A 25-year-old black man was shot dead in Georgia while jogging, prompting online protests labeling t

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by superbadbrutha, Apr 29, 2020.

  1. superbadbrutha

    superbadbrutha Well-Known Member

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    They have NO evidence this young man stole anything, so any black man that would have jogged by was a suspect. Why are the whites that were in the house not suspects.
     
  2. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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    Greg admits in the police report he did not see Arbery committing any current criminal violation. He sees him running, suspects him of PREVIOUS alleged criminal violations from MONTHS PRIOR, and gives chase on that basis only. That's not acceptable under the CA statute, meaning he's the initial aggressor under the law and cannot assert self defense making this agg assault which led to a death, adding murder during the commission of a felony irrespective of malice to the list of charges.

    I don't WANT to do anything. I'm ANALYZING the law and the facts because I'm a lawyer and its what I do. I'm correcting laypersons on their misunderstanding of fact and law because I enjoy doing so.
    The McMichaels took actions which have placed them on the wrong side of the law. I didn't do that, they did. I'm not crucifying anyone, Greg did that to himself with his statements in the police report.
     
  3. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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  4. cd8ed

    cd8ed Well-Known Member Donor

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    I have no idea what RGTS means...
     
  5. cd8ed

    cd8ed Well-Known Member Donor

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    I saw you load something suspicious that looked like marijuana. May have been a container of basil.
    My suspicion is all that matters through, correct?

    And no, it wasn’t burglary. It was misdemeanor trespass only if the owner wished to press charges — since they didn’t it wasn’t even that.
     
  6. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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    Notice how I answered your question, you disappear for a few days, and now you're back quoting YOURSELF and declaring victory?
     
  7. BuckyBadger

    BuckyBadger Well-Known Member

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    This is part of the first 911 call at 1:08PM:

    An unidentified caller: “a guy in a house right now, a house under construction”. The Dispatcher asks if the man is breaking into the property, to which the caller responds: “No, it’s all open, it’s under construction.”

    The caller then says, “He’s running right now, and there he goes right now,” referring to Arbery.

    The man who called 911 saw him in the construction site.

    If you really are a lawyer, than why are you not using all of the facts and piecing together a proper timeline?

    Wait don't we already have a so called lawyer here somewhere??
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2020
  8. HurricaneDitka

    HurricaneDitka Well-Known Member

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    I think you and I probably disagree about what's "relevant". A history of thievery seems relevant to me, but I realize there are hurdles to having it admitted at trial, and that Greg and Travis McMichael might not have been aware of the extent of Arbery's criminal record on Feb 23rd.
     
  9. ArchStanton

    ArchStanton Well-Known Member

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    Okay mr fancy lawyer....tell us if McMichael had a right to defend himself when he was attacked by Arbery.

    (This ought to be good :roflol:)
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2020
  10. superbadbrutha

    superbadbrutha Well-Known Member

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    Sure you wouldn't.
     
  11. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Attempting to talk to him is not enough. Arbery could have stopped at any point and answered "what do want". Instead he choose to physically attack a person legalling hold a shotgun and attempted to disarm that person and in the struggle the weapon was discharged. Had he chosen the more sensible and rational and civil course had would still be alive, he might be in jail but he'd still be alive.
     
  12. Yulee

    Yulee Well-Known Member

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    Felony? Misdemeanor? It seems in the need to paint the victim as a bad man all the details would follow.

    I mean how do we support vigilante justice without the facts?

    Think just maybe he felt his life was in danger from three men in two trucks, some toting shotguns and a .357?
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2020
  13. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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    And that's not Greg.

    Let's use your idea: Let's say that's Greg. Why would he not tell the police who responded to the homicide that he had 1) personally just seen with his own two eyes the dead man committing what appeared to be misdemeanor trespass and called it in and went in pursuit to hold the man for police 2) giving him all the reason he would need under CA to chase?

    Because he didn't see that. He's not the first caller. That's another person. Greg doesn't see Arbery, by GREG'S own admission, until Arbery is some distance down the street away from the construction site. When he sees him "hauling ass" past him, he claims to recognize him from the night tapes and says that that was what gave him the right to give chase.

    Before you start: And that 1st caller did not contact greg before greg saw Arbery. You can't use number 1 to bootstrap to greg anyway as YOU have to have the knowledge of the crime, you can't have 2nd hand hearsay of it.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2020
  14. BuckyBadger

    BuckyBadger Well-Known Member

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    All of it is relevant. It sets a pattern on who this guy really was and if he had a criminal record and why he was on a construction site that had been previously robbed on several occasions. Just like the murderer that was set free and then he murdered a 21 year old woman. It is all relevant.

    Everything should be taken into account because none of this happened in a vacuum. A series of events happened and in the end, we have one dead man and now 2 other men arrested and on trial.
     
  15. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    And..................Did they flee when they were spotted? Had they been seen before acting suspiciously like putting their hands down their waist when approached? Find out who they are and send the police over to question them or if they are seen again ask them what they are doing while you await the police to arrive. Don't know why you think that mitigates what Arbery was up to?
     
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  16. Foolardi

    Foolardi Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    R.S.V.P. for jailbirds ! Or possible jailbirds
     
  17. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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    He chose to exercise reasonable force in defense of himself after Greg and Travis chased him down, tried to hold him at bay, and he escaped, they renewed pursuit, and blocked his path again. They are committing agg assault that entire time, he has the right to defend himself. If you want to say why didn't he retreat? 1) SYG in Georgia, he does not have to 2) he already had.

    Had the McMichaels chosen not to commit agg assault against a stranger instead of just calling the ****ing 5-0 to handle it, they wouldn't be getting stuck with murder.
     
  18. BuckyBadger

    BuckyBadger Well-Known Member

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    Who was on the 911 call, then? Who called in the report and then saw the same man running down the road, then a 2nd 911 call was made.

    Who made both calls?

    What event led to Greg chasing the man down the street who was fleeing from the site? Why did the cops make 2 passes passed the construction site? Who were they looking for?
     
  19. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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    1) propensity is not available to show that what one did once in the past, one repeated again in the future. You can't even show its MORE LIKELY because of that. Its barred.
    2) Now I'm at the point where I am beyond simply annoyed at having to habitually correct you. Because here you admit Greg didn't know about your ****ing propensity inference and so couldn't have ****ing used it in his ****ing determination.
    You must examine the case from Greg's perspective when HE initiated the chase: What did he know. What did he suspect. Why did he know/suspect those things (ie what specific facts show those things). These are the things that are relevant.
    Arbery could literally have been a serial killer coming back from a kill, if Greg doesn't have the proper predicates to begin the chase that leads to his death, he's still a murderer and so is Travis.
     
  20. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Convince me it was something else. I watch the video of him approaching the house, looking around to make sure no one is watching, attempting to enter one way and the door apparently being locked then going around back and then appearing inside the house. Then I see him fleeing the scene when he sees someone talking on a phone watching him. Shows me a consciousness of guilt how about you? A reasonable person watching the video could reasonable conclude he was committing an illegal act. Then add in his previous encounters with residents. Then add in his previous record.
     
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  21. Yulee

    Yulee Well-Known Member

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    Why not chase the kids who were breaking in?
     
  22. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    You are claiming he was threatened therefore had a right to assault Travis yet you cannot show the threat.
     
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  23. cd8ed

    cd8ed Well-Known Member Donor

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    He was committing an illegal act, it is called trespass.
    Trespass is not a felony. Since it was not a felony there is no right to citizens arrest (which shouldn’t be legal anyway)
    Assuming that he was there with the intent to steal something, when he didn’t steal anything, is a thought crime.

    You are making a ton of assumptions to justify his death.
     
  24. Yulee

    Yulee Well-Known Member

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    I don’t care what you say. Normal people will conclude that chasing a person in two trucks constitutes a threat and aggravated assault.
     
  25. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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    A Mr. Perez seems to be caller number 1. He's the direct neighbor to the site. McMichaels is quite some distance away and 1) doesn't claim to be the caller which is relevant information he would not have left out when he explains why he did what he did at the scene 2) the 2nd call is made by a different person entirely according to the dept.

    3) Different persons. Call number 2 happens contemporaneously with Arbery's death, and all that is heard on it is "black male running down the street ********************* STOP STOP STOP ****** dead air" which seems to track with Greg's statement of what he and travis were yelling at Arbery "Stop stop stop we want to talk to you".
    Again: What did GREG who spots Arbery running past his home which is some distance away from the construction site, who then claims Reasonable and Probable Grounds to suspect Arbery had committed a felony and was fleeing the scene, gathers up Travis and two guns, and gives chase, know AT THE TIME he initiated the chase?
     

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