Anne Sacoolas charged over death of teenage motorcyclist Harry Dunn

Discussion in 'Western Europe' started by Egoboy, Dec 21, 2019.

  1. drluggit

    drluggit Well-Known Member

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    Killing someone as a dependent and being charged with that crime isn't what diplomatic immunity is designed to protect diplomats from. As a functional matter, are you really ok with the US government being financially on the hook for this woman's misdeeds?
     
  2. glloydd95

    glloydd95 Well-Known Member

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    I can't explain it any clearer than I have. Diplomatic immunity is to protect diplomatic workers from being "blackmailed" by the host country's legal system.
    I certainly don't like the fact that a child was killed by a driver on the wrong side of the road no matter who is financially responsible.
    That said, I like the potential of British Intelligence holding her freedom over her husband's head in exchange for classified information even less. Diplomatic immunity removes that potential vulnerability.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2020
  3. drluggit

    drluggit Well-Known Member

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    Sometimes, all you can say is wow......
     
  4. glloydd95

    glloydd95 Well-Known Member

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    I understand why you don't like it but I don't understand why you can't see the necessity. The United States extends the same type of diplomatic immunity to every nation that has an embassy on our soil. We grant that immunity to their diplomatic workers so that they treat ours the same way.
     
  5. drluggit

    drluggit Well-Known Member

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    Um.... history must not be your strong suit.... The US has, actually indicted folks with immunity. We do it, especially when said diplomats kill our citizens... But sure.... just in your case the google isn't working...
     
  6. glloydd95

    glloydd95 Well-Known Member

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    My history is just fine. At no point did I say charges are never brought. Unfortunately, the sleazy reality of it is that it largely depends on who the perpetrator is or is related to and what they do for us and who the victim is. We have had sons of rich Arab princes commit multiple assaults, rapes, even kidnappings and get nothing more than deported and even that might be temporary.
     
  7. Professor Peabody

    Professor Peabody Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If you say so.
     
  8. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    It did not occur within those jurisdictions.
     
  9. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    The Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations of 1961 is an international treaty that defines a framework for diplomatic relations between independent countries. It specifies the privileges of a diplomatic mission that enable diplomats to perform their function without fear of coercion or harassment by the host country. This forms the legal basis for diplomatic immunity. Its articles are considered a cornerstone of modern international relations. As of October 2018, it has been ratified by 192 states.[1]

    Article 37. The family members of diplomats that are living in the host country enjoy most of the same protections as the diplomats themselves.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vienna_Convention_on_Diplomatic_Relations
     
  10. drluggit

    drluggit Well-Known Member

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    Which, last time I looked, doesn't include murdering the locals. Perhaps she's special? I doubt it.
     
  11. philosophical

    philosophical Well-Known Member

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    It is preposterous to claim that this tragedy is now a great opportunity for the Dunn family to exploit.
    If you asked any of them I would wager that each of them would prefer Harry to be alive and for none of this to have happened.
    Mind you media and lawyers are quick to spin and exploit, they can smell money from a much greater distance than any Dunn family member smelling it as an afterthought as it were.
    If it was a tragic accident then Sacoolas has nothing to fear from the UK judicial system, unless of course another area of spin is one where Americans wish to slur the UK legal system.
    It is a son and a brother we're talking about here...oh and a physical and moral coward.
     
  12. glloydd95

    glloydd95 Well-Known Member

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    This wasn't murder, it was an accident that resulted in a death. It is terrible...it is a tragedy...it isn't murder.
     
  13. philosophical

    philosophical Well-Known Member

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    It is a year ago today since this tragic event and the woman is still hiding away from the formal process.
    The family are continually suffering and there is no indication that she cares one jot about what happened.
    Perhaps she sees it as a casual breakage of a glass on the kitchen floor, no biggie.
     
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  14. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    Mike Pompeo is proud of her. He is lying and cheating his way to $ and power.
     
  15. RICHARDLIONHEART

    RICHARDLIONHEART New Member

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    Sacoolis was in the UK by deception. She was not a 'dependant ' of her husband. He was a decoy. She is a higher ranking CIA operative than he was. He was declared as CIA to the UK, but she wasnt. Thats why she had to do an instant runner, hew own cover was blown.

    She also had previous form for careless driving, she was a menace on 4 wheels when in the US of the correct side of the road, let alone in the UK on the wrong side.
     
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  16. The Scotsman

    The Scotsman Well-Known Member

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    There has always been driving issues with newly arrived US forces personnel in the UK. Their liaison people are well aware of it and in general are very good at pointing this out in there orientation briefings - its very easily done when making a turn on to an empty road and ending up on the wrong side. The issue at hand is not her driving ability or who or what she was. Its the inability to get her back here to face the family that she has devastated and the justice that she has to face as a consequence of her mistake following the total bollox up the UK government made straight after the accident occurred. I don't know about whether she was or wasn't in the CIA - in any case would imagine that with an Interpol red notice issued against her any career path she was going to enjoy is now totally phucked up at home and abroad.
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2020
  17. philosophical

    philosophical Well-Known Member

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    The family are still suffering.
    Wouldn't it be great if Sacoolis surrendered herself to due process?
     
  18. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    She works for the spooks of an Exceptional Nation that holds itself above the law, so she will be holding herself above the law.
     
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  19. philosophical

    philosophical Well-Known Member

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    Quite an exceptional nation if it is cool about the suffering of Harry Dunn's family.
    Other nations might feel a bit of shame and take action.
    Anyway is this about America or is it about the specific character of Ann Sacoolis?
    I have met plenty of decent Americans.
     
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  20. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    Only venal politicians buy into that "exceptional nation" horse manure. And of course gullible individuals who believe the words of venal politicians.

    The woman is a typical product of the system in which she works, the federal government. Her character has been formed by that experience, and her actions in this case show how corrupted her character is.
     
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  21. philosophical

    philosophical Well-Known Member

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    And it is so sad that the Dunn family are obliged to suffer as a result.
    I sometimes try to imagine the thought processes of Ann Sacoolis as she justifies her behaviour to herself, and I also wonder if she has any children, or wider family herself.
    Will this ever get resolved and reach some kind of closure?
     
  22. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    Likely not with Pompeo as Sec State and Deep State firmly in control of the federal government.

    As an American, it's embarrassing and disgusting.
     
  23. philosophical

    philosophical Well-Known Member

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    I see that Sacoolis has admitted the crime of death by dangerous driving.
    Possibly in some version of plea bargaining from the safety of being on the other side of the Atlantic.
    Sacoolis is unlikely to return to the UK to serve any sentence, so she admits to a crime but is now trying to mitigate the consequences for her, but the consequences for the family of Harry Dunn will never be mitigated.
    In this whole sad story the individual killed has been a ‘factor’ to be managed rather than his loss being at the centre of everything.
    I think Sacoolis should return to East Anglia and spend at least a year on unpaid community service in a Hospice.
     
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  24. The Scotsman

    The Scotsman Well-Known Member

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    ...maybe the relatives of Harry Dunn can accidentally shove a gun up her nose and accidentally blow the phucking bitch's brains out
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2022
  25. philosophical

    philosophical Well-Known Member

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    Let me hasten to add that Sacoolis made this an American problem by claiming diplomatic immunity. Indeed Donald Trump got involved at presidential level.
    The woman killed a young lad, ran away, has tried to avoid the consequences by claiming rights due to her being an American citizen.
    I have heard that some kind of American authority steered Sacoolis away from returning to the UK, not sure if that is 100% true.
    Sacoolis could begin to honour the life of Harry Dunn by doing the kind of community service I mentioned above, maybe she should travel to the UK independently and surrender herself up to the consequences as a matter of honour. Show that she is from the home of the brave.
     
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