Abortion

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Lesh, Dec 9, 2017.

  1. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    Roy Moore's anti-abortion stance seems to be triggering a lot of people to support him even though honest people (and some less than honest, usually like McConnell) acknowledge that they think he is a child molester.

    Why do you feel so strongly about abortion?

    It REALLY seems to drive some people
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2017
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  2. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    It's the elephant in the room. We might as well talk about it
     
  3. GrayMan

    GrayMan Well-Known Member

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    People are biologically programmed to protect children. People with such biological programming are more likely to successfully reproduce and survive. It is a consequence of evolution. It is driven by the survival and propagation of the species and quality of life has little to do with it.
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2017
  4. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    Well since 90% of abortions occur in the first trimester...it's pretty hard for me at least...to think of those zygotes as children.

    I DO however know that a whole lot of them would be forced to grow up with parents that aren't prepared to deal with them, don't want them, and won't care for them properly. THAT bothers me since those ARE children (often abused) once they're born.
     
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  5. Elcarsh

    Elcarsh Well-Known Member

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    Unlike Roy Moore, who seems more biologically programmed to rape them.
     
  6. GrayMan

    GrayMan Well-Known Member

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    100% of 'babies' put up for adoption are adopted. What prevents these parents from putting them up for adoption?

    Most issues with child neglect are due to drugs entering the picture. Most children who enter the foster care system are there because there parents are slaves to a drug addiction that prohibits them from properly caring for their children.

    If a baby isn't adopted but ends up in foster care it isn't because no one will adopt it. It is because the parent isn't fit to take care of it but refuses to give it up so the state has to care for the child until the parent gets their **** together.

    ****

    Experience, thoughts, and conciousness requires a brain. Brain development starts at 23 days. That is when the potential of a conscious being alive in the womb begins.
     
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  7. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Abortion does not affect children

    However the antiqbortionists in America have very clever in confounding the idea of foetus and baby
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2017
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  8. GrayMan

    GrayMan Well-Known Member

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    Probably a mutant.
     
  9. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    At present 100%might be adopted but flood the market and that will no longer be true

    Look at history.

    Even Australia had "baby farms" and in fact early on there was an infamous case of the Malkins who were taking money for care but killing the infants
     
  10. Bear513

    Bear513 Banned

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    So killing them is not abuse now in your fantasy alternative universe ?
     
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  11. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    They do now...because so many are aborted early. It wasn't that way prior to Roe
     
  12. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    Killing?

    Ending a pregnancy
     
  13. Bear513

    Bear513 Banned

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    Murder, justify it any way you want it's murder
     
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  14. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    And if a young mother is forced to have a child and fails...and that baby is older than about 2...adoption rates go WAY down.Foster care is a nightmare
     
  15. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    Murder?

    Really?

    You have to be a person to be murdered and a clump of cells is not that

    Guess what?

    Abortions are going to happen whether you like it or not. Rich folks used to go on "vacation" and poor folks had back alleys. You seem to want those days back.

    But then you'll never be pregnant so...it'll never affect you...
     
  16. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It boils down to whether you believe humans have a spiritual component or not.

    When a human is just a complex structure of elements, merely 'the sum of its parts', there is no waste in killing a fetus.

    When a human has a spirit, a special life energy that is meant to experience and learn and grow, snuffing it out before its even born and stealing its potential from it unnecessarily is unbearably tragic.

    I say this as a 'pro-choicer.' I hate abortion because I believe humans are more than the sum of their parts. But I also understand liberty, body autonomy and freedom of choice. Banning abortion, imo, is more dangerous to our self determination than the murder of innocents is damaging to our humanity. I think most abortions are unecessary, and thus wrongful killing of humans, but I recognize thats not for me to decide for anyone else.
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2017
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  17. Bear513

    Bear513 Banned

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    This is funny only a leftie would consider murder not child abuse
     
  18. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    We are talking about less than 12weeks gestation although it is now increasingly less than 8 weeks
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2017
  19. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    How can it be child abuse when there is no child?
     
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  20. Bear513

    Bear513 Banned

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    How can it be no child when you're charged once again with double homicide in America if you kill a pregnant mother?
     
  21. Seth Bullock

    Seth Bullock Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The legal definition of "personhood" is a baby that is born. The crux of the debate is that many people don't agree with that definition.

    At eight weeks, its heart is beating. Would you call that just a clump of cells?
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2017
  22. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Is that every state? Does it apply too early pregnancies?
     
  23. Bear513

    Bear513 Banned

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    I am pretty sure...they want the person who did it behind jail forever
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2017
  24. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    And 15 seconds of googling established that although it is a federal crime it does not apply to all states and it does not apply to abortioon
     
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  25. Bear513

    Bear513 Banned

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    You do raise an interesting question...i just always saw these news articles over the past 40 years or so .


    You're right how do they know? At what point?
     

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