2018, What Armed Self Defense Looks Like

Discussion in 'Gun Control' started by Texan, Feb 22, 2018.

  1. 6Gunner

    6Gunner Banned

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    You cannot react fast enough to shoot him before he shoots you. This isn't Dodge City, and you ain't Matt Dillon.

    When you use deadly force on a legitimate threat you not only protect yourself and those you are responsible for but all of the criminal's subsequent would-be victims.

    There are times when violence is justifiable, moral, and ethical.
     
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  2. pitbull

    pitbull Banned Donor

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    I don't deny that. But using violence must be well considered. It's an Ultima Ratio.
     
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  3. Texan

    Texan Well-Known Member

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    In Texas, deadly force is authorized to prevent murder, rape, armed robbery, aggravated assault, and also when someone forces their way into an occupied building or vehicle. All a criminal has to do is respect the rights of others and he will live. Why would you hamstring the innocent?
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2018
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  4. An Taibhse

    An Taibhse Well-Known Member

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    You obviously have never witnessed or been in a gun fight; someone being shot doesn’t necessarily stop them from shooting their shooter like it does in Hollywood... that’s why in training you are taught to continue to engage until the threat is stopped.
     
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  5. 6Gunner

    6Gunner Banned

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    The use of violence is indeed something that must be well considered.... before the fact. Waiting until you are faced with violence means you will not know how to react or how to respond to potential violence in a considered fashion.

    That is what training and study of the art is all about. You learn how to evaluate potential threats and respond accordingly, so that when you are actually confronted with the reality you can and will react at the instinctive level necessary to not only survive but to prevail.

    When someone makes the conscious decision to engage in criminal activity, they have to be ready to accept the consequences of that decision. If you break into someone's house in the dead of night, even if you have no intention of causing physical harm to anyone, that person has zero idea of your intent and is not required to ask you about it before they respond. As a private citizen, if I hear noises in the night that indicate a possible intruder I am arming myself before I investigate. Once I confirm my wife is in the bed next to me and not a source of the noises I am conducting myself as facing a deadly threat. Should I encounter an intruder I have zero obligation for restraint. As an instructor of mine once said: "I have all the backstory I need."

    Some would consider my position "barbaric", but only those who wish to view the world through rose-colored glasses and not evaluate it as it truly is.
     
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  6. dave8383

    dave8383 Banned at Members Request Past Donor

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    Of course this isn't necessarily the case. If you hear a noise, arm yourself, investigate, and encounter an intruder, your actions from then on may vary depending on your initial observations. This "I have all the backstory I need", while true in one regard, is also yahoo instructor cr*p. That doesn't mean you may not end up killing him, but it isn't preordained. You are free to continue thinking.
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2018
  7. Texan

    Texan Well-Known Member

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  8. dave8383

    dave8383 Banned at Members Request Past Donor

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  9. Texan

    Texan Well-Known Member

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    Let me complete that quote for you so that it can’t be taken out of context.

    ““I’m a gun owner. I’m an NRA member. I’m a TSRA member,” Panther said. “I’ve waited for this day to happen. And even though I've waited for it to happen hoping it would never happen, it happened.”
     
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  10. Xenamnes

    Xenamnes Banned

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    Deliberate intellectual dishonesty on the part of yourself has been duly noted.
     
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  11. Rucker61

    Rucker61 Well-Known Member

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    I would say "unbelievable", but this sort of lying by omission is all too believable.
     
  12. Texan

    Texan Well-Known Member

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  13. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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    The only actual need you cite here is hydration. All the others are things you assume you need because you find the likely consequences of not doing so unpalatable. Which is Xen's point, he finds the likely consequences of being unarmed to be unpalatable hence he considers it a practical need, like wearing pants or avoiding oncoming traffic.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2018
  14. Well Bonded

    Well Bonded Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Anything to back up that fallacy?
     
  15. Well Bonded

    Well Bonded Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    And reveal your location?

    That's stupid.
     
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  16. Well Bonded

    Well Bonded Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It's not barbaric you have family to defend, not doing something would be barbaric.
     
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  17. Well Bonded

    Well Bonded Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    SOP for an anti.
     
  18. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    Play stupid games, win stupid prizes - if you're in my house and you threaten me with a gun, toy or not, you'll get shot.
     
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  19. An Taibhse

    An Taibhse Well-Known Member

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    It’s not “barbaric” when the potential alternative is harm to you or yours.
    I and my better looking half both are instructors teaching courses from introductory firearms training to force on force multiple scenario situation with simunition. We conduct a number of specialty courses/seminars covering everything from carjackings, firearms safety and practical firearms maintenance, practical ccw clothing choices (men and women), understanding adrenaline and self defense mindset, gun safety for parents, home invasion scenarios (with or without children), and a few other topics. When we do the home invasion scenario training, we cover a range of topics with everything from weapon choice and threat assessment, to dealing with LE and other aspects of the aftermath. A few things we include are preplanning (many people don’t even have a plan for emergencies like fire), considerations with children, communication, layered security, treat assessment (very important if you have children), house/clearing tactics, barricade vs clearing tactics, lasers/illumination, captive scenarios, etc. We have conducted our home invasion seminar at a site of an old abandoned home on the farm property of one of our benefactors (a survivor of a home invasion) for several years.
    To say the least, there are a lot of considerations and subtopics that are involved, but many people give little for-thought or preparation other than having a gun. At minimum, thinking through various situations in preparation would be advised. Having a plan, knowing practical tactics, preparation, and even conducting family drills goes leaps and bounds toward mitigating the effects of surprise, adrenaline, confusion, and mistakes in threat assessment that could result in deadly consequences to you and yours. Knowledge is power, and training and preparation allow that power to be effectively applied.
    One thing I have observed is some acquire weapons ostensibly for home defense and then reveal they can’t see themselves actually shooting someone, intending to use the gun to ‘scare’ an intruder. These types lack the primary, necessary mindset and determination to survive and may experience debilitating paralysis. If there is any single factor I figure essential to survival, it’s having the mindset/will to survive.
     
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  20. Well Bonded

    Well Bonded Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That's very interesting, I have been instructing that using dynamic training trying to get students, for a lack of a better term, resistant to the effects of adrenaline, it in my opinion is what causes many self defense shooters go into tunnel vision and lock up.

    A very important part of preparing students for what may happen and may save them from losing everything after they have a legal self defense shooting.

    While their are fools who define people who prepare for such, as Rambo's, the truth of the matter is they have no desire to kill anyone, nor go through the legal meat grinder they and their families will be put through after.

    They just want to stay alive and assure their family is safe as well, something the anti's cannot or refuse to wrap their heads around.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2018
  21. An Taibhse

    An Taibhse Well-Known Member

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    Adrenaline mitigation is a tricky thing. But, my experience is that the ability to recognize it, and overcome it comes with exposure and is transferable between activities. Inducing stress and failure recover within time limits into training can help. Those that compete, not just with guns, often do better than those that don’t... not something that can be conveyed by anything than experience. But, there are some basics that can be learned that have a positive effect, for example, teaching breathing techniques when placed in stress...you’d be amazed of those that when placed under stress stop breathing, and lack of oxygen impacts anyone both physically and cognitively. Then, there is training, training, and training with failure recovery (many perform well in controlled situations, but experience panic and adrenaline surges when things don’t work as expected).
    In martial arts, sparing or better, yet, competing in fight competition help you become better at self defense the longer you do it and the better opponents you face because in part you are learning to effectively think clearly under stress to the point where it seems as if your body is reacting without thought (it’s not really... can have a whole discussion on that).
    I do advise taking force on force training. Nothing like using simunition, the potential of getting shot doesn’t carry the consequences of real ammo, but the prospect of getting shot still generates the adrenaline). Then, getting shot and living... a good teacher that, not unlike in a unarmed martial arts when you get clocked.

    Where I was raised, I was immersed in the prospect of violence on a continual basis to the point where it was normalized. I found at an early age and later, I didn’t panic under stress when others did. But, there is a downside, becoming too comfortable with stress is not nessessarily a good thing.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2018
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  22. Richard The Last

    Richard The Last Well-Known Member

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