American Soldiers refuse orders to attack Syria!

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by SyrianGirl1982, Sep 1, 2013.

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  1. AboveAlpha

    AboveAlpha Well-Known Member

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    There is a LOT more to this than most people either think or realize.

    A great deal of this has to do with STABILITY of GAS Supplies to Europe.

    AboveAlpha
     
  2. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    Even Israel may have been very useful, helping the US to understand, infiltrate and mess up their Muslim-dominated neighbors. I see a big mutually beneficial relationship there for both nations. And yeah, of course it explains our hardcore love affair with Saudi Arabia as well. Lots of kisses for those guys, no worries about human rights issues and threats of regime change..

    The question is whether this kind of thing could realistically be conspired and implemented in secrecy. I don't want to fall into some tinfoil hat trap with this thinking, but so far it is the best explanation I see behind the US's obsession with the Middle East. I hear from economists that it's the global reserve status and the trading of crude oil in USD that keeps our currency afloat at this point. I'd call that an independently corroborating source.

    Yet no one in the mass media seems to take any of this seriously. I can only conclude that this is due to corporate and governmental control influencing what is covered and what isn't. I can only conclude that they're telling us narratives that at the very least serve to sow confusion and keep people distracted from a very ugly, nasty truth about this nation's real motives for toppling foreign governments and getting untold thousands killed.
     
  3. USSR

    USSR New Member

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    The Truth.

    World Socialist Web Site
    wsws.org


    As opposition to war mounts, Pentagon plans massive attack on Syria

    By Bill Van Auken
    7 September 2013

    Facing overwhelming opposition to its war plans among the American people, the prospect of losing a vote in Congress on a resolution authorizing military force, and unprecedented isolation on the world stage, the Obama administration has reportedly ordered the Pentagon to plan a far wider attack on Syria than had originally been indicated.

    Obama is “now determined to put more emphasis on the ‘degrade’ part of what the administration has said is the goal of a military strike against Syria—to ‘deter and degrade’ Mr. Assad’s ability to use chemical weapons,” the New York Times reported Friday, citing unnamed Pentagon officials.

    According to the Times, as well as similar reports by the Wall Street Journal and CNN, the Syria war plan is evolving to include not just a salvo of cruise missiles from a US naval flotilla deployed in the eastern Mediterranean, but a sustained bombing campaign involving US warplanes flying from bases in the region as well from the US itself.

    The Journal reported that the use of Air Force bombers, which are capable of delivering a greater payload than the ship-borne missiles, is being considered for strikes on “hardened targets” and “follow-on strikes if the first wave doesn’t destroy the targets.”

    “Among options available are B-52 bombers, which can carry cruise missiles; low-flying B1s that are based in Qatar and carry long-range, air-to-surface missiles; and B-2 stealth bombers, which are based in Missouri and carry heavy guided bombs,” according to the Journal .

    In the face of such preparations, only the willfully ignorant can still believe that the attack being prepared against Syria has anything to do with upholding “international norms” and punishing the Syrian government of President Bashar al-Assad for allegedly using chemical weapons.

    The Obama administration has yet to present a shred of verifiable evidence to substantiate its claim that the Assad regime was responsible for the alleged August 21 chemical attack outside Damascus.

    The American president suffered an unmitigated fiasco at the G20 summit in Russia, where he was unable to convince a single government to support US military action. If evidence of such an attack could be shared anywhere, it would presumably be with the heads of state gathered in St. Petersburg. But Obama has no such proof, and every government in the world knows it.

    The August 21 event was a provocation staged by Washington and its proxies, the armed Islamist militias led by Al Qaeda, to provide the justification for not only an attack on Syria, but a far wider war.

    In the first instance, what is being prepared is a full-scale assault on the Syrian government and its military. Among the objectives will be the assassination of Assad and the wiping out of much of the Syrian army. In the process, thousands of Syrian civilians—men, women and children—will be killed as well.

    These aims are being spelled out clearly within the US ruling establishment. A report published September 5 by Anthony Cordesman, a leading analyst at the Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS) and former Pentagon intelligence official, is entitled “Shaping a Meaningful Outcome to US Strikes and Intervention in the Syrian Civil War.”

    “If the US is to accomplish any lasting strategic result, it must carry out a truly major cruise missile strike and focus on changing the outcome of the Syrian civil war, rather than focus on Syria’s chemical weapons,” Cordesman writes. “In the short term, this means a focus on high value military targets that will have an impact on the civil war rather than a focus on chemical weapons.”

    He continues by insisting that “making a limited, short-term tilt in the balance will not be enough.” The US attack, he argues, must be accompanied by a major escalation of the arming of the so-called “rebels,” the fascistic Islamist gunmen carrying out a sectarian civil war on Washington’s behalf.

    This is already taking place. The Times of London reported Friday, “The CIA is supervising fresh weapons consignments from Saudi Arabia and other Arab states to Syria’s rebels to help them to capitalise on a US bombing offensive that could start next week.”

    The massive new infusion of weaponry includes antitank weapons and surface-to-air missiles as well as other arms. It likely also involves chemical weapons from the Saudi intelligence chief, Prince Bandar bin Sultan al-Saud, to be used should another provocation be required.

    These weapons will go to Al Qaeda-led militias, with which the US government is now working in the closest operational unity, to carry out sectarian massacres across the country and in Damascus itself.

    The aim of this campaign is not limited to Syria, but is directed at preparing a wider regional war, targeting Iran, with the aim of removing all impediments to US imperialist hegemony over the oil-rich and strategically vital regions of the Persian Gulf and Central Asia. Obama is pursuing the same predatory aims that lay behind the wars fought in Iraq and Afghanistan over the entire past decade.

    The US Senate convened briefly Friday to allow Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid to formally introduce the Authorization for the Use of Military Force resolution adopted by the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. The full Senate returns from its recess on Monday and is expected to vote on the measure backing war on Syria as soon as next Wednesday.

    The resolution provides for up to 60 days of air strikes on the already devastated Middle Eastern nation, with another 30-day extension should the Obama administration determine that more attacks are required.

    Whatever the text of the legislation, and whether or not it is passed by both houses of Congress, which appears increasingly doubtful, the administration has already made clear the far-reaching scope of its military aims with the draft it first submitted. This resolution allowed it to use virtually unlimited military force “in connection with” Syrian chemical weapons and the proliferation “within, to or from Syria,” of such weapons or any components or materials associated with them. Such language would allow attacks on Iran or Russia or virtually any other country that the US determined was “connected” with Syria or providing it with aid.

    That this remains the aim of the US intervention was indicated by last week’s presence in Washington of a large delegation of top Israeli military and intelligence officials and the steady drumbeat of propaganda to the effect that the Syrian intervention is necessary to deter Iran from securing a nuclear weapon.

    As the New York Times noted Friday, the Obama administration is counting heavily on Zionist lobbying organizations such as the American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC) to pressure members of Congress to back the authorization of military force.

    Whatever the results of the congressional deliberations, this will be the last time any legislative debate is carried out in the US over the impending war. Such is the depth of the crisis of US capitalism, it is driven to a war of aggression, regardless the attitude of the American people, as a means of offsetting its economic decline and intense internal contradictions.

    This is a government of conspiracy, dominated by its vast military and intelligence apparatus and totally subservient to the interests of the corporations, the banks and the super-rich. It is dragging the American people into war on the basis of wholesale lying and under conditions where the overwhelming majority of the population opposes military action—something Obama and his supporters acknowledge. Ultimately, this can be carried out only by means of massive repression.

    The only thing that can stop the coming war is the mobilization of mass popular opposition. This requires the independent action of working people, students and youth in opposition to the Obama administration, the Congress and both big-business political parties. The struggle against war must be joined with the fight to defend living standards and basic democratic rights, which are under relentless assault by the same capitalist system and ruling financial oligarchy that are the source of militarism and imperialist aggression.

    The Socialist Equality Party is fighting to organize this opposition, holding meetings and calling demonstrations across the US and internationally. We call upon all of our readers and supporters to join this fight today.
    .



    Copyright © 1998-2013 World Socialist Web Site - All rights reserved

    The Political Voice of the US Working Class. Or the Voice of American Revolutionary Democracy against Imperialism .

    Obama's Friends "Al-Qaeda Rebel's", read CIA!
     
  4. RiseAgainst

    RiseAgainst Banned

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    For every US soldier who refuses such unjust and unconstitutional orders there are 10 mongrels fully willing no questions asked.
     
  5. Jack Napier

    Jack Napier Banned

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    Indeed. And even if all of the US military refused, do you know what they would do? They would straight away bring in the draft, so that your sons can die and kill for this cabal of demons.

    The true face of Israel.... View attachment 22321
     
  6. RevAnarchist

    RevAnarchist New Member Past Donor

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    After the above you go on to criticize the USA citizens! What is wrong didn’t like the YES answers if the USA was the target instead of the KSA buffoons? Yes I know the intent and why you wrote it as you did but still.....

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    The Saudis would not make a pimple on our nations favorite Allies backside. The only reason the USA allows the KSA to breath their air is because of oil. Without the oil that the USA steals paying for it with near worthless eight cent dollars the Saudis existence would be of no more consequence than a dog pecker gnat. Your charge of hypocrisy is laughable! You should get out in the world, then you might, just might blame your countries own problem on your own country and you (ie citizens like you, I am saying that not for insult rather for the truth). What I mean is that as the nations goes so goes its people and vice versa which means something is ROTTEN in Syria . The unrest in Europe and the ME all foretold in the bible are a result of some things beyond mans control, but the people could do more. But its your ignorant blanket statements that illustrates hypocrisy ie to you all Americans are hypocrites which in and of itself is a blanket statement which by default not valid along with possessing a very strong possibility of bigotry to ride shotgun with the HYPOCRITIAL blanket statements. With at least one Usual Suspect hiding their nation of residence, even lists a mythical nation ‘CYBERIA‘ I suppose all the above should not surprise me.

    If you would draw in your claws and venomous fangs of insult you would find that more people give a poo than you might think. We in the USA some of us care very much and emphize with your countries and its peoples plight. However we are weary of the blanket statements and other backstabbing tactics and it makes it difficult to have feelings for those that need help.


    Syria « Christian & Church Persecution - Persecution.org
    www.persecution.org/category/countries/middle-east/syria/ - CachedChristians in Syria Face “Existential Threat” as Civil War Rages On ... of
    Christians have fled the country seeking safety as a refugee outside Syria's
    borders. .... Dall'Oglio was expelled from Syria last month due to his efforts to
    assist ... The toll of the humanitarian crisis from Syria's two-plus-year civil war has
    been massive.
    LDS Charities gives million-dollar humanitarian effort for Syrian ...
    www.deseretnews.com/.../LDS-Charities-gives-million-dollar-humanitarian-effort-for-Syrian-refugees.html?... - CachedOct 25, 2012 ... With tens of thousands of ill-prepared refugees fleeing war-torn Syria, LDS

    Charities ... organization sponsored by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day
    Saints, “has ... The humanitarian contribution to date has been $590,000 in

    supplies, with ... The refugees were straining the country's infrastructure

    The first post is to show that even though Christians have to flee your country churches and other Christian organizations DONATE and lend help and DO CARE about you and your people.


    Reva
     
  7. RevAnarchist

    RevAnarchist New Member Past Donor

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    vinica.jpg


    A Nazi about to shoot the last Jew left alive in Vinica, Ukraine.
    [Photo Credit: Library of Congress]

    The problem is not the JEWs Jack. I hear statements like that and see in my ‘minds eye’ pre-1940 German Nazi like citizens led by tyrannical Hitler worshiping despots in our future. people of the world, its government. And governments problem is mans problem in 99% of the cases, GREED. I would opine that progressive SECULARISM and lacking righteous morals and ethics are the peoples problems exclusively. If man could (I believe he is incapable sometimes) to practice the teachings of JESUS or even Buddha or Gandhi war violence crime revolutions simple brutality etc would not exist. That said I am against any intervention by the USA or ET in any nations internal affairs. I have said that many times. If I made the rules Syria would sink or swim despite atrocities etc. My obsession with non intervention, ie isolation is healthy for several reasons no reason to list them here. I will post one obvious reason tho‘; The reason no nation or individual should intervene is because morals and ethics are subjective, like it or not. that has made me unpopular among my Christian peers too! anyway ....I pray for the Syrian people.
    .

    survivor2.jpg

    Dachau survivors on the day of liberation.
    [Photo Credit: U.S. National Archives, Francis Robert Arzt Collection]


    mizocz2.jpg

    A German policeman shoots individual Jewish women who remain alive in the ravine after the mass execution. (1942)
    [Photo credits: Main Commission for the Investigation of Nazi War Crimes]


    reva
     
  8. johnmayo

    johnmayo New Member Past Donor

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    Yeah probably but we enforce school loans etc.. I just don't like the idea of 99% of the people ready and willing to do their job while the other 1% make youtube videos that kill morale. I think the military would be better without them, and they obviously don't want to be there so it would be nice if there is some mechanism to sort it out.


    Good signature by the way. This nation forgets about priorities.
     
  9. GlobalCitizen

    GlobalCitizen Well-Known Member

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    Disgusting tactics those extremists use to ramp up civ casualty counts eh? But yet when I and many other people were telling those of your mindset what they were doing in Iraq and Afghan to up the civ casualties, it was disregarded. Sucks they are doing it to your beloved Assad now eh?
     
  10. Silver Surfer

    Silver Surfer Banned

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    First of all, you are supporting them. So you are complicit in crime. If we didn't occupy their countries for no valid reason, they wouldn't have done it. As far as I remember no one invited us to Afghanistan and Iraq. As for Syria. Blimey. They are not doing to Assad, they are terrorizing women and children, ripping off innocent civilians to pieces. And they are armed, trained and supported by our side. Disgusting.
     
  11. GlobalCitizen

    GlobalCitizen Well-Known Member

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    Declare, grant, make rules, raise and support, provide and maintain, regulation, call forth militia in order to suppress and/or repel, to provide for organizing, arming, and governing militia.

    Imo, none of these verbs have anything to do with what Obama is requesting, which is to attack, strike or use the military, or commence or initiate hostilities. Also nothing in that section about making, levying, engaging or executing war. All of the verbs in this paragraph are very different from those in the section outlining Congressional powers.
     
  12. Jack Napier

    Jack Napier Banned

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    The US are a terrorist state who back this;

    [video=youtube;qxb8OFbwMQQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpag e&v=qxb8OFbwMQQ[/video]
     
  13. GlobalCitizen

    GlobalCitizen Well-Known Member

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    The fact that they were armed decades ago by the US is irrelevant to what people are doing with those arms today. I blame the Chinese for the armament of AQ, after all, they invented gunpowder.
     
  14. Silver Surfer

    Silver Surfer Banned

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    That is nonsense and you know it. The arms have been supplied from Libya and U.S. ambassador and ex-Navy Seals lost their lives in the process. So much for your compassion and patriotism.
     
  15. Ivan88

    Ivan88 Well-Known Member

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    The war proposal before Congress is reported to allow unlimited destruction of not only Syria but any other country.

    Looks like we are going into a world war that the American people are not prepared for in the least.
    So much for our precious "democracy" to whom we have sacrificed the lives of millions of people.
    View attachment 22331

     
  16. SyrianGirl1982

    SyrianGirl1982 New Member

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    Dall'Oglio was a moron...

    He sympathized with the uprising and went to Ar-Raqqah to meet with Al-Qaeda and "Islamic State in Iraq and Levant" terrorists. They kidnapped him and beheaded him.
     
  17. SyrianGirl1982

    SyrianGirl1982 New Member

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    Assad has nothing to do with Iraq and Afghanistan. Assad supported USA in Afghanistan and handed over many Al-Qaeda Militants. Americans even had sent Al-Qaeda members to Syria to have them tortured.

    This was the guy CIA had sent to Syria

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  18. GlobalCitizen

    GlobalCitizen Well-Known Member

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    Although I disagree with Syria's "help" to the US in the Afghan and Iraq wars, that was not the point of my reply. I was simply pointing out the AQ and other extremist tactics to increase civilian casualties were also a US complaint, that was widely ignored by most I debate with on these sites, but now Syrians are complaining about these tactics to explain why Assad isn't responsible for the civ deaths. I'm simply noting that it is interesting.
     
  19. USSR

    USSR New Member

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    The US Imperialism .speak with Forked Tongue,or in other words every Government in the World Lies ,hey they all defend the Lie called ,"Healthy Capitalism" or "Democratic Capitalism".or we are not going thru a DEPRESSION, systemic breakdown of the Market based System,called Capitalism . ,nothing Recovery about it for instance?

    Oh sorry I digress from the Litany of Previous Lies from the White House.

    But, on the Question of the Middle East ,being the Direct NATIONAL INTERESTS of a second rate Imperialist Nation called the USA,despite what the rest of the Planet thinks ,Every Thinking Human remembers WMD and Iraq!

    Even the "War on Terror" without end,against AL-Qaeda and OBL like "Evil ones' only to see the CIA ,Operation called AL-Qaeda being its Closest .Ally in Syria!

    Obama ,he who thinks himself DICTATOR for Wall Street is FINISHED ,and smarter heads know this in the Congress and Senate .

    As well as the Most Class Conscious ,of the Ruling Class itself!
     
  20. USSR

    USSR New Member

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    All Democracy ,now resides with the Only Democratic Party left on the Planet ,Lenin's , Democratic Centralist SEP\ICFI,World Party of Socialist Revolution .

    www.wsws.org

    Which ,defends all forms of Democracy ,we are Revolutionists after all !

    And all forms of Democracy lead to and develop from Democracy!

    A Workers revolutionary Government wants only the Perfection and expansion .

    Flowing from the Emancipation of Wage slaves ,Working Class ,where the "Political will" expressed in this Higher democratic form ,of Government .Will be that of the Majority of the People thru ,Intranet Referendum .

    E-Democracy if you will ,thus Updating worn out creaky ineffective out moded ,17-19th Century Bourgeois Democratic against Feudalism ,Government type.

    2013, not 1813 means a hell of a lot as far as the Longevity of the current Capitalist Forms of Breaking down Government!

    Bugger everyday should be Election day ,keeps the Politicians,guessing and Listening to the People.
     
  21. USSR

    USSR New Member

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    Yep. the Reagan CIA Arming of Al-Qaeda in the 1980's Soviet CIA Afghanistan War,the imperialist Policy of US Imperialism ,just keeps giving ,Just Think if Reagan wasn't allowed to direct the CIA ,to do a Covert War ,now not so covert,30years ago ,would led to dead Marines and Ambassadors ,Marines and US Soldiers and the "War on Terror",against the "Evil ones " Al-Qaeda.

    Don't say you still actually believe the dross that flows like Sewerage from Assassin President Obama ,who thinks himself Dictator for Wall Strets interests NOT the Nations ,his and his Cronies ,just as with Bush Clinton Reagan Carter and every President of US Imperialism,as it even eats its own .

    Al-Qaeda =CIA!

    Revolutionary Soldiers of the Republic ,you know the truth ,do your duty defend the People against the Tyrant Government at Home.

    Do I think the Soldiers of the Republic should take out their anger and revenge,at being pawns ,and Cannon Fodder,by attacking everything CIA ,I can hear the Rats scampering from here.

    Make it the Police state apparatus of the Obama Assassin .No longer President of any Nation .except Wall Street!
     
  22. Jack Napier

    Jack Napier Banned

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    We need to start seeing mutiny, not only in our armed forces, but in our intelligence services.
     
  23. danielpalos

    danielpalos Banned

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    Aren't some "intelligence" personnel already in trouble for doing what you suggest?
     
  24. Archer0915

    Archer0915 New Member

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    Yeah. Playin my fiddle dude, playin my fiddle. You got nothing.
     
  25. danielpalos

    danielpalos Banned

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    I believe letters of marque, retaliation, and reprisal are more appropriate, whenever our federal Congress cannot justify wartime tax rates to their constituents and Electorate of the United States.
     
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