All Things Australia

Discussion in 'Australia, NZ, Pacific' started by Moi621, Dec 4, 2017.

  1. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    Good one, Mum.
     
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  2. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn't worry about super.

    Here's the MMT solution to retirement.

    The government uses its currency issuing capacity to pay a means-tested pension to every retired person.

    Since the productive capacity of the economy is always increasing, this funding method will not cause inflation, though the level of the pension might be limited to food, accommodation and other essentials, but at least no-one will be living in poverty.

    And during working years, the stipulated portion of wages will not be swallowed by super - with all the risks you mention - freeing up the money to be spent (or saved) as it is earned.

    One way to understand this is to consider an economy in which workers have mostly been displaced by robots.

    In such an economy, the government can issue as much currency to recipients as is needed to ensure everyone at least has access to the essentials.

    And by the way, there is absolutely NO reason why the government should be forced to borrow money - to be repaid with interest - to fund the current covid-19 rescue-package debt. The government has the capacity to create the funds for that purpose, using its own treasury and central bank....again with no threat of inflation, since the issued currency will only be spent on current available food and accommodation (while much of the economy is shut down).

    Orthodox neoliberal monetarist economists don't understand this because their beliefs are based on the classical school which was developed at a time of very low productive capacity (first subsistence agriculture and later, primitive machinery in the early Industrial Revolution).

    (And these orthodox economics schools tend to be funded by rich people who benefit the most, from the status quo - neoliberal monetarist economics).
     
  3. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    that’s how it used to be but the powers that be decided the country couldn’t afford to keep paying pensions.
     
  4. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    Banksy working from home
    Street-artist Banksy has followed official advice to stay at home during the coronavirus crisis by creating a new artwork in his bathroom that shows his trademark stencilled rats running amok around the sink and toilet.

    The elusive artist posted photos of the work to Instagram with the comment: "My wife hates it when I work from home."

    Banksy, whose identity remains a secret, uses the site to authenticate murals after they are painted in public locations, most recently in the English cities of Bristol and Birmingham.

    The new work, like much during lockdown, can only be experienced online.

    It shows stir-crazy rats squeezing a tube of toothpaste, hanging off the light switch, unravelling loo rolls and urinating over the toilet seat.

    Works by Banksy have rocketed in value. His painting of chimps sitting in Britain's Parliament sold for more than $US12 million ($19 million) in October, a record price at auction for his work.
    8ADAB1D4-4CE8-4364-8401-A586A122E54D.png
     
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  5. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Donor

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    We're all trying to wrap our head around the coming changes. I believe the way to survive this is through "protectionism", the word the Globalists turned into a swearword over the last 30 years.

    According to the experts Quantitive Easing will have few side-effects as long as we remain productive. If government spending cause us to stop working because you receive free money, the whole house of cards will come down. ie hyperinflation, starvation etc. Therefore the cash splash must and will end in the near future.

    It all revolves around productivity.

    Australia mainly derives its income through service industry... these markets were demolished by covid-19 and even if they manage to regain some of it, service industry simply won't be enough for Australia to survive. We need to produce & manufacture... protectionism for survival. This means less or almost no more migrants to take up Australian jobs, Universities are going to have to train Australians for jobs. Pressure on house prices & rentals will disappear overnight. Share & property markets will either crash or stagnate or both..amplified by exposure to Chinese investments.

    China especially are going to have a problem because their export markets may not return... or at least some of it....

    Globalism sucks
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2020
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  6. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    Do you think it’s possible that we’ll have manufacturing again?
    Make things apart from pretty patterns in the foam on a coffee?
    It’s all going to be different.
    What will unis do? Has the market for Asian students disappeared?
     
  7. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Donor

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    Yes I believe we will have manufacturing, Government is already working on long term solutions for Australia to revive manufacturing.

    I grew up in Apartheid South Africa where local manufacturing protected South Africa for decades against sanctions, we had the worlds best and cheapest electricity, the worlds best airline, the worlds best health care....

    I can tell you first hand it is the best thing you can do for your country
     
  8. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    I can remember the good old days when we made cars!
     
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  9. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Donor

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  10. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    Will the NBN co have to get its arse into gear and have the NBN running properly when many more people work from home post virus!
    My daughter, in IT, doesn’t like working from home. She said she can’t feel organised. I think the dogs are sabotaging her efforts.
     
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  11. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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  12. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Donor

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    Berejiklian is talking about a year or longer for kids learning from home. THAT'S A TERRIBLE IDEA, it is the worst thing ito mental health, the isolation is no good for them.... HORRIBLE IDEA

     
  13. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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  14. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    Agree. Kids need social stimulation.Hard choice though. The kids don’t seem to catch it but may well be carriers.
     
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  15. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Donor

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    Teachers can wear biohazard suits
     
  16. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    Yep they can.
     
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  17. billy the kid

    billy the kid Well-Known Member

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    I threw my hat in the air when my youngest son left school...
    I knew he could then start his eduction...
    School in Australia is just a glorified baby sitting clinic....
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2020
  18. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    Yes its obvious food and certain other necessities should not be subject to 'globalist' free trade rules.

    Cars etc not so obvious, given 'efficiencies of scale'.

    Correct: but QE is now known to be only partly effective even while it doesn't cause inflation, as observed since QE was introduced, post GFC, in the US and the EU.

    Incorrect. Think about it. If the lockdown HAD to stay in place, then government could simply - indeed would be FORCED to - issue its own currency for as long as required, to pay for food, accommodation (rent, mortgages etc) and other essentials, without borrowing the money, and without increasing inflation, since the food and accommodation are already available - and will continue to be available (unless the farmers all die from Covid-19!).

    Exactly...never a truer word said. It is NOT dependent on the money supply, but on the supply of real resources AND the productive capacity* of the economy.

    Congratulations, you are an MMT'er.

    So when people ask "can we afford it" you will be able to reply that the correct question is: "do we have the resources"

    * re productive capacity: unfortunately, mainstream orthodox neoliberalism is still based on classical economics which was developed before our highly productive, increasingly AI and IT-based, economies came into being. Therefore they did not perceive ANY role for government in resource management eg a role opened up by appropriate government currency issuance, rather than by taxing (or borrowing from) the private sector.

    and flogging iron ore and coal...

    Correct.

    Yes, and and addressed in my first paragraph above.

    Won't argue with any of this (for the time being). And how are those universities going to be funded?

    Undoubtedly true. And Oz may have a similar problem if thermal coal exports are banned......

    But be prepared for the price of cars to double, if you want cars of the same quality as VW and Toyota to be produced in Oz.
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2020
  19. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Donor

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    There's a lot of short courses available online now, you don't have to wait until you finish school to start learning anymore.
     
  20. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    Are you saying that work is education?
     
  21. billy the kid

    billy the kid Well-Known Member

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    No...just that kids are free to use their brains and study whatever they want to after they leave school.
    ..instead of simply adhering to a school curriculum....there was no internet in the 80s...
    My kids were way behind in their schooling after about 20 months in Canberra, and had to catch
    up in their own time when we returned to NSW...long story....
     
  22. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    One MMT'er has said that while this pandemic isn't likely to be powerful enough to destroy our neoliberal free market economy (by bankrupting it), it might cause the OZ housing bubble to pop.....so at least the young generation who have jobs might be able to afford to buy homes again.

    I'm more pessimistic. I think the government will do what it takes to prop up the housing market, by transferring the funding costs of the covid-19 rescue package onto future generations, thus ensuring permanent 'austerity' as they attempt to achieve balanced budgets, and increasingly relying on charities to deal with poverty among the underemployed.

    Expect the 'job-seeker' payment to be halved again, in 6 months time.

    Fun times ahead, courtesy neoliberalism.
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2020
  23. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    disregard. I misinterpreted her statement.
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2020
  24. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Donor

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    School online learning is going a lot better this week, teachers and kids seem to have worked out the bugs. My son is a talker... and I can hear his voice constantly from his room... clearly communicating with peers not affected by social distancing... I believe he is equally annoying in class too.
     
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  25. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    Shocked face!
     
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