As heatwave bakes Australia on land, an unprecedented marine heatwave causes fish kills in the ocean

Discussion in 'Australia, NZ, Pacific' started by Bowerbird, Dec 17, 2019.

  1. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    No one is saying that and certainly not the IPCC which, if you had bothered to read it you would have noted

    Here is a summary poster from the IPCC on the physical science underpinning climate change

    https://www.ipcc.ch/site/assets/uploads/2018/03/WGI_AR5_2013_Poster.pdf

    Lots of pictures

    upload_2019-12-19_14-22-19.png
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2019
  2. william kurps

    william kurps Well-Known Member

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    100 years of statistics is bull dust on a planet of 4.5 billion years, heck I trust 6,000 year bible Christian thumper earth more then a 100 year AGW earth any day.

    Proxys are not actual, it's a guestemement
     
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  3. william kurps

    william kurps Well-Known Member

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    We need actual data and we dont have it.
     
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  4. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    And you have anything other than your own opinion to support that claim?
     
  5. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    And you have anything other than your own opinion to support that claim?
     
  6. Nightmare515

    Nightmare515 Ragin' Cajun Staff Member Past Donor

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    We're talking about China selling coal power planets to 3rd world nations when there are cleaner options available that aren't be offered up to counter that.

    Why are the rest of the signatories of the Paris Agreement not offering up these cleaner alternatives to head that off?

    Pretty much every article that I read regarding climate change says that we as a planet do not have time to dilly dally around anymore and we cannot afford NOT to take action now. So where are the rest of the signatories? This is OUR planet, we all live here, the US doesn't have it's own planet nor our own personal oxygen supply over here.

    Where is the EU and the rest of these nations? Are they going to just sit there and let the planet die because the US isn't helping or are they going to actually do something about this? There are 195 signatories of the Paris Agreement, if they all pooled their money and resources together I'm pretty sure they could come up with these cleaner alternatives to the Chinese coal power planets.

    Are they doing that? For the better of OUR planet (Not just America's planet)? Or are they going to do nothing and let OUR planet suffer because America won't do it for them?
     
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  7. Montegriffo

    Montegriffo Well-Known Member

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    Personal attack infraction apart, what evidence of biased or fake news in the BBC do you have?
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2019
  8. ImNotOliver

    ImNotOliver Well-Known Member

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    Ever feel like you are wasting your time trying to talk global warming with an American conservative? They claim it has nothing to do with science and it is all about politics. My science verses their politics. Actually it is not as much politics as it is religion, in that much of the Republican ideology seems to built upon beliefs, more than anything else.

    There is a great deal of anti-global warming literature out there, all of it fraudulent. They will take studies and graphs that came from NASA and NOAA and alter them and then present them as proof of that there is no global warming. It is as if they go out of their way to invent reasons as to why they should not accept the idea of fossil fuel caused global warming. And you know what they say, denial is the mother of conspiracy theories.

    Looking into the demographics of those who have problems accepting the reality of global warming, one finds that they tend to be conservative Evangelicals. They also tend to have problems accepting evolution and abortion rights. Many seem to be okay with a little sexual assault every now and then.

    The thing about global warming is that it is the result of global pollution. Who wants to breathe dirty air? I certainly don’t. The people on the West Coast of the United States tend to be healthier and longer living than those on the East Coast. A lot of it has to do with the fact that the people on the West Coast breathe cleaner air. It is upwind from everything else. People in the Colorado Rockies also tend to be healthy and long living. But then upwind from them is the Pacific Northwest were there are no coal burning plants, and there is very little industry in Idaho and Utah. People living east of the Mississippi breathe a lot of dirty air. Many seem to be just fine with that.

    Plastics may be just as bad a problem, if not more so.
     
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  9. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Thanks for proving AGW is about politics for you.
     
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  10. BuckyBadger

    BuckyBadger Well-Known Member

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    Like what? So far, all I see you doing is pointing fingers (in the wrong direction, by the way) and calling out others for things they should be doing.

    What are you actually doing to save this planet?

    Why would anyone attack you for doing things that would help? BTW, the Paris Accords were a joke.

    Furthermore, you should be directing all of your ire and rage at China, who is the worst polluter on the planet (Maybe 2nd to India at this point, who knows for sure) and has a history of lying and cheating on agreements and stealing other countries Intelelctual Property.

    The weakness of the Paris Agreement was that it was lopsided, requiring little from China and a great deal from the U.S. President Obama committed the United States to reducing carbon emissions in 2025 by 26 to 28 percent, which would have meant a substantial jump in electricity costs.

    https://thehill.com/opinion/energy-...missions-prove-trump-right-on-paris-agreement

    "By contrast, in China, coal use has trended higher recently, driving emissions up. Coal consumption, according to Beijing’s own (questionable) statistics, rose 0.4 percent in 2017, producing some backpedaling among those optimistic about China’s compliance with the Paris accord. Others estimate the increase at between 1 percent and 5 percent.

    It is difficult to know, given China’s history of fudging the numbers. In the lead-up to the Paris talks, for instance, it became obvious that China was burning 17 percent more coal than it had admitted, a variance the New York Times described as “immense."


    If you want a real conversation on climate change, you can start by calling the planets worst offenders and not the countries with the lowest carbon footprints who are actually already taking steps to improve the planet.
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2019
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  11. Badaboom

    Badaboom Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Without any way to enforce those treaty, by force if necessary, China won't respect it.
     
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  12. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    There are more ways of putting pressure on than head on attack
     
  13. Badaboom

    Badaboom Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Not against a superpower like China.
    You can scream and pout, hold rally and march in you downtown all you want but the Chinese Communist Party don't care one iota. You can sign all the treaties and petitions in the world but they'll still continue to put people in camps, torture, murder and polute all they want. Nothing you can do about it unless you're ready to threaten themn with force. Any embargo or other drastic measure will be considered an act of aggression.
     
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  14. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    A) when have I “pointed fingers” in relation to personal responsibility
    B) Paris Agreement was not perfect but it was something
    C) what do you personally want me personally to do about China?
     
  15. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Oh! Ye of little ............

    One of the things China is doing is selling coal fired power stations cheap to third world countries

    We get a consortium together and undercut with cheaper renewables at a better deal and we have that country as our ally not Chinas, we have done good for the environment and we have denied China an asset
     
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  16. BuckyBadger

    BuckyBadger Well-Known Member

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    A) This entire thread
    B) Something that enabled China and India so it was worthless. The US is already reducing it's footprint without a stupid piece of paper that other countries would ignore
    C) Go crusade against them since you are so worried.

    You still avoided the most basic question:

    What are you actually doing to reduce your carbon footprint? What are you doing to save the planet.

    Do you own an iphone? :)
     
  17. Badaboom

    Badaboom Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The vast majority of china's polution is in china itself. Your consortium won't do ****.
    Also, the chinese aren't just selling those station, they're also bribing those politicians. Your ethical standards won't let you do the same. The chinese plays by a different set of rules.
     
  18. william kurps

    william kurps Well-Known Member

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    So now Australia had thermometers in the 1500's?
     
  19. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    I am sure too which is why I will be contacting my local politicians to put pressure in them
     
  20. william kurps

    william kurps Well-Known Member

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    Coal plant Oregon



    The Boardman Coal Plant is a coal-fired power plant located in Boardman, Oregon. The facility has a nameplate capacity of 550 megawatts (MWs) and is operated by Portland General Electric.
    upload_2019-12-19_9-7-47.png
    Wikipedia › wiki › Boardman_Coal...
    Boardman Coal Plant - Wikipedia
     
  21. Pred

    Pred Well-Known Member

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    If any of these countries actually gave a **** and if any of these AGW politicians, pundits, celebrities and CEOs gave a crap, they would be lining up to put CHINA on the chopping block. But nope. They sign deals with them. They hand over control to them. EU is literally handing over all their privacy to them if they allow them to install servers that will control their infrastructure. China can easily back door their way in and have any of them at their mercy.

    Remember, China doesn't care about human rights. They will happily and strategically allow people to die horribly if it gives them more power and control. They truly don't care. Not once in their entire history have they showed that human rights are a priority at all.

    Makes you wonder how Trump is the bad guy, since he's the only one who has really tried to reign them in. No wonder all the world relies on us. None of them have the spine to do a damn thing. All talk. No balls.
     
  22. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No one has ever suggested that going to renewables isn't a good idea.

    Where your plan breaks down is the rush to shut down existing forms of energy production to meet basic needs for no reason other than hysteria and tear duct activity.

    What really stops us from expansive renewable energy production? Government greed.

    The government looks at renewables and understands they will be missing out on the revenue produced by the oil and gas industry.

    That's the real reason they're trying to make "climate change" a religion backed up by the "science" they manufacture: to make money off free energy from the sun.

    Besides, from a glance, it looks like about 6% of Australia's energy needs are met by renewables. I wouldn't call that "working".
     
  23. Nightmare515

    Nightmare515 Ragin' Cajun Staff Member Past Donor

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    I struggle to understand the problem then.

    195 signatories of the Paris Agreement, without including the US that represents around 80% of the greenhouse emissions being produced on the planet. The US leads the world is reducing greenhouse emissions and leads the world in putting pressure on China economically by a long shot. Chinese growth = more pollution.

    So without being in the Paris Agreement the US leads the world in greenhouse gas reductions and puts the most pressure out of anyone else on China. And without including the US the Paris Agreement still comprises virtually the entire planets worth of nations anyway if who actually worked together and pooled resources could outspend what the US could in order to produce renewable energy power sources for impoverished nations.

    Why exactly does the US need to be part of this agreement? We seem to be doing more than everybody else is without it. And what benefit does this Agreement serve the US outside of forcing us to reduce our emissions even more than we already do, which is again more than ANYBODY ELSE?

    It is unfair and hypocritical of the rest of the planet to keep asking the United States to do MORE, when we already do more than everyone else does. How about instead of asking the US to keep giving more money and doing more to reduce emissions the rest of the planet catches up to us since we are leading the way.

    Tell the rest of the planet to catch up to the United States first in regards to saving the planet and then we'll talk about your global agreement. Deal?
     
  24. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Donor

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    Ref.: Construction of Fresh Water, GREAT Interior Australian Lakes.
    Desalinate and pipe it in. Create deep basins to avoid a shallow puddle.
    Connected to one another.


    Elon Musk could bring the project in.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Los_Angeles_Aqueduct
    It only takes "vision".


    Imagine all that land in agricultural production.
    Rain from the lakes evaporation.
    The possibilities.
    Including a cooler climate.


    Moi :oldman:



    STOP :flagcanada:
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2019
  25. politicalcenter

    politicalcenter Well-Known Member

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    "Let them die and be done with it and decrease the surplus population" Ebenezer Scrooge.
     

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