Britain crashing out of the EU (Brexit with no EU deal).

Discussion in 'Economics & Trade' started by The Rhetoric of Life, Mar 24, 2019.

  1. The Rhetoric of Life

    The Rhetoric of Life Banned

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    Would you trade with the UK?
    Would you like a new deal with Britain?
    Britain, Brexit, and tomorrow.

    What are your thoughts?
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2019
  2. james M

    james M Banned

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    obviously if everyone adopted free trade there would be no issues between individuals or between countries.
     
  3. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The UK can still maintain trade deals with the EU, if that is what the EU wants.

    But the EU has been trying to use that as leverage, threatening the UK if they leave.

    So if trade between Britain and the continent suffers, that will be the choice of the EU.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  4. RiaRaeb

    RiaRaeb Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No, Britain chose to leave the EU, if trade suffers it is the fault of the brexiteers like dual national Alexander de Pfeffel.
     
  5. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The UK is more than willing to maintain the current trade status quo with the EU, more or less.

    Those on the EU side want to inflict "consequences" and then blame those on Brexit supporters.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  6. RiaRaeb

    RiaRaeb Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If you leave a club do not expect club benefits, nothing to do with the EU trying to inflict anything. Brexiteers voted for leaving, now they are already trying to blame the EU for their lack of a plan and not "maintaining the status quo" how stupid can they be!
     
  7. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Club benefits? The benefits go both ways. The EU has almost as much to lose from cutting off this trade as the UK does.

    (severing the UK from the EU trade zone, to be more accurate)
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  8. RiaRaeb

    RiaRaeb Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    So? Do not pretend that the EU is doing anything than looking after itself, why would it not? Britain is tiny compared with the EU, brexiteers must of been aware of it before they voted!
     
  9. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That's not really true. The size of the UK economy is a little bit bigger than France, and is 70% the size of Germany's economy.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
    The Rhetoric of Life likes this.
  10. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The breakup would create a big (or rather peculiar) problem in Ireland, since Northern Ireland is a part of the UK, and Ireland will very much want to remain a part of the EU. EU customs union laws will require a border between Ireland and Northern Ireland, yet no one in Ireland wants to see a wall go up between their two countries again (it will remind them of a troubled history they'd rather not bring up again).

    (Theoretically it's possible Northern Ireland might be able negotiate staying in the EU trade zone while remaining politically part of the UK, but in practice that's unlikely to happen because it's too complicated, it would require the UK parliament to pass a new set of laws and cede regulatory sovereignty over what they regard as a part of the UK, and it would just be a little awkward)

    Or it could just be possible EU authorities will be willing to write an exemption, since Northern Ireland is not really that big and the impact probably would not be that big. (The level of regulations in the UK is not really that dissimilar from the EU)
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  11. The Rhetoric of Life

    The Rhetoric of Life Banned

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    The people of Northern Ireland wish to Brexit with the rest of the UK and the PM needs their vote since she reached out to them to make a majority and form a government in an election that nobody won on their own.
    They keep voting against the deal the EU want with the PM because it means leaving Northern Ireland in the EU.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  12. Mandelus

    Mandelus Well-Known Member

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    Sure ... look on the results of the referendum where the Brexit got a majority once and where not!
    And shall I start now about who is now ... 2 years later ... still wanting a Brexit in Brexit?

    Anyway ... the Brexit happens, with or without deal ... and then the UK will need to search another scapegoat for their own incompetnece to blame with lies in future.
    And especially with a "no deal" Brexit, the Brexit clowns can forget to blame the EU, when chaos breaks out in the UK, etc. ... because that's exactly what they wanted!

    But maybe Uncle Trump helps and makes a brilliant deal with you (brilliant for him, because Make America great again, not UK) ... or Snow White and the 7 Dwarfs, which is just as likely.
     
  13. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Couldn't they temporarily leave Northern Ireland in the EU, in terms of trade zone and abiding by regulations, though the UK would retain ultimate political sovereignty?
    It's not impossible such a treaty could be hashed out, if all three involved had the political will.

    Or does Northern Ireland have too much economic trade at stake with the UK ?

    Any chance the EU could write some sort of exception for Northern Ireland, or will they hold that as leverage against the UK too?
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  14. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes, that's likely. If the UK leaves the EU they will very likely look to be included into a trade deal with America.

    America shouldn't have much problem accepting a free trade deal with the UK because the UK has a similar (actually higher) cost of living and America won't be concerned about a trade deficit there.

    Even with Trump as president, he will very likely view this as an opportunity to snub the EU (although I doubt he very much likes the UK. He does own a golf course in Scotland though)
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  15. james M

    james M Banned

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    Except EU is stupid in concept so stupid EU trying to punish England for wanting freedom is insane!
     
  16. The Rhetoric of Life

    The Rhetoric of Life Banned

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    Northern Irish people wish to be a part of the UK.
    These people wish to be the same as the rest of the UK, which in this case means Brexit.
    That is all it is, is these people getting to leave the EU with the rest of the UK.

    There's nothing I can think of to do with economics, it's just asking these people to stay in the EU temporarily is a deal breaker for them.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  17. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I just stated that there are ways it could be possible for them to remain British and have the UK remain whole while existing in a separate trading zone from the rest of the UK.

    The UK would just have to modify its laws to allow Northern Ireland to be in compliance with the necessary regulations to remain in the EU trading zone.

    I know that's a difficult concept to understand, that UK laws do not have to be automatically applied evenly across all parts of the UK.


    Free movement of people might be a stickler issue though, though I doubt the EU really cares about people being allowed to move to Northern Ireland specifically, although they might not want to set the precedent. And this might just be used as an excuse by them to reject such a proposed deal.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  18. The Rhetoric of Life

    The Rhetoric of Life Banned

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    That's called the Irish backstop, putting a border in the sea to allow Northern Ireland to continue being subject to EU law... - This is why the PM's deal with EU that contains this doesn't make it through, because the Northern Irish party called the DUP are in a coalition with this PM and so this PM can't win unless they're happy, and suggesting they stay in the EU longer than the rest of the UK is a red line for them.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  19. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Why would this Irish DUP party oppose remaining in the EU trading zone?

    Remember, that wouldn't necessarily require them to leave the UK politically.
     
  20. The Rhetoric of Life

    The Rhetoric of Life Banned

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    They're loyalists.
    http://www.mydup.com/
    [​IMG]
    They hate this idea of them not being treated like the rest of the UK in Brexit.
    That's why they're not liking any backstop that keeps them in the EU.

    And since 2017, the PM's needed their support to get anything done in Parliament.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  21. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If Northern Ireland were a separate country politically, what would they decide to do? Remain in the EU trading zone (even though it might be possible to remain politically part of the UK) or break off from the EU trading zone to have normalized trade relations with Britain, even though that may mean a border wall would have to go up between Northern Ireland and the rest of Ireland ?

    In other words, does the majority in Northern Ireland have the same feelings on this issue as the DUP party?
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  22. The Rhetoric of Life

    The Rhetoric of Life Banned

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  23. The Rhetoric of Life

    The Rhetoric of Life Banned

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    Brexit is also European Court of Justice, as well as freedom of movement (immigration).
    Not just fruits and vegetables.

    Staying in the EU for them means staying in the EU until a later date, and they'd be under EU rules and regulations.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  24. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  25. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Is it possible the EU might allow them to remain as part of their trade zone, but not have to be joined to their justice system or freedom of movement?
    Or is the EU bundling the whole package together and telling everyone if they want one they have to accept all?

    In that case, if a border wall goes up, I would say that's the fault of the EU.
     

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