Abstinence trends on Twitter in wake of Roe v. Wade ruling (nypost.com)

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by HurricaneDitka, Jun 26, 2022.

  1. doombug

    doombug Well-Known Member

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    I don't care what it leads to. Apparently it is better than getting pregnant. For some reason lefties think women don't have enough sense to be able to use birth control.
     
  2. Pisa

    Pisa Well-Known Member

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    I agree that we have some freedom of choice, both as individuals and as a society. But asking individuals to give up the right to choose sexuality over abstinence means severely curtailing their freedom of choice, not enhancing it. Besides, ability to choose something (abstinence, in this particular case) doesn't automatically imply that that would be the better choice.

    Healthy societies know how to balance individual needs and social demands. Compromise is paramount.
     
  3. Pisa

    Pisa Well-Known Member

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    For some reason, both left and right don't think men have enough sense to be able to use vasectomy.

    Why should only women have enough sense to use birth control?
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2022
  4. doombug

    doombug Well-Known Member

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    Men do get vasectomies and do not whine about it.
     
  5. Pants

    Pants Well-Known Member

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    Unfortunately, your response is about Conservatives and Liberals. I am responding as a woman. It isn't easy to 'get over the notion' of my rights being taken away.
     
  6. Stuart Wolfe

    Stuart Wolfe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You are aware that in this case, the OP is willingly choosing abstinence, right? No one asked her to do it. It was her choice to do so - although I rather doubt she'll stay on that path.
     
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  7. mdrobster

    mdrobster Well-Known Member

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    Abstinence does not work as an effective policy.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/janetw...us-that-abstinence-only-education-hurts-kids/

    This has been tried in KS and IN and it failed miserably.
     
  8. doombug

    doombug Well-Known Member

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  9. Pisa

    Pisa Well-Known Member

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    As long as it's her choice, she can become a nun for all I care.
     
  10. AmericanNationalist

    AmericanNationalist Well-Known Member

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    People called it a 'right', but they never really codified it into law as a 'right'. It is indeed a choice, but not a 'right'(using the term right in the Hobbs classical definition of it.) Meaning something that is natural, ordained and cannot be taken by the government. Abortion doesn't qualify because we are not born with the inherent thought of aborting the fetus. Indeed, as I pointed out financial considerations are the heavy reason for it. And that's fine, that's logical. But it had no place in classical doctrine.

    If Abortion were a codified right in the sense of Hobbs, then Ginsburg wouldn't have feared this day coming. She feared it because as strongly Liberal as she was, she knew that it didn't fit the classical definition. Hence she chose a different argument altogether.

    There is still to this day a debate on whether the Hobbs, Jefferson-ism view of Classical Liberalism is simply an ideal human condition that cannot be met. But where the debate is settled is that is the standard used to codify rights. I do feel bad for women in the standpoint that in the last 30 years especially, they were never taught that abortion could never(and didn't) fit classic Liberalism as a radical proponent that defiles the very notion: Life, Liberty and "the pursuit of termination". Yeah, see how that directly clashes? And because it directly clashes, conservatives are not, will not and cannot accept "the pursuit of termination" as a policy, lest they destroy conservative theory altogether.

    This is why I bring up the economic theory/reality and if you really want to defend abortion, this is now how you're going to have to frame the argument. There's a strong proponent, much stronger than the "my body my choice" argument. The reality that abortion actually preserves families, preserves financial opportunity, etc is a better argument to believe, and a better argument to present.
     
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  11. AmericanNationalist

    AmericanNationalist Well-Known Member

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    There's also that reversing vasectomies is both A: incredibly difficult to near impossible and B: Attaining a vasectomy is life changing, whereas an abortion has no cost to women psychologically or otherwise.
     
  12. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes. Pregnancy is a consequence of having unprotected/irresponsible sex.

    What about that statement is controversial for you?
     
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  13. cd8ed

    cd8ed Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Consequence can mean result, it can lead into punishment. So it becomes controversial as we move from the first definition to the second.

    The moment a person isn’t allowed medical treatment it becomes a punishment.
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2022
  14. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You should buy a dictionary.

    consequence
    nouncon·se·quence | \ ˈkän(t)-sə-ˌkwen(t)s
    , -kwən(t)s \
    Definition of consequence
    1 : a conclusion derived through logic : inference … we can deduce … many consequences each of which can be tested by experiment.— James Bryant Conant
    2 : something produced by a cause or necessarily following from a set of conditions the economic consequences of the war This refined taste is the consequence of education and habit.— Joshua Reynolds
    3a : importance with respect to power to produce an effect a mistake of no consequence a problem of grave international consequence
    b : social importance a person of some consequence
    4 : the appearance of importance
     
  15. HurricaneDitka

    HurricaneDitka Well-Known Member

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    Last edited: Jun 27, 2022
  16. mdrobster

    mdrobster Well-Known Member

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    If actual data is an issue with you...... :)
     
  17. cd8ed

    cd8ed Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Reading comprehension please
     
  18. AKS

    AKS Banned

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    Oh now you want legislation cited. The irony LMAO!
     
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  19. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    There is no negative connotation to the word.

    I'd suggest you follow your own advice.
     
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  20. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    Not even that. There's a side-effect free method that works in 100% of cases.
     
  21. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    They absolutely can be. Especially the Number One option.
     
  22. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    They will claim she couldn't have envisaged conception. They think women are idiots.
     
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  23. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. COMPROMISE. Which means sometimes saying 'no', if conditions aren't favourable.
     
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  24. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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  25. HurricaneDitka

    HurricaneDitka Well-Known Member

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    Do you live in a state that has changed its abortion policies to something more restrictive than in the past?
     

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