Boeing 737 Max 8 Ethiopia Airlines Crash

Discussion in 'United States' started by flyboy56, Mar 13, 2019.

  1. DivineComedy

    DivineComedy Well-Known Member

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    One day a car will be approaching a gunman about to shoot a tiny infant and mother, and the car will stop, the driver will scream at the car, because it stopped, and then the hero will get a bullet in his brain as well.

    Eventually that orange airplane that kept buzzing around with the real dummy in the plane (not long after I went to "A" school with Iranians in Memphis), taking off and landing, will be their lot, like the caboose, except there won't be anybody on the ground flying it. Pilots just cost too much, just put a fracking computer in charge.
     
  2. flyboy56

    flyboy56 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Thanks. What doesn't make sense to me is why didn't they just pull back on the yoke to bring the nose back up instead of trying to use the elevator trim switches on the yoke? They never lost hydraulic power to the elevator which is a seperate system from the trim tab system. The larger elevator surface should easily over ride the smaller trim tabs. At this point they were not yet in a steep high speed dive which would/did eventually place extreme pressure on the control surface making it impossible for both pilots to pull the yoke back.

    They flip a pair of switches that disables the trim system, and along with it the MCAS.

    8:41:46 a.m.: The pilots have made a mistake that is easy to overlook amid the confusion, but which will have severe consequences. When they shut off the electric trim system to disable MCAS, they also shut off their ability to use the electric switch on the top of their yokes to trim the stabilizer back into a neutral position.
     
  3. flyboy56

    flyboy56 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    In 1974 I went on several training flights (UH1 helicopter) with South Vietnamese pilots. I found them to be quick learners and good pilots. I do believe redundant automation using computers will make transportation far safer.
     
  4. DivineComedy

    DivineComedy Well-Known Member

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    Eventually it will be far safer, as a motorcyclist I want the cars to stop while the driver is texting.

    A computer could fly now, but until it can create it's own code it can't do what humans sometimes do to get out of situations that can't be done by the book. The computer simply does what it is told, in an emergency it was told to fly the plane into the ground by its designer, it did that.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2019
  5. flyboy56

    flyboy56 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No, Boeing did not whip the certification. They did use FAA designated inspectors which I do have a problem with. But it doesn't mean the inspectors didn't do a thorough inspection.
     
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  6. flyboy56

    flyboy56 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Unfortunately humans don't always do what they are told. Baggage, stress, tired, etc. comes with humans.
     
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  7. flyboy56

    flyboy56 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I should have been more specific. The elevator trim tabs can be used while AP is engaged but not aileron trim tabs. That function is prohibited when AP is engaged.

    LIMITATIONS Autopilot/Flight Director System # Use of aileron trim with the autopilot engaged is prohibited.

    https://www.slideshare.net/theoryce/b737-ng-flight-controls
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2019
  8. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    ANN (Africa News Network)? :)
     
  9. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Why the heck didn't the Boeing CEO come out and say he was saddened and distressed by the two crashes, then vow to work tirelessly on a personal level to get answers? He did--sorta--but not with anything smacking of sincerity.
     
  10. yasureoktoo

    yasureoktoo Banned

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    They had to say something, but didn't have anything conclusive yet.

    I doubt they want to say the guy got his pilots license through afirimitve action
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2019
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  11. DivineComedy

    DivineComedy Well-Known Member

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    The inspection could be fine, then the vertical stabilizer fills with water, like a bath tub, that much water, and there is a vary rare set of circumstances where that could happen. Or maybe the radios go out, and you find out that particular coax dielectric shrinks in Antarctica; perfectly fine everywhere else.

    Neither the designer or the inspector intends to fail, but sometimes they don't anticipate the out of the ordinary, and twenty or more pages of a topic in hindsight they didn't have.
     
  12. yasureoktoo

    yasureoktoo Banned

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    A requirement to fly into international airports is you must read and write the English language.

    I have met some of these people and they don't seem to be too good at it.
     
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  13. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    A single input on a poorly documented critical system that overrides the pilot...? Doesn't seem like a good idea.
     
  14. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Nor can any longer anyone who was on it.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2019
  15. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Roger that. :applause:
     
  16. DivineComedy

    DivineComedy Well-Known Member

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    Emotions, all I know is how I felt when one of our planes deposited an instrument 30 feet underground, I bet he felt the same way, everybody was in a terrible mood that day, I remember exactly where I was sitting in the Nose of an airplane when an inspector came up to recertify me for some itsy bitsy little very special coax. I don't think there is a conspiracy in everything.
     
  17. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    A lot of the public discussion keys on personalities and I think the rather flat public statement by the CEO helped turned the reporting against Boeing.

    Anyway, my comment is a bit of an aside because what the Boeing CEO says on TV isn't all that important in the end.
     
  18. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    But did you not hear that because the news came from Ethiopian Airlines it can't be true (regurgitating)? In my book, this is xenophobic

    And here are some comments from 8 posts in this thread about inferior "foreign" pilots:

    There's another issue...
    Shithole airlines from shithole countries with shithole pilots in the cockpits of high end Boeing 737's.

    The co-pilot of the Ethiopian plane had only 200 hours of stick time. This is an AIRLINE PROBLEM, not an AIRPLANE PROBLEM.

    But the American pilots actually know how to fly a plane without depending on technology.

    Ethiopian airline pilots only experience with computers was playing Donkey Kong.

    That's what a PILOT would do. These 3rd world airlines don't employ PILOTS, they employ SYSTEM OPERATORS. And that's the problem

    Not pilots... system operators. Pilots would have known how to take control of the plane.

    Most shithole countries don't have much of an air force meaning shithole airlines shithole pilots don't have much experience with dealing with emergencies in the air.

    I doubt they want to say the guy got his pilots license through afirimitve action

     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2019
  19. yasureoktoo

    yasureoktoo Banned

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    These aren't true, an airline pilot has lots of flight time, and classroom studying..
    I am not sure if their privates license is the same as an Americans,
    But they still have to qualify with Boeing
     
  20. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    I'd venture conspiracies are more rare than most people believe.
     
  21. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    There's no reason to pay attention to most of it.
     
  22. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Why make a nasty comment?
     
  23. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    I'm very much the opposite--conspiracies amongst humans are as common as fleas on dogs. Just in the last few months we've learned that upper class white parents conspired to get their kids into college by unethical, and apparently illegal, methods.

    The more serious conspiracies by government players are even more numerous.
     
  24. yasureoktoo

    yasureoktoo Banned

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    Like minorities getting into college based solely on their race.
     
  25. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Rather than focus on race, we should look at helping people disadvantaged by poverty, attending poor schools, and so on. Blacks, Latinos, and other minorities tend to be worse off, so that may take care of most issues around race.
     

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