A bit of Q and A, if you will.

I went back and edited my post before you posted again. If you would like to reread it, I realized some of the points you brought up while thinking it over.

As to the prophet parts, I mentioned that they speak more to the people of the day, and so what he said was what they needed to change because especially hard times were coming. I also mentioned that we believe our Prophets are there if God gives a prophecy, but they aren't necessarily passing out prophecies constantly. They are able if they need to, but most of the time they just tell us what God wants us to know.

 

I read the edit, but besides softening the language regarding "proof", there's not much difference, and my post still stands. Sure, you can do some mental gymnastics to think that Jesus was talking about the interim period between death and Judgement, but that still makes no sense since you have based your reasoning off of "marriage is an important part of moving forward IN LIFE". It's too late to move forward in life when you are dead. And Paul clearly refutes the entire notion anyway, by saying that it is better to remain unmarried. As for the prophet part, I can see that there is no point in arguing that these people are not prophets by pointing out the lack of bona fide prophecies. You can't reason people out of a position that they didn't reason themselves into.

 

We believe that your life doesnt really end when you die, you just wait. You wait in a spirit world where some can learn the gospel and some can have work done for them to allow them to progress further after the resurection and the judgement have passed. After some thought on it, that is the idea I had, and when I say in life I mean the whole life section of the Plan of Salvation, from the beginning of the world to the end, and I think it fits pretty well. I may be missing some key element God hasn't told us yet, or I may be completely off base, but that makes sense to me. As for what Paul said, I don't know. Maybe that is one of the parts that was changed. Maybe there really is something I've missed.

If you are here to try and convince me to believe differently, you may as well stop. I know without a shadow of a doubt thatmy religion is true. It is a knowledge God has given me, and he tells us he can give it to anyone who asks for the truth with faith that they will receive it. This thread is more for explaining what my faith has that others don't.

 

OK, I guess that's it then. If you won't listen to the bible itself, I surely have no chance of swaying your opinion. Enjoy your certainty.

 

I will. Thank you.

 

Might I suggest you avoid expressing the bolded sentiment?

Why not switch it up and say they are right...with a few things you disagree with? I am Atheist but this does not mean you are wrong...just not like me.

 

The thing that I find so disparagingly ignorant of faith is that it sets ups individuals from birth with a naive bias and expectations of a world where things happen for some divine reason by some all-caring god, but the reality is that it cripples people to see reality for what it really is.

Unfulfilled false expectations...that's the reality. More people are waking up to this reality.

 

I am an agnostic atheist because I believe in the natural world. You are a Mormon because you believe in the supernatural world. Until such twain shall meet, we can never be converted by the other in any discussion. But we can educate each other.

Why do you believe your denomination is the right one? What are the specific significant reasons for believing so, especially in light of the many other denominations in existence?

I have a hard time reconciling your denomination's beliefs with the historical record and various other testimonies. I also have a hard time fathoming how faith can trump facts. Any light you can shed on these subjects would be greatly appreciated as well.

Granted I formed my opinions wrt to your denomination based on a couple of websites, so I can always stand to be corrected.

http://ldsorigins.com/introduction.htm

 

your extraordinary contributions probably made you even less desirable. if penis possession is the measure of worth (in this regard), then I submit your talents made theirs shrink (penises). of course, men whose penises shrivel when confronted with capable and self-determining women are generally not big fans of women to start with. if you catch my unsubtle meaning

 

And it doesn't trouble you even a little bit, that you've merely adopted the faith of your parents? How is it possible, given the odds against it - which are so huge that it renders your situation technically impossible - that without having investigated and tried out all the other thousands of faiths just in our world, and given the vastness of the universe and all the squillions of possible worlds and faiths therein, that YOU hit on the right god first go?

I'm genuinely interested in how you explain this to yourself.

 

Many seem to wake up on their death bed ... or around the death bed of dying loved ones. and they wake up BADLY - not a pleasant ride at all, apparently.

 

Why does it matter if others learn about your faith or you learn about other faiths? Isn't it about your relationship with God and not your neighbors' relationship with your God?

 

What comment do you have on the video/s that are on YouTube showing some of the rituals that go on behind the closed doors of the Temple?

 

Former LDS here. The Ward I was in was a stickler for tithing 10% of your earnings and I assume that it's a directive for all Wards to adhere to.

 

And did you need to go on a 2 year self sponsored proselytizing mission?

 

Lots of responses! Let me get to those that I can.

Ah yes! Unfortunately I can no longer edit the post, but I wish I had done that. I am not always the best with words unfortunately. It has come back to bite me several times.

I didn't just accept the religion of my parents. They converted, and I fought them on it. For a good portion of my life I refused to even listen to what they had to say about it. I considered myself firmly agnostic for a long time before I decided to explore God a bit more. I went to a bunch of different local sermons and found fault with all of them before my parents finally managed to convince me to come to their church, and I found fault with it too. Then I spoke with the bishop of their ward, who is a man after my own heart. He could answer all of my questions, not with facts that he could prove, but with enough facts that made sense with how I had always seen the world. It is the reason I gave it a chance, and I'm glad that I did. That is how I got here today.

Absolutely! However, take the last conversation I had with FifthofNovember. Now in the end we agreed that our ideas would always be different, but he brought up something I had never considered. That quote from Paul is something that I do not understand, and I am still researching and pondering it today. That is one of the things I wanted from this conversation. Firstly I wanted to explain my faith, as there are a lot of people that do not understand it properly. Secondly I wanted to see what new things people brought to me to try and figure out more about my own faith. There is only so much searching that I can do before I start to pass over some of the important questions. I am a rather critical thinker, and it helps me to think of all the different aspects of my religion. If there are others like me who enjoy that, I would like to help them out with that as well.

I'm afraid I don't know which videos those are. Mind sharing them with me?

You do not have to pay tithing to enjoy going to the ward or participating in activities, or even making friends. I haven't paid tithing in months, despite knowing that I should. It is a hard thing for me to give up anything that is mine, despite knowing of the blessings. It is a struggle I am going to have to learn past.

No. I have never done it, though I considered it, and my brother never did either. It is completely optional. It is, however, considered a great experience for young adults. For one, it is a way for them to learn how to take care of themselves in the real world, and they learn things like balancing a budget, cooking, cleaning, and living with roommates while still having guidance from adults who can help them, as well as it helps them to learn more about their religion, and bring it past just being the religion of their parents, into being a religion they understand and believe in. And those are just the benefits to the missionary, not to forget the benefits it can give to those they manage to bring the gospel to.

 

How much per month does each member need to pay?

 

I'm assuming you're refering to tithing? If so, it is ten percent of your earnings is what is asked, though members are able to pay more or less at their own will.

 

Is it required?

 

I apologize but I seem to have missed quoting your comment earlier. Ill answer your concerns now.

Firstly, the questions. For one thing, the LDS church has more explanations for things than I have had in other religions. We have more explanations for the reason of life, how life works, and what were are actually going to do after life (if you look back, I explained this plan in an earlier post.) It explains who we are and who Jesus and Satan are as well. It fits better than being here because we're here. We also have a prophet, which is something that every other part in the Bible talks about. The Bible is corrupt, yes, but it also is not connected to my church and yet it includes a similar structure of the religion as my own has today. A prophet, twelve apostles, priests, teachers, elders, bishops, all of it.

I don't say this so I can prove that my church is true to anyone else, but it is parts of my own proof to myself, not including my own testimony.

As for this site... I don't see any proper references. I may need to read further, and I intend to, but another thing I thought of while reading, particularly while reading the notes on the First Vision, is that if these people were in fact against Joseph as he says... would they admit it? It is a difficult conundrum. Certainly they wouldnt want to seem harsh or mean or villainous... and would they lie for that? I don't know. I will continue to read this, however, I suggest you go to mormon.org. i would say it has some of the best information to be shared on the matter.

 

Not at all. As I said above, I still do all the things associated with the church and yet I don't pay tithing. There are certain things that you must pay tithing for, such as attending the temple, because you must be pure to enter it. That's all.

 

So you cant enter the temple unless you pay?

 

No as there is an age requirement among other requirements that I did not meet. I came to the religion when I was in my mid 30's and missionaries are generally young, perhaps in their late teens to early 20's. I would bring the missionaries food and give them rides when needed. The things that I was asked to do by the Church were minimal like occasionally helping out the missionaries and one time talking to a large group of kids about addiction.

The requirement that I found silly was the 10% tithing. I am disabled and at the time was living off little money and the 10% tithe left it so I had to go to the Bishop Storehouse for food every month which was a long way from my home and keeping the tithe would have allowed me to shop closer to home. I get the whole sacrifice thing but never was convinced that a flat 10% tithe was the will of God... more likely the arbitrary will of man.

With that said, some of the best people I know are LDS. Their emphasis on home and family is truly inspiring and I personally know an LDS family who are the epitome of a happy healthy family. I finally gave up on Christianity in all its forms and settled on Deism which is more akin to atheism than religious theism.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQR-a2I5LdE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ms6ny86rXU4

Then perhaps your Bishop and Ward were more lax than mine was. Those who did not tithe were looked down upon to a degree as failing to meet their commitment to God. If you do not have a good tithe history then you cannot enter the Temple and experience for yourself the above videos.

Where does the commandment to tithe 10% come from?

 

I do not think that the Church would classify it in the above manner... but yes... there is a pay wall as a good tithing record is a requisite for entry to the Temple.