Calling Prophet Muhammad a pedophile does not fall within freedom of speech: European court

Nor did I say it was, so that is not an appropriate response to my post. My point was clearly that there is a very fundamental difference between feeling you have to hide something behind closed doors, and it being openly and out right endorsed. my comments on moral equivalence were clearly in reference to this fundamental difference, demonstrating that it destroys any attempt at equivalence (your only contribution to the discussion, and a poor one at that, demonstrating the noeal confusion on your part on which I also commented, likewise receiving no direct response). Your sidestep of my clear point in favor of responding to something which I never said or implied reflects on you and your position, and especially on your confidence in it. You discredit yourself with this dishonest behavior, and you should correct it.

 

You go right ahead. I will sleep fine tonight with or without anyone's analysis of the fundamental moral difference between cultures which openly endorse child rape and those in which the rapists are forced to hide this behavior from the others in the culture, lest they be excommunicated and imprisoned.

Knock yourselves out, though. While you are prattling over moral confusion amd definitions, others are busy spreading their immoral culture and leapfrogging that discussion entirely, as they claim to already have settled, divine moral authority. While you guys decide whether the war is even worth fighting, the enemies already made up their minds and are bringing it to your doorstep.

 

There is no difference between 'teaching' about Mohamed and explaining the history of Mohamed. Was the teacher right or was she wrong?

Should the police enter every mosque and Islamic school to listen to what the Imams have to say and whether they are ever confusing beliefs and truths? If they did that how long would any Muslim schools last?

It's not 'hatred' to call Mohamed a pedophile, in fact it's ignorant if you don't. And what's wrong with holding Muslims up to ridicule? Their beliefs and dress codes are ridiculous, and we all see it and know it. What many are trying to do is introduce these people to a better world than the one in which they were indoctrinated as children, to offer them alternatives in life that aren't available in Muslim run countries.

And, as you should know, it is Muslims doing the murdering and committing terrorism and sex offenses throughout the world.

 

Wrong. That is precisely what we task our governments and ourselves with. Free speech and free thought are morally superior to the alternatives. And we ask our government to enforce these morally superior ideas over the alternatives. If asserting moral superiority of one idea over another is too much for you to bear, then you simply become an enabler of the immoral.

I am not afraid to stand here right now and say the idea of protecting children from rape is far morally superior than the alternative, amd we should imprison or kill , by force of our government, anyone that attempts to act in a manner otherwise.

And if these evil Muslim freaks try to institutionalize child rape in my community, I will shed their blood, or die trying. Period. The time for appeasement of evil ideas out of fear of evil people doing evil things to us has passed. They have made it clear that they will continue, with no mind paid to the appeasement. Islam needs a reformation, and I will not stand with people who would surrender to these fundamental muslim freaks by appeasing them.

Resist, while you still can.

 

Muslims do not advocate child rape because Mo married a child bride. That opinion is bigoted.

The fact that in the 7th century child marriage was ROUTINE seems to be ignored in expressing your opinion.

Just like slavery was ROUTINE in the 1st century with admonitions to the faithful to obey their masters. Just as "out in the open"

Attacking my credibility is amusing and wholly unwarranted unless you are merely casting around to find something to discount my counterpoint. No worries.

 

Of course, this is precisely what they do, in addition to finding support for it in other parts of their religion. You, sir, are lying. Sex with a child is child rape, and they find justification for this in their religion. Those are facts. And this child marriage is openly endorsed amd encouraged by the Muslim institutions in much of the Muslim world. Frankly, it is nauseating to watch you try to provide cover for this by comparing it to a secret scandal of child rape that, once exposed, is resulting in excommunicated and imprisonment of the offenders.

Wrong again...the fact that we have extinguished, or attempted to extinguish, such behavior by reforming religion and society using secular ideas fully and completely supports every point i am making. At no point am i claiming violence or child rape as the sole providence of Islam, so your attempts at distraction are dishonest and frivolous. I am stating that Islamic cultures openly endorse this and other evil behavior, and they spread amd justify this culture using the motherlode of disgusting, evil ideas that is Islam. Again...those are facts. These facts pay no mind to your efforts to romanticize them or distract from them.

You discredit yourself. I do not have to make any effort whatsoever to discredit the person who tries to provide cover for evil, openly endorsed acts and the cultures which endorse them by pointing at people in the 7th century who committed similar acts. That person embarrasses and discredits himself.

 

We absolutely do,once we grant ourselves this right by whatever process we feel is best . That is why I can have you thrown in jail for stealing from me. You are free to sit in your cage afterward and claim nobody has the right to keep you there...it won't do you much good, just as claiming water is not wet will not prevent you from getting wet in the rain.

And, just as we granted ourselves the right to free speech, this right can be extinguished by the same process. As the topic of this thread demonstrates quite neatly. So this surrender on the part of equivocating, mincing ninnies who have somehow convinced themselves that these hard earned rights could never go away belies a total ignorance of history and of the cost of having these rights in the first place.

 

I am not just "suggesting" that, i am clearly and unequivocally stating that Muslims are pushing this behavior. Just ask them, in England. They are happy to tell you that they recognize the laws of Allah , not the laws of england. I don't have to craft any arguments to convince anyone of the truth of this. Just go and see for yourself.

As for this country, we have made it clear in our constitution that one's magical religious nonsense loses all value past the end of that one's nose. This has created a culture where this Islamic fanatacism has a harder time finding purchase than it does in other countries. We better asismilate people into our culture, as children tend to quickly see the superiority of free thought amd expression over religious dogma, and generational change happens very quickly in those families carrying around the baggage of an iron age moral code derived from an evil pedophile.

 

Laws against theft represent people getting together and agreeing on the enforcement of a bit of morality. So do laws against child rape. These things don't just happen by chance. They happen by force. We had to fight a war to keep england from stealing from us. Farmers took up arms to keep england from stealing their crops to give to the church. Do you think england or the church looked at it as theft? No.

So, we chose a preferred morality, and we gave ourselves the right to it by force. You would say we had no right to do this, if you would stridently stand by your earlier comment. I would say you are wrong, and we did the right thing.

The people who would speak out against the disgusting child rape in tribal Pakistan that is actually supported by codified law...what do you suppose happens to them? What do you suppose happens to the child who refuses to be raped? Are you going to sit there with a straight face and say we should not use force to support a superior morality over child rape? If so, for shame.

 

As both I and the quote said, the court determined not only was she wrong that given her claim to be an expert and capable of teaching people she knew she was wrong - that is that she was deliberately teaching non truth for the purpose of inciting hatred against those who follow the Muslim faith while at the same time disgusting others of it.

 

Speak for yourself, and then get out of my way... I will continue to speak against this disgusting culture and stand by my intellectual and moral allies, in england and in other civilized countries, against our common enemies.

Right, which is precisely why we must take care to craft laws based on morality and ethics not "divined" to us by shamans, but arrived at through the arduous processes of reason and examination of evidence. Your right to child rape ends at our borders, no matter what magical sky fairy addles your brain. You take this for granted, when, in reality, this moral codification into law was a hard fought accomplishment. Would you then use the success of this effort as a cudgel against similar efforts today? It seems you would.

Good, let them say it. Drag them into the public square and let them make their arguments, so we can settle this. I will meet them across the table at any time and place of their choosing. You help make my points to describe this as an ongoing effort not just across the world, but even in our country. And your willingness to do so seems to stand in contrast to your earlier remarks of, "thats England's problem". No, these people are the enemies of reason and morality. Combatting their evil religious nonsense is everyone's problem, because, and i can promise you this, the evil people are not sitting idly , satisfied with their station.

 

Which is nothing but a long winded, equivocal appeasement of evil Muslim people who think they have a RIGHT not to have the one, true prophet defamed.

The court "kept the peace" by capitulating to the aggressors. That is not peace, that is surrender.

 

They'd probably arrest you too trying to spread hatred on the internet calling their civilians 'evil'. Look inside. I am not interested.

 

And they would be wrong to do so. And if you supported such enforcement by law against free speech, then you would be my enemy.


And yes, supporting child rape and mutilation is evil. Supporting physical consequences for drawing a picture of Mohammed is evil. Those who support these ideas are evil, period. They have a chance now to stop being evil, if they like. But what i will not do is coddle them by saying that they are merely "acting" evil. No, if you support the squashing of free expression by force, then you are evil and you are my enemy.

 

Not once did i claim they were, and i made an effort to state that we should get together and decide laws through an arduous process...not by my authoritative dictation. So your comment is simply not an appropriate response to my comments.

Correct, as Islam is the topic of the thread. It appears your first mistake was opening the thread, if criticism of Islam and Islamic culture is too much for you to bear. Your second mistake was to try to warp the thread to suit your personal desires by attempting to change the subject to other religions. Your third mistake was to think you insult me or any of the ideas I forward by characterization them as "anti-islamic". Instead, I congratulate you for your acute senses, as that is precisely what my comments are.

 

What "morality" is that, specifically? If you have a well thought out point to make, then make it without others having to extract it from you. And , after what has seemingly been a constant stream of misrepresentations of me and my comments, i would like the opportunity to correct any further examples of this, which i predict are forthcoming.

 

Name calling is never a good way to open a dialogue of understanding.

 

Okay, but we shouldn't any longer be trying to understand why Muslim cultures promote death for apostasy, or for drawing a picture of mohammed, or for refusing to be child-raped by their assigned spouse.

We already know why: Islam.