he wanted Trump to win televised worldwide. We know Putin has hated Hillary for years. Our intelligence agencies, and more importantly, our allied intelligence agencies, have gathered evidence of Putin doing the same thing done in the US, to other countries. That is exactly what happened in Ukraine, with Paul Manafort as the middle man. Then, unemployed and broke, Manafort is suddenly named chairman of Trump's campaign and immediately changes the RNC platform on Ukraine in Russia's favor.. but Putin was trying to help Clinton? Really?

Don't get me wrong. I think most politicians are self-serving and lots of them are corrupt to the bone. I don't want to defend any of them, but I do not believe Russia was helping Hillary in this election. I watched Trump in that Helsinki conference. I saw him subservient and cowed, while Putin strutted. I'm not sure how anyone can look at that tape and see Trump as being strong on Russia, but you're welcome to do so. Fifty-four percent of Americans saw it like I did- disapproved of Trump's performance, but 33% saw Trump as doing well. We see things very differently, obviously.

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-putin-summit-helsinki-poll-american-approval-2018-7

 

As far as I know, the Clinton campaign hired an American company, Fusion GPS, to do oppo research. That's not illegal and has nothing to do with the Russian government.

Did stolen emails get released and did they help the Trump campaign? Simply because they didn't walk out of the Trump Tower meeting with emails in hand doesn't mean they didn't get the dirt.

 

You don't have to buy anything. The wonderful thing about America is you can believe whatever you like.

Since Trump is President, his AG appointment runs the DOJ, and Trump appointed the Director of the FBI, why haven't they looked into the evidence of Clinton wrong doing? Is Trump making sure she skates too? The alternative is that there isn't evidence to charge her. Now, if we start charging people without evidence, we're outside Constitutional rights, and I don't think we should go there.

What worries me is that we have grifters in high political positions, making decisions that no one voted for, and that will impact the average American in a very negative way.

 

I don't know what all evidence there is either. I'm not going to assume that Mueller is corrupt and trying to frame Trump, as some here do. I'm going to assume he's following the evidence and if Trump is swept up in that, that's on Trump, not Mueller. All I can see is Trump raging, and that's not what an innocent person would do.

 

They should have as the evidence against Hillary Clinton is overwhelming. Not to mention all the money she took when she was Secretary of State and funneled into her foundation.

As I said before, the Special Council is corrupt, as corrupt as the Obama Administration and those that let Hillary off the hook. This may be a Republican run Gov't, but the DOJ and Special Council are not. They are Deep State and I suspect Democrats who are running it. Sessions was a sad choice for AG.

The grifters were not elected for a "3rd" term. The SCOTUS has been saved and America is rebounding and recovering from 8 terrible years under Obama. The average American will be better off under Trump, that is for sure.

 

I gave you a document with hundreds of sources linked at the end of the article. I knew you'd attack the source off the bat though. The material in the document is compiled from all those other sources.

No, I don't find it odd, and here's why: Wray came in at the tail end of all this nonsense which is why he said the WH never asked him to get involved. He was asked to clean up going forward. He was a new appointee, and not getting involved with it makes total sense.

Clearly the FBI lies all the time. They've spent the last year and a half dragging their heels, redacting information that was later discovered to have been redacted for non-classified reasons, "losing" the text messages that implicated them, etc etc. Clearly McCabe lied, multiple times, under oath. So did Comey. All of them were illegally leaking information including leaking the story they used to support their dossier FISA request.

Trump has been doing, and is one of the only presidents to do, exactly what he said he would do on the campaign trail.

When he starts lying and going after reporters for selling guns to Mexican drug cartels, let me know. I could care less about what he says about his crowd size or whatever else the media wants to twist into his words.

For someone who hated Clinton, Putin sure sent a lot of money into the Clinton's coffers and had her husband speaking there a lot. Speaking of Ukraine, MUELLER himself has DIRECT ties to Deripaska:

http://thehill.com/opinion/white-ho...t-and-it-leads-directly-to-a-russian-oligarch

I never claimed Putin was trying to help Clinton. If Putin wants anything, it is to grind the US government to a halt by pitting factions in the US against each other, and Democrats have been all too willing to do it, meanwhile having ZERO evidence Trump has ever done anything wrong.

The entire federal government were knee deep in the Trump campaign for YEARS, the FISA on Page gave them access to everyone Page communicated with. They have nothing, because there is nothing. Even Strzok himself admitted there was nothing there.

Trump has done more than Obama ever did in Syria, in Ukraine, in trying to get Germany to stop funding their billions of dollars to Russia over a pipeline, and has put more sanctions than the last administration.

You'll see what you want to see by watching the TV soap opera.

 

Actually that's the first thing an innocent person does: they get angry and they fight back.

A guilty person tries to misdirect and blame others for what they, themselves, are doing.