Can we at least agree on this?

Discussion in 'Abortion' started by kazenatsu, Oct 14, 2018.

  1. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

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    YOU are discussing dog pregnancies in an ABORTION Forum …...that IS comparing women to dogs....but I am NOT surprised at all......
     
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  2. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Read the post again

    BTW we ARE animals, perhaps more highly evolved but we are animals
     
  3. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

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    Yes, but women are not dogs and those who compare them to dogs are misogynists...
     
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  4. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I was trying to examine the particular aspect of how much pro-choicers believe a being does not have rights because it is inside a womb, and separate that out from the reasoning originating from the woman's right to make a decision argument.
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2018
  5. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Why not base your argument on sapience?
     
  6. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Because sapience is a very fluid concept.

    (I'm not exactly sure what you're referring to. Are you talking about the sapience of a fetus or the sapience of me coming together to make an argument?)

    Surely you're not implying elderly people with lots of life experiences have more of a right to life than a 2-year-old?
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2018
  7. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

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    That ( whatever that garbled bunch of words meant) has nothing to do with dogs....YOU brought dogs into the discussion...


    A fetus has no rights.

    A woman has the right to choose abortion or gestation.

    Those are two different things..
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2018
  8. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Only as an analogy to try to only focus in on one particular aspect of your argument.

    Sorry, I'm a little bit tired and guess I wasn't able to phrase things together as articulately as I would have liked.
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2018
  9. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

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    You compared women to dogs..
     
  10. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Do you want an award for master of ad-hominem argumentative skills?
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2018
  11. edna kawabata

    edna kawabata Well-Known Member

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  12. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    The content of your posts
    Lack of academic nomenclature
    Lack of citation
    Lack of critical analysis
    Do you REALLY want me to go on?

    That the family may be making an unethical decision[/QUOTE]
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2018
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  13. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Isn't this an example of use of appeal to authority? (logical fallacy)
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2018
  14. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    No
     
  15. edna kawabata

    edna kawabata Well-Known Member

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    By your definition/opinion I have zero medical knowledge.....I can live with that.
    Did you say a family cannot make an unethical decision.
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2018
  16. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    And yet you feel you have the right to make decisions in complex medical issues

    And no what I am saying is that it takes knowledge of the entire circumstances to make informed decisions in theses cases

    All too many so called pro lifers base knowledge of abortion on myths perpetrated by vested interests

    Myths such as

    Abortion is used as contraception
    Some women will have an abortion the day before a baby is born just so they can fit into a swimming suit
    Women having abortions are too lazy to take contraception
    And my favourite

    Women should just keep thier legs together
     
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  17. edna kawabata

    edna kawabata Well-Known Member

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    Thank you Mr. Obvious.
    Family members have a right to make decisions in complex medical issues and I am a family member.
     
  18. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

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    Back to the topic:


    The answer is NO.
     
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  19. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Thank you for at least finally getting to the point.
     
  20. edna kawabata

    edna kawabata Well-Known Member

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    And anti-abortion "with exceptions" people can say no.
     
  21. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

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    ???What are you referring to??
     
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  22. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I just find it so ironic that [some] pro-choicers believe family members should have the right to make decisions.
    Well guess what?
    There's one family member you're not considering. (Guess who that is?)

    So unless you truly believe the fetus is a non-entity, it's just ridiculous and intellectually inconsistent to claim that fetus has no rights, just because it is inside a womb, dependent on the woman, etc. At most you could say that the woman's rights (if she's capable of making the decision) outweigh the rights of the fetus inside her.
    But in medical cases where the woman can't provide her input, or is no longer present in mind (brain death), you have to consider the interests of the fetus, if you would consider the input of the other family members.
     
  23. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

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    A fetus has no rights.
     
  24. Matt22yuc

    Matt22yuc Active Member

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    The fetus doesn’t have any interests. That’s what you can’t seem to wrap your head around. The fetus has no rights because it’s not a person. If the mother can’t make the decision because they are brain dead, then the family should make the decision based on what she would have wanted.
     
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  25. Matt22yuc

    Matt22yuc Active Member

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    I asked you before and you never responded. How do you determine that a fetus has rights?
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2018
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