A question for Christians

Hmmmm. Curious. You challenge me to provide what Jesus taught and when you see the sbstance of my post, ignore it.

 

I never said that Jesus came to start a new religion. A kingdom is not a religion.....it is a government. The gospel is about the government of God being re-established on the Earth as well as man's place in it.

 

To the best of my knowledge I addressed all your post .

 

I was actually going to start this exact same thread. Since you already did then how about me asking the questions "When and where is The Kingdom established"?

 

The word that is translated kings in the KJV in Revelation 5:10 and Revelation 17:14 is from the same Greek word basileus. Those who translated it as kingdom are in error. If its translated kingdom in one part of the same book then to be consistent it must also be translated kingdom in that same book elsewhere.


Revelation 5:10 (KJV)
10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.


Kings
Greek Word: βασιλεύς
Transliteration: basileus
Phonetic Pronunciation: bas-il-yooce'
Root: probably from <G939> (through the notion of a foundation of power)
Cross Reference: TDNT - 1:576,97
Part of Speech: n m
Vine's Words: King



probably from <G939> (basis) (through the notion of a foundation of power); a sovereign (absact, relative or figurative) :- king.

&#8212; Strong's Talking Greek & Hebrew Dictionary

Revelation 17:14 (KJV)
14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

 

Make sure you use your Strongs to search this out.

"Exd 19:6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These [are] the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel. "

"1Pe 2:9 But ye [are] a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:"

Study the context of what is being said in both the OT and the NT relative to who will be a "kingdom" / "nation" and a 'kingdom of priests' and 'a royal priesthood'.

 

Wait. You think Jesus preached about political leadership???

Um, okay.

 

Where? On the Earth. It was first established when God made man (Adam and Eve) and gave them dominion. Sometime after that they separated their rule over the Earth from being under God's government. After Jesus died and rose from the grave His started His Church, which is God's government on the Earth. When? So God's kingdom was re-established if my memory serves me right on the Earth in AD 31 on the day of Pentecost.

But the kingdom of God will not be here in full until Jesus returns.

 

I said Jesus preach the gospel (good news) of the kingdom of God. A kingdom is not a religion. A kingdom IS a government with at least one king. The reason why Jesus came during the times of the Roman Empire is because the Roman government came the closest to resembling God's government in structure.....it had Caesars or kings over their own territory and domain.
In God's kingdom there will be billions of kings and will each have their own territory to design it as they see fit. The territory will start here on the Earth and will expend outward from the Earth to universe and beyond forever.

 

So you think God is actually like an old guy in the clouds who has a "smite" button on his keyboard and when He hits it, a hurricane strikes or a safe falls on someone's head? This is your version of a Supreme Being that is everywhere?
You believe the final and eternal existence of your soul will be a physical realm with the same petty power structures that mere humans pursue?
Lemme take a wild guess: Because of your knowledge and all around cooler-than-other-Christians quality, you'll be one of the ceasars presiding over others?

Yeah, that was tough to predict...

"And the least among you shall be the greatest"

 

I fail to see how that has anything to do with what I have been saying. But it does show that so many have accepted a false gospel that they can't recognize the real gospel when its presented. And yes, we will have a physical body....just like the one that Jesus now has. There is no such thing as a spirit body.......you will not find that in the Bible. The Bible speaks of a spiritual body, not a spirit body.

 

Ah. So only you have the correct interpretation of the real gospel, eh?

You would have made a fine Pharisee!

The Bible speaks of a spiritual body and not a spirit body? Really? Now are referring to the one you have at home or the actual words used in the Codex Sinaiticus? Perhaps the Codex Alexadrinicus? Vaticanus? You've at least read the Vulgate, right? Because if you're talking about something written in English, you're of course, 15+ translations too late to have even the slightest clue as to the actual words used.
But of course you knew that, being so superior in Biblical knowledge and such...

Fine. You have some belief that makes you happy. Good for you. I would just offer that you might want to ease off your arrogant judgement of all people who disagree with you. People who include Clement, Dionysius, Nicetus, Calvin, Luther, Hobbes...
But what was I thinking! I guess since you're just so superior to those morons, it wouldn't be worth considering that any opinion but your own has merit.
So what ARE your thoughts on the discrepncies found in the Latin Vulgate?

 

I did not say I was the only one……search the web and you will find others who know what gospel Jesus preached, and they will tell you it is not what most Christians think it is. Not that having others believing the same thing automatically makes it right or wrong, but just to let you know that there are others who know what the true gospel is.

Use whatever Bible or translation that you feel comfortable with and show me where it speaks of spirit body or whatever you might believe.

All I can say is it very interesting how hostile those who claim to be Christians here really are and very quick to make accusations.

 

Love it!

You start a thread claiming that all the Christians in the world who don't buy into your silly and ignorant nonsense, are not following the word of Christ.... then you say "others" are making accusations.

It's not that you're ignorant, it's that you don't even know what you're ignorant about. You know nothing of the history of the Bible. You couldn't answer the most basic of questions about the history of the books. You're crap about parables was blown to pieces by the existence of John.

Okay I'm outta here. My mistake was the hope there might be intelligent discussion to be found in the thread. Obviously not the case here. Time to unsubscribe.

Nolite iudicare ut non iudicemini...

 

You&#8217;re going to eat those words one day calling it nonsense. How shock you&#8217;re going to be when you find out that what I'm saying is true. And isn't it interesting how my critics have not answered my OP? It's so easy to criticize, isn&#8217;t it? But I hope what I have said will cause you all to get into the Bible and study it rather than assume that what you believe is Biblically based just because the pastor said it in Church from the pulpit.

 

Sorry that was directed at everybody else but you BFSmith. I should have specified. I knew that you knew. What a perfect answer. Very nice to see.

BFSmith, are you familiar with John No&#275;, Unraveling The End?

 

No, never heard of him.

 

I am saddened by this thread. BFSmith@764

I'm not going to tell you not to judge, I'm not going to tell you that you're wrong. Because, lets face it. You haven't said anything to be wrong about. For all I know, you do know exactly what Jesus taught and practice it in your daily life. You are intelligent. You know how to cut appart an argument. You know how to present an opposing view. You know how to play Devil's Advocate. All these things are great and wonderful talents. I'm proud of you for being so ready to defend your faith, whatever that may be. If only all Christians were as passionate as you are.

Whether or not I believe anything that Jesus taught, Thats the point. He Taught. He instructed people in the way that they should go. And He did it with Love. Sometimes tough love, especially with the pharisee's and his disciples. Sometimes tenderly and with great compassion.

My question is simply this: Are you teaching, or are you Judging?

If its the first, then please. by all means teach in the manner that Jesus did.

If not then it logically follows... Why is it any of your business what anyone believes?

 

No, I am not judging, so I guess I am teaching or at least I am challenging Christians to get back to what Jesus taught and what He taught His disciples to teach, which they did. It&#8217;s time we start listing to Jesus and stop listing to what we might have been told in Church. Just because a person is a pastor or an evangelist does not automatically mean that they understand the scriptures. Sometimes those who know more are not in leadership position, because they may not have the gift of leadership with knowledge. As was prophesied we live in an age where those who should be at the top are at the bottom and those who should be at the bottom are at the top.

Ecclesiastes 10:5-7 (KJV)
5 There is an evil which I have seen under the sun, as an error which proceedeth from the ruler:
6 Folly is set in great dignity, and the rich sit in low place.
7 I have seen servants upon horses, and princes walking as servants upon the earth.

The rich can be a person of wealth in knowledge and understanding&#8230;&#8230;.especially understanding of scripture. The simple minded thinks that just because a person has a degree in theology that automatically means that they understand the Bible more than someone that does not.

 

1Tim.1

[1] Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by command of God our Savior and of Christ Jesus our hope,
[2] To Timothy, my true child in the faith: Grace, mercy, and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Lord.
[3] As I urged you when I was going to Macedonia, remain at Ephesus that you may charge certain persons not to teach any different doctrine,
[4] nor to occupy themselves with myths and endless genealogies which promote speculations rather than the divine training that is in faith;
[5] whereas the aim of our charge is love that issues from a pure heart and a good conscience and sincere faith.
[6] Certain persons by swerving from these have wandered away into vain discussion,
[7] desiring to be teachers of the law, without understanding either what they are saying or the things about which they make assertions.

1 Tim. 3
[14] I hope to come to you soon, but I am writing these instructions to you so that,
[15] if I am delayed, you may know how one ought to behave in the household of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and bulwark of the truth.

 

And your point is.....

 

It doesn't require "interpretation." If you don't understand, I think it appropriate to question your views on things that do require some level of interpretation.

 

I did not ask for an interpretation, I asked what was your point. But rather than criticize what I say, how about you answer my OP and explain what that gospel is?......with scriptures.

 

I did at the beginning of the thread, but I was on your ignore at that time.

And--if you feel "criticized" by what the Scriptures say, that's something else you should consider.

 

And what is the kingdom?