Biden: America will be a beacon of hope for LGBTQ rights again

Discussion in 'Gay & Lesbian Rights' started by ProgressivePatriot, May 19, 2020.

  1. btthegreat

    btthegreat Well-Known Member

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    Don't bullshit me. Trump wasn't asked because he wasn't in politics. We have been this road before and I will not let you cherry pick and mislead.
    Come up the date and the direct quote that Trump first publicly endorsed 1. A policy that allowed gays of any sort open or not, to stay in the military. 2. Support for national inclusion under the 1964 civil rights act for federal protection 3. federal right to same sex marriage and we can compare the dates with various Dems or shut up. The reason you don't have the same prior quotes is because he was not asked for specifics as early as actual politicians were, who needed to take a stance because reporters, or the Gay alliance were interviewing them for specifics on policy.

    And no, opposition to Islamophobia, and support for Muslim American rights, or meeting with Muslim leaders or showing respect for the faith, does not constitute an anti gay platform. What you need is actual quotes from Barak Obama endorsing abusive treatment of gays or lesbians internationally to show that he supported same.

    Don't take us for stupid. Do not cherry pick or move the goal post change the topic. Just come up with the quotes and the dates I asked for.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020 at 1:25 AM
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  2. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    When he was running for president? Yes he was.
    Good, I don't have to. Show me during temps campaign or presidency where he stated he was against LGBT rights.
    So your point is Democrats pander? Thanks I already knew that.
     
  3. btthegreat

    btthegreat Well-Known Member

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  4. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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  5. btthegreat

    btthegreat Well-Known Member

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    So you are discounting every quote by a dem as pandering except not Trumps? Check out my links they fully document their respective histories. You are not telling the truth.
     
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  6. btthegreat

    btthegreat Well-Known Member

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    This isn't an argument. Its about facts. You don't have any.
    I supplied the links you refused to. I supplied my evidence when you can't. Of course you will ignore it. You did last time when I called you out. You are fully and completely discredited. What are you doing here?
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020 at 1:50 AM
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  7. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    There is no such thing as islamophobia. Islam kills more Muslims than anything else.

    One could say showing Adolf Hitler respect wasn't anti Jewish, I don't know that is believe that so your claims are pointless.
    no idea what you are talking about here.
    I don't, I'm just not interested in kissing ass with your moronic messiahs they are just Jack ass politicians to me.
    I charge $175.00 am hour, 3 hour minimum. If you want me doing work for you contact me via private message to for payment methods.
     
  8. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    I'm not interested in proof that politicians pander, I knew that before your little fit.

    So I'm not interested in your links.

    Thanks though.
     
  9. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    then dismiss my claims.

    I'm not interested in links I didn't ask for links, so I don't care about your worthless links.
    oh dear I don't have any credibility with some nobody on the internet whatever will I do.

    :roflol::roflol:
    Whatever I feel like doing.

    If you think I'm breaking the rules by doing that then report me.
    :giggle:
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020 at 2:16 AM
  10. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    Oh, no, not at all. Trump panders. Every politician does.

    You are the one that seems to think politicians you like don't pander.

    I'm not interested in your garbage, I'm sorry you wasted your time picking through all that nonsense but maybe you should get your priorities in order.

    I'm the only one telling the truth to myself. you are lying to yourself if you think the politicians you agree with give a s*** about you.
     
  11. btthegreat

    btthegreat Well-Known Member

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    No your politicians did not give a **** about you, and that is your little drama and your personal disappointment, but it is not mine and you don't get to rewrite history because you cannot handle the political choices you made and the betrayal they may have represented. You own it, you deal with it, but don't betray gay rights history for your own demons. I know exactly what Democrats did, and exactly when they did it and I know the impact. Trump was the same trash on gay rights as Nixon, Reagan, Bush etc pandering to the Christian right.

    Its no wonder you won't do the work on this issue.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020 at 2:28 AM
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  12. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    Lol personal garbage means very little, except for the fact that I got under your skin and I find that hilarious.
    yes Democrats did nothing and had no impact same as Republicans.

    And of course politicians pander to anybody that will guzzle down there Kool-Aid. You're the only one that thinks they don't only magically when you agree with them.

    It's a keen skill to know when you are being pandered to. If magically none of the politicians you like are ever pandering to you, you lack that skill.
    I don't work for free. $175 an hour 3 hour minimum.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020 at 2:56 AM
  13. btthegreat

    btthegreat Well-Known Member

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    Its clear, you had to make a choice I didn't, because my ideology and my orientation did not conflict like yours did, and you can't handle the ramifications, so you minimize the consequences into one giant cynical "all politicians are no good lyin panderers who did nothing good for gay people' , because you did not vote for the ones that did. Its okay to betray the gay rights agenda and support what you perceive is a larger good. Its a respectable trade off. Its not okay to try to deceive others with your own self deception.

    I can show that Democrats said more, and did more consistently for gay civil rights and equality from opposing sodomy laws, marching against police harrassment , to promoting equality in housing, employment and public service, to embracing civil unions, and same sex marriage equality and I can corrolate judicial decisions to which party appointed the justices. All you can do is sneer and sneer and sneer than none of it meant anything, because you weren't part of any of it.
     
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  14. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    Meh I've been called worse. you're essentially just calling me and Uncle Tom and it's rather hilarious.
    I think this is an existential crisis for you.
    that someone said something that you know is true and you desperately don't want it to be.

    I will always speak my mind, and I won't be bullied into silence by someone who thinks they can take away my gay card.


    I don't care how good you think your Kool-Aid tastes guzzle it down for the rest of your life for all I care.

    I am not like you I'm okay with people not agreeing with me. I'm just not that narcissistic.
    No I give credit to the people who deserve it. I sneer at you for trying to take it away from them, so you can campaign for your emperor.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020 at 3:36 AM
  15. btthegreat

    btthegreat Well-Known Member

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    No I am not calling you an uncle Tom. I am saying you had a legitimate conflict that does not represent a personal cowardice or weakness or some sort of internalized homophobia. This is very different. Its like a pro choice Republican who happens to be an abortion provider. He'd have to betray his profession and his pro choice stance to remain loyal to his other views which may include issues of national security, economic liberty and a specific view of the limits of the Constitution anti-textualism. My problem is that you can't seem to admit the conflict required choices that really mattered and impacted people.

    Its as though I was arguing that even though there are fewer abortions, fewer abortion clinics, fewer people who perform abortions and more restrictions and regulations on the providers and the procedure than there were twenty years ago, the republican party and its politicians in red state legislatures and Congress had absolutely nothing to do with any of it. Its utterly ludicrous and if I refused to address the specific links and citations to the specific statutes and administrative laws enacted by republicans in Lousiania, Alabama, Kansas, Texas, Arkansas, Georgia etc over the years, and the declines in those states, I would look ludicrous myself.

    I have proven that you are factually wrong and it is sitting in those links. You won't look at them or refute them or rebut a word because you can't. All you have left is denial and references to 'koolaid' and 'pandering' Your personal and political dilemma and conundrum is your own. Don't visit it on the history of gay rights or the political agenda and aspirations of either political party.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020 at 4:18 AM
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  16. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    yeah it's just personal crap and I don't care.
    no you haven't. Links to pandering does not prove that there is not pandering
    I'm not interested in refuting pandering.
    and you can't prove your links to pandering or anything--but pandering so all you have is personal crap.
    See personal crap.
    Yeah don't dare blaspheme your gods huh?

    Guzzle that Kool-Aid.
     
  17. btthegreat

    btthegreat Well-Known Member

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    Its not personal for me. I got what I wanted by marching and supporting politicians who actually did something. When statements are followed by votes which lead to results its not just pandering. Its progress. The links show the trail. They show who said what, who did what and who opposed the entire movement. Progress is what we got from Democrats and its what we never got from Republicans, including Donald Trump. We have a right to openly date, have sex, and socialize thanks to Democrats rolling back sodomy laws. We now have a right to equality in housing employment and service thanks to Democrats ensuring our place in state and municipal civil rights laws. We have a right to serve in the military, to marry and to adopt children thanks to democrats. Either they voted for legislators and legislation, or they voted for judges that wrote crucial decisions but either directly or indirectly a mutually beneficial alliance ushered in protections that you and your sort never did a damn thing to make happen. You choice to abandon the gay rights movement for conservativism. Own it and stop acting as though nobody did anything effective because you had no part in any of it.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020 at 6:17 AM
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  18. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    Still taking accomplishment away from the people that actually did something to apply faux nobility to your god emperors.
     
  19. btthegreat

    btthegreat Well-Known Member

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    There is nobody who did anything that I don't acknowledge. you just have to prove they actually did something with links just as I supplied. Don't bother with Trump again on any issue. He was never early on anything. I have his quotes and the dates sitting at my fingertips and I can compare them with either Clinton or Obama or Biden. He was still opposed to same sex marriage equality, until after he won the nomination in 2016 when he started to move toward the center. You will lose.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020 at 6:57 AM
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  20. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    I don't have to actually show anything.

    I'm not what are you going to do about it.
    I never bothered with Trump in the first place you did. I was just mentioning how Democrats aren't allies to gay people. They actively want to take away some of our rights for instance second amendment rights.

    You don't want to talk about that because you want to talk about Trump.

    I'm not interested in all the things you hate about Trump. See where you are bringing it up again.

    on the topic of Trump's bowel movements shape size color texture and frequency I surrender I yield to the expert you are clearly far too obsessed with that man to have a discussion about anything else.

    When you ready to talk about anything else that would be interested.
     
  21. btthegreat

    btthegreat Well-Known Member

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    Oops funny thing about this place. The first post of yours I responded to.
    "
    Polydectes said:

    I'm sorry to break this to you but Donald Trump is the first pro-lgbt rights President we've ever had.

    Bill Clinton enacted defense of marriage act, and he believed that marriage is between a man and a woman only. George Bush supported those things. Barack Obama in his campaign said that he believed marriage was between a man and a woman only and he did nothing to further LGBT rights. In fact I'd say be hindered them globally by being apologetic for Islam.

    Hillary Clinton was against same-sex marriage when she ran the first time.

    It doesn't seem to be a thing that Trump is concerned with it seems to be something Republicans are concerned with but then again Trump is a bit out of the ordinary for a Republican"

    Except he has never been pro LBGT rights at all. Never, Polydectes. Matter of fact he was later endorsing Same sex marriage rights than Obama, or Clinton or Biden or even Jimmy Carter. https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-plans-reverse-marriage-equality-elected-president/This was from 2016
    " When Wallace questioned if Trump truly meant that he “might try to appoint justices to overrule the decision on same-sex marriage,” the candidate responded by affirming that he “would strongly consider that.”

    Trump was clearly courting a political base with his answer about reversing the legality of same-sex marriage, but when asked if he planned to pursue such a course of action, Trump said only that he’d “consider it” (which is Trump’s stock answer to a plethora of policy issues: a non-committal assurance that he will “look into” or “consider” a potential course of action).
    "In September 2016, Donald Trump vowed to sign the so-called “First Amendment Defense Act” (FADA), if passed by Congress, a bill that aims to prevent the federal government from enforcing marriage equality by taking punitive action against individuals, corporations, or organizations who discriminate against same-sex married couples. Critics say the bill would effectively legalize such discrimination" Nobody on the democratic side was considering appointing judges to consider overturning that precedent because they had all evolved about a decade before and were endorsing a federal right to marriage. The reason you don't have quotes showing his 'evolution' prior to the early 2000's is exactly the same reason you can't show Bernard Arnault or Warren Buffet 'evolving' NOBODY WAS FOLLOWING BILLIONAIRES WITH A CAMERA OR MICROPHONE ASKING THEIR OPINION on civil rights policies.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020 at 10:32 AM
  22. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    Can you describe this "koolaid" you are referring to?
     
  23. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Trump lies?
     
  24. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    Which lie are you referring to?
     
  25. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    take your pick, there is so many, Trump pretty much breaths lies
     

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