Bush-Linked Company Handled Security for the WTC, Dulles and United

Discussion in '9/11' started by allegoricalfact, Jun 12, 2013.

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  1. allegoricalfact

    allegoricalfact Well-Known Member

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    George W. Bush's brother was on the board of directors of a company providing electronic security for the World Trade Center, Dulles International Airport and United Airlines, according to public records. The company was backed by an investment firm, the Kuwait-American Corp., also linked for years to the Bush family.

    The security company, formerly named Securacom and now named Stratesec, is in Sterling, Va.. Its CEO, Barry McDaniel, said the company had a ``completion contract" to handle some of the security at the World Trade Center ``up to the day the buildings fell down."

    It also had a three-year contract to maintain electronic security systems at Dulles Airport, according to a Dulles contracting official. Securacom/Stratesec also handled some security for United Airlines in the 1990s, according to McDaniel, but it had been completed before his arriving on the board in 1998.

    McDaniel confirmed that the company has security contracts with the Department of Defense, including the U.S. Army, but did not detail the nature of the work, citing security concerns. It has an ongoing line with the General Services Administration - meaning that its bids for contracts are noncompetitive - and also did security work for the Los Alamos laboratory before 1998.

    Marvin P. Bush, the president's youngest brother, was a director at Stratesec from 1993 to fiscal year 2000. But the White House has not publicly disclosed Bush connections in any of its responses to 9/11, nor has it mentioned that another Bush-linked business had done security work for the facilities attacked.

    Marvin Bush joined Securacom when it was capitalized by the Kuwait-American Corporation, a private investment firm in D.C. that was the security company's major investor, sometimes holding a controlling interest. Marvin Bush has not responded to telephone calls and e-mails for comment.

    KuwAm has been linked to the Bush family financially since the Gulf War. One of its principals and a member of the Kuwaiti royal family, Mishal Yousef Saud al Sabah, served on the board of Stratesec.

    The managing director at KuwAm, Wirt D. Walker III, was also a principal at Stratesec, and Walker, Marvin Bush and al Sabah are listed in SEC filings as significant shareholders in both companies during that period.

    Marvin Bush's last year on the board at Stratesec coincided with his first year on the board of HCC Insurance, formerly Houston Casualty Co., one of the insurance carriers for the WTC. He left the HCC board in November 2002.

    But none of these connections has been looked at during the extensive investigations since 9/11. McDaniel says principals and other personnel at Stratesec have not been questioned or debriefed by the FBI or other investigators. Walker declined to answer the same question regarding KuwAm, referring to the public record.

    Walker is also chairman and CEO of Aviation General, a Tulsa, Okla.-based aviation company with two subsidiaries. SEC filings also show al Sabah as a principal and shareholder in Aviation General, which was recently delisted by the Nasdaq. Stratesec was delisted by the American Stock Exchange in October 2002.

    The suite in which Marvin Bush was annually re-elected, according to public records, is located in the Watergate in space leased to the Saudi government. The company now holds shareholder meetings in space leased by the Kuwaiti government there. The White House has not responded to various requests for comment.

    Speaking of the Watergate, Riggs National Bank, where Saudi Princess Al-Faisal had her ``Saudi money trail" bank account, has as one of its executives Jonathan Bush, an uncle of the president. The public has not learned whether Riggs - which services 95 percent of Washington's foreign embassies - will be turning over records relating to Saudi finance.

    Meanwhile, Bush has nominated William H. Donaldson to head the Securities and Exchange Commission. Donaldson, a longtime Bush family friend, was a Yale classmate of Jonathan Bush.

    On the very day of the tragic space shuttle crash, the government appointed an independent investigative panel, and rightly so. Why didn't it do the same on Sept. 12, 2001?

    Margie Burns, a teacher and writer, lives in Cheverly, Maryland.

    http://www.commondreams.org/views03/0204-06.htm
     
  2. cjnewson88

    cjnewson88 Well-Known Member

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    Yes, electronic security, nothing to do with manned security. That was done by the Port Authorities, nothing to do with the Bush's or Securacom. This blows your entire theory right out of the water from the start. Should also be noted Marvin Bush left the company year or more before the 9/11 attacks.

    The contract ended on 9/11 because the buildings were destroyed, not because of any actual end date. Duh.

    Because they are all totally irrelevant to the fact 19 Islamic extremists hijacked 4 airliners and flew them into targets. Once again, this wall of uselessness you have written links to no coherent conspiracy and is simply a focal point for morons who know no better.
     
  3. cjnewson88

    cjnewson88 Well-Known Member

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    more off topic ad hominem from the resident truthers; attack the poster in place of rebutting the contents of the post.
     
  4. cjnewson88

    cjnewson88 Well-Known Member

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    Wirt Walker III is not a cousin of the Bush family, or even a distant relative. Should also be noted, that the majority of Securacoms work at the WTC was replaced by another company in 1998.

    Nope, Securacom didn't have anything to do with the day-to-day running of the security at the WTC. The Port Authority of New York, was, and always had been, in charge of security at the WTC complex. They lost a lot of people on that day.
     
  5. 9/11 was an inside job

    9/11 was an inside job Well-Known Member

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    the OCTA'S can only sling crap in defeat just one of them is right now.hee hee.

    more evidence they cant refute and have been taken to school on.they of course will post a bunch of lies to try and save face again knowing they are getting their arse handed to them on a platter by me and you.hee hee.


    http://conspiracies.skepticproject.com/articles/911/twin-towers/page/3/



    September 11th Conspiracies - Twin Towers
    Author: Edward L Winston
    Contributors: Dave Sorensen

    This is page three in the Twin Towers section of my series on the September 11th terrorist attacks. If you were linked here by mistake, please refer to page one in this section.

    A Member of the Bush Family had links to the WTC and Airline Security
    From 911review.com[36]:

    The Commission also did not mention that the CEO of the company that was in charge of security for the World Trade Center was Wirt Walker III, the president's cousin, or that Marvin Bush, the president's brother, had been one of this company's directors.

    From 911truth.org[37]:

    Foreign terrorists could not have obtained access to the buildings for the hours needed to plant the explosives. Terrorists working for the Bush-Cheney administration, by contrast, could have gotten such access, given the fact that Marvin Bush and Wirt Walker III---the president's brother and cousin, respectively---were principals of the company in charge of security for the World Trade Center.

    Both are quotes from Dr David R Griffin

    While it is true that Marvin Bush and Wirt Walker III both worked for a company called Securacom (later Stratesec), and that company did do some security work for the WTC, they were not "in charge of security". But even without researching this, you might wonder about such a claim. After all, the WTC had its own security head, John O'Neill, who took up the job on August 23rd, 2001 and died when the towers collapsed. And at least some of the security was provided by the Port Authority: David Lim, a Port Authority police officer, was stationed at the WTC with his bomb-sniffing dog Sirius. In fact Lim told the 9/11 Commission that the Port Authority police were responsible for the safety of those at the complex[38]:

    Statement of David Lim to the National Commission on Terrorist Attacks Upon the United States
    March 31, 2003

    I am a Police Officer in the employ of the Port Authority of NY & NJ. I have been such for the greater part of the last 23 years. On Sept. 11th, 2001, our Police Department suffered the greatest single day loss in Law Enforcement history @ the World Trade Center. 37 Officers from every rank (Superintendent to Police Officer) as well as my partner, explosive detector K-9 Sirius were killed in the attack. Many would ask what the PAPD was doing in the World Trade Center. A little known fact was that we were always there. Since the Port Authority owned the buildings, we (the Police) were responsible for the public safety therein...

    It is fairly obvious that the security arrangements at the World Trade Center are not as simple as Mr. Griffin would have you believe. What is the real story about Securacom, though? For that we must go back in time to 1996[39]:

    A terrorist bomb exploded underneath the World Trade Center on Feb. 26, 1993, ripping out a three-story high crater, shutting down most of the electrical power and causing $500 million in structural damage.

    The bombing, the first international terrorist attack on U.S. soil, claimed the lives of six people, injured more than 1,000 and forever changed the level of security at the landmark complex.

    "Because of the bombing, they were looking for something that had the security of a nuclear facility," said E-J President Tony Mann. "But it's also a commercial office building that needs to be responsive to its tenants. The system provides an operating office building with the highest level of security."

    E-J Electric Installation Co., the country's oldest independent electrical contractor, won a $28 million contract in 1996 to tighten security at the World Trade Center. The Long Island City, N.Y.-based contractor installed 2 million feet of fiber-optic cable, hundreds of security cameras, access control and 110 turnstiles, including systems integration. The parking garage also became restricted after a terrorist drove a van, containing a bomb, into the underground parking garage in 1993.

    The Port Authority naturally wanted to improve World Trade Center security after the 1993 bombing. Though it took a while they finally began to spend money in 1996, and E J Electric were the major contractor. Securacom, got a share as well, but not for very long[40]:

    Securacom got the $8.3 million World Trade Center security contract in October 1996 and received about $9.2 million from the WTC job from 1996 (a quarter of its revenues that year) to 1998. But in 1998, the company was "excused from the project" because it could not fulfill the work, according to former manager Al Weinstein, and the electronic security work at the WTC was taken over by EJ Electric, a larger contractor.

    If this is correct, then Securacom's interest in the World Trade Center ended in 1998, which you might have expected Mr. Griffin to tell you. But is that true? There is one article that suggests otherwise[41]:

    According to its present CEO, Barry McDaniel, the company had an ongoing contract to handle security at the World Trade Center "up to the day the buildings fell down."...

    Barry McDaniel, CEO of the company since January 2002, declines on security grounds to give specific details about work the company did at the World Trade Center. According to McDaniel, the contract was ongoing (a "completion contract"), and "not quite completed when the Center went down." The company designed a system, but -- as he points out -- obviously that "didn't have anything to do with planes flying into buildings."..

    The first line of the quote talks about "handling security" and the second about "designing a system". The "not quite completed" suggests they were working on a particular project, rather than "running security".

    Incidentally, the "up to the day the buildings fell down" line is sometimes used as a basis for saying that "the contract ran out on September 11th", but I think that's a real stretch. Having major contracts end on a Tuesday in the middle of the month sounds odd to me, and it seems much more likely that McDaniel meant the contract was active at the time, and only ceased because the towers collapsed. In the same way that a doctor saying "I treated him from the day he was born up to the day he died" doesn't necessarily mean the patient in question was about to be transferred somewhere else.

    We can speculate about this completion contract, but that's never going to provide any solid leads. A better approach might be to look at the SEC filings for Securacom, and see what they tell us about the company's revenue and clients.

    Here's what the annual report for 1997 tells us[42]:

    Revenues increased by 108.6% from $5.8 million in 1996 to $12.1 million in 1997. The increase was due to work completed for new clients and an increase in work completed on existing projects. Revenues from the World Trade Center project, which commenced in October 1996, increased from $1.6 million in 1996 to $6.6 million in 1997.

    And 1998[43]:

    Revenues decreased by 45% from $12.1 million in 1997 to $6.6 million in 1998. The decrease was due to the closeout of the World Trade Center Project.

    Just as mentioned earlier, the company left the WTC project in 1998, and no more revenues from that time can be found, suggesting that McDaniel's contract was comparatively recent. It could still be argued that the company were involved in some very sensitive areas, however, even if they only spent two or three years at the WTC[44]:

    Stratesec installed the initial security-description plan�the layout of the electronic security system�at the World Trade Center.

    The contractors for the permanent security system are E.J. Electric and Electronic Systems Associates, both of New York. Securacom, Woodcliff Lakes, N.J., is responsible for system integration.

    Access Control & Security Systems Integration
    July 1997
    SECTION: Editor's Letter; ISSN: 1084-6425
    LENGTH: 3516 words
    HEADLINE: World Trade Center
    BYLINE: By CAROL CAREY

    If there was still some contact with the WTC through McDaniel's "completion contract", however minor, then maybe it's significant that Marvin Bush worked there? Possibly not, as he left his directors job in the fiscal year 2000[45][46].

    Marvin Bush was reelected annually to Securacom's board of directors from 1993 through 1999. His final reelection was on May 25, 1999, for July 1999 to June 2000. Throughout, he also served on the company's Audit Committee and Compensation Committee, and his stock holdings grew during the period. Directors had options to purchase 25,000 shares of stock annually. In 1996, Bush acquired 53,000 shares at 52 cents per share. Shares in the 1997 IPO sold at $8.50. Records since 2000 no longer list Bush as a shareholder.

    As you can see, Bush had little interest in the World Trade Center by this point. Others point the finger to Wirt D Walker, President of the company through this time, and say he was related to Bush as well. These claims are sometimes made in a very definitive way[47]:

    The chairman of the board of Stratesec is Wirt D. Walker III, a cousin of Marvin and George W. Bush.

    However, they all appeared to be sourced from a single Margie Burns article[48]:

    Stratesec and Aviation General shared top executives, including Wirt D. Walker III, a distant relative "in the Walker branch of the Bush family," according to a former colleague...

    Here he's a "distant relative", not a cousin, and even this is only an unsourced comment from a "former colleague". I can find no supporting references for any Bush - Wirt D Walker III family relationship outside of this story, and looking at the Bush family tree reveals no obvious links. What's more, even Margie Burns now appears to downplay the link[49]:

    A former colleague of the head of the company, Wirt Dexter Walker III, suggested to me that Walker is a distant relative of the Bush family. While any blood relationship to the Bush Walkers would have to be remote (the first Wirt D. Walker, two generations ago, was based in Chicago; the second in McLean, Virginia, in the DIA), there is no doubt that the company, Kuwait's Al Sabahs, and Bush financial interests were closely linked for years. Management and control at Wirt Walker's other companies, a small airplane company named Commander Aircraft (also bankrupt) and a private investment firm named KuwAm (short for Kuwait-American Corporation), were inextricably linked to management and control at Securacom.

    We have gone from he "is a cousin", to being a "distant relative", to it just being "suggested" that he is a distant relative, and there is still not the slightest verifiable evidence to support any of that. Until someone can get in touch with Walker to get a comment, or some definitive evidence appears, we might as well view this as "not proven".

    What is the story, then? There is no evidence that Stratesec/Securacom "ran" or "were in charge of" security at the WTC. They were just a contractor, who did have a major role once, but were replaced by another company in 1998. The only evidence of further contact after that time is a couple of quotes from Barry McDaniel in one article, where he seems to be talking about designing a system that wasn't yet finished, and nothing as major as managing the security of the complex.

    Even if McDaniel's contract was significant, there's no obvious connection to Marvin Bush, as he left the company in June 2000. No-one has yet presented any proof to support the assertion that Wirt Walker is Bush's cousin, either. And before we get too deep into family trees, how does being related to Bush act in any way as evidence of your willingness to conspire to commit mass murder, anyway?

    Once again, an apparently significant point becomes much weaker once you look at the details. And in no way can this be regarded as even beginning to provide an explanation for how the WTC could have been prepared for demolition.

    Bomb Sniffing Dogs Removed
    Bomb sniffing dogs were removed just days before the attacks on the Twin Towers.

    The conspiracy theorists seem to be suggesting that the World Trade Center was running at below normal security levels just before the attacks, but I cannot find direct proof of this. There is, however, a story from newsday.com that is the probable basis for this theory[87]:

    The World Trade Center was destroyed just days after a heightened security alert was lifted at the landmark 110-story towers, security personnel said yesterday.

    Daria Coard, 37, a guard at Tower One, said the security detail had been working 12-hour shifts for the past two weeks because of numerous phone threats. But on Thursday, bomb-sniffing dogs were abruptly removed.

    "Today was the first day there was not the extra security," Coard said. "We were protecting below. We had the ground covered. We didn't figure they would do it with planes. There is no way anyone could have stopped that."

    Note that the story talks about a "heightened security alert" being lifted, and "extra security" being taken away. So the security was not weakened at all, instead they were normal as usual after being heightened for whatever reason. Regardless, the assumption is completely incorrect, the bomb-sniffing dogs were in fact at their posts that entire time and even on September 11th[88].

    Police K9 Sirius... ...was an Explosive Detection Dog with the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey Police Department. Sirius, along with his partner, Police Officer David Lim, were assigned to the World Trade Center in New York, where their primary duty was to check vehicles entering the Complex, clear unattended bags and sweep areas for VIP safety... On the morning of September 11, 2001, Sirius and Officer Lim were at their Station located in the basement of Tower Two...

    As you can see, this theory holds no water. If the security was higher than usual, but is reduced back to usual, that does not mean that security was "weakened", and as per the dogs, clearly at least one was there, more were probably on different shifts.
     
  6. cjnewson88

    cjnewson88 Well-Known Member

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    Another poor attempt at an ad hominem. Stick to topic.

    Followed by a copy/paste wall of text and a gish gallop. Nice work, you're truly living up to the typical poor debating skills of the average truther. Bravo.

    Anyway, as for the topic of this thread, this link sorts everything out. All done.

    http://www.911myths.com/html/stratesec.html
     
  7. 9/11 was an inside job

    9/11 was an inside job Well-Known Member

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    this article here is pure propaganda obviously.
     
  8. cjnewson88

    cjnewson88 Well-Known Member

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    Have you read it? It actually debunks what you are trying to say.
     
  9. Hannibal

    Hannibal New Member

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    Do you read what you paste? This article you posted debunks your own claims, as well as those of the OP.
     
  10. leftysergeant

    leftysergeant New Member

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    You still haven't shown that it even matters. There was no way to plant explosive charges to demolish the buildings in the brief time that Bush the lesser was POTUS before the kamikaze attack.
     
  11. allegoricalfact

    allegoricalfact Well-Known Member

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    I am putting them all on ignore.

    From the moment anyone with any question, large or small, sets foot in here they are bullied and insulted. For all comers, be they tough skinned or no, it is such a bore one tends to stay away but ........if the 'gang' is on ignore perhaps it is possible to have a sensible board to follow all trains of serious questioning thought. I'm going to try it anyway ;-)
     
  12. cjnewson88

    cjnewson88 Well-Known Member

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    You want a one sided discussion, go to the david icke forum. They ban all non-believers of the truther religion there on sight. You'd fit in well.
     
  13. leftysergeant

    leftysergeant New Member

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    You always did have that option, but you do not have the option of telling us that we cannot sit here and comment to each other and the few totally sane people who wander in here how totally bogus any of your maunderings are.
     
  14. LoneStrSt8

    LoneStrSt8 New Member Past Donor

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    And THAT'S why it's 'propaganda' to a truther
     
  15. 9/11 was an inside job

    9/11 was an inside job Well-Known Member

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    this one here below is not though.the OCTA's can only sling crap and whine in defeat whine like they always do having to resort to lies in defeat.hee hee

    http://911blogger.com/news/2012-02-...vestors-link-911-private-intelligence-network
    STILL more.Ironic I just came across this by accident>i wasnt even looking for the thing about how she space shuttle appointed an independent investigation but lo and behold,here it is.

    Published on Tuesday, February 4, 2003 by the Prince George's Journal (Maryland)
    Bush-Linked Company Handled Security for the WTC, Dulles and United
    by Margie Burns

    George W. Bush's brother was on the board of directors of a company providing electronic security for the World Trade Center, Dulles International Airport and United Airlines, according to public records. The company was backed by an investment firm, the Kuwait-American Corp., also linked for years to the Bush family.

    The security company, formerly named Securacom and now named Stratesec, is in Sterling, Va.. Its CEO, Barry McDaniel, said the company had a ``completion contract" to handle some of the security at the World Trade Center ``up to the day the buildings fell down."

    It also had a three-year contract to maintain electronic security systems at Dulles Airport, according to a Dulles contracting official. Securacom/Stratesec also handled some security for United Airlines in the 1990s, according to McDaniel, but it had been completed before his arriving on the board in 1998.

    McDaniel confirmed that the company has security contracts with the Department of Defense, including the U.S. Army, but did not detail the nature of the work, citing security concerns. It has an ongoing line with the General Services Administration - meaning that its bids for contracts are noncompetitive - and also did security work for the Los Alamos laboratory before 1998.

    Marvin P. Bush, the president's youngest brother, was a director at Stratesec from 1993 to fiscal year 2000. But the White House has not publicly disclosed Bush connections in any of its responses to 9/11, nor has it mentioned that another Bush-linked business had done security work for the facilities attacked.

    Marvin Bush joined Securacom when it was capitalized by the Kuwait-American Corporation, a private investment firm in D.C. that was the security company's major investor, sometimes holding a controlling interest. Marvin Bush has not responded to telephone calls and e-mails for comment.

    KuwAm has been linked to the Bush family financially since the Gulf War. One of its principals and a member of the Kuwaiti royal family, Mishal Yousef Saud al Sabah, served on the board of Stratesec.

    The managing director at KuwAm, Wirt D. Walker III, was also a principal at Stratesec, and Walker, Marvin Bush and al Sabah are listed in SEC filings as significant shareholders in both companies during that period.

    Marvin Bush's last year on the board at Stratesec coincided with his first year on the board of HCC Insurance, formerly Houston Casualty Co., one of the insurance carriers for the WTC. He left the HCC board in November 2002.

    But none of these connections has been looked at during the extensive investigations since 9/11. McDaniel says principals and other personnel at Stratesec have not been questioned or debriefed by the FBI or other investigators. Walker declined to answer the same question regarding KuwAm, referring to the public record.

    Walker is also chairman and CEO of Aviation General, a Tulsa, Okla.-based aviation company with two subsidiaries. SEC filings also show al Sabah as a principal and shareholder in Aviation General, which was recently delisted by the Nasdaq. Stratesec was delisted by the American Stock Exchange in October 2002.

    The suite in which Marvin Bush was annually re-elected, according to public records, is located in the Watergate in space leased to the Saudi government. The company now holds shareholder meetings in space leased by the Kuwaiti government there. The White House has not responded to various requests for comment.

    Speaking of the Watergate, Riggs National Bank, where Saudi Princess Al-Faisal had her ``Saudi money trail" bank account, has as one of its executives Jonathan Bush, an uncle of the president. The public has not learned whether Riggs - which services 95 percent of Washington's foreign embassies - will be turning over records relating to Saudi finance.

    Meanwhile, Bush has nominated William H. Donaldson to head the Securities and Exchange Commission. Donaldson, a longtime Bush family friend, was a Yale classmate of Jonathan Bush.

    On the very day of the tragic space shuttle crash, the government appointed an independent investigative panel, and rightly so. Why didn't it do the same on Sept. 12, 2001?


    even STILL MORE.

    http://nymag.com/news/features/16464/index6.html

    http://digwithin.net/2012/02/24/kuwam-and-stratesec-directors/
     
  16. 9/11 was an inside job

    9/11 was an inside job Well-Known Member

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    I mean its obviously a HUGE amont the way you keep humiliating and embarrassing yourself here everyday.hee hee.you would never do it for FREE.hee hee
     
  17. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    At least this thread is where it belongs, in conspiracy theories, where most of the idiotic do their mind dumps.
     
  18. 9/11 was an inside job

    9/11 was an inside job Well-Known Member

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    Good man.:clapping::thumbsup:

    I wish more truthers here would use logic and common sense like you do as well.I put them all on ignore years ago myself.many of the truthers do the ignorant thing and play their game,replying to them which is stupid.thats what they want you to do is reply back to them and argue with them so you waste your time with them while they try in their pitiful attempts to try and derail a truth discussion.

    the lurkers that come on here that are objective and open minded can see for themselves they have no interest in the truth and ignore facts.Its funny watching them talk to themselves,addressing you as though they think you read their ramblings.talk about being desperate for attention.hee hee.I know when tells ME they have me on their ignore list,unlike them,I have logic and common sense and dont keep addressing them hoping they read my posts.hee hee.thats just idiotic and shows your desperate for attention.:laughing:

    your so right,they can never engage in a rational discussion without resorting to childish insults like calling you a tin foil hatter ect,ect when they are cornered and cant refute facts.hee hee.
     
  19. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The weak minded need the ignore feature. Facing reality is not an option.
     
  20. Hannibal

    Hannibal New Member

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    Nah, the first one you posted was correct. It had citations and evidence. The latest one doesn't.
     
  21. cjnewson88

    cjnewson88 Well-Known Member

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    inside job broke my Irony meter...
     
  22. NAB

    NAB Active Member

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    You should stick to only replying to yourself, that way you can circle jerk yourself for a change. tee.hee :grin::weed:
     
  23. plague311

    plague311 New Member Past Donor

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    I can't believe people would think there is reliable information coming from someone that uses "hee hee" so much. That just screams ignorance.

    What a vision of self worth to think that people get paid to come here and combat something so stupid. Let's be honest, anyone that gets sucked in by such blatant stupidity isn't smart enough to dump (*)(*)(*)(*) out of a boot before putting it on.
     
  24. RtWngaFraud

    RtWngaFraud Banned

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    "Attack the poster"...ROFL! That's really rich!
     
  25. 9/11 was an inside job

    9/11 was an inside job Well-Known Member

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    thats funny,thats what the OCTA'S do when they are cornered,not only that but have to resort to making up lies posting videos that are full of outright proven lies like the pitiful attempt on the 9/11 official conspiracy video explained in under 5 minutes fairy tales that were made up to try and counter the facts in it.

    that video failed MISERABLY to try to debunk that information ..hee hee.talk about getting desperate when losing an argument.:roflol::laughing::laughing:
     

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