Can you be spiritual without being religious?

I was talking of historical literalism which is recent given the 25,000 years of beliefs we know about. 20,000 years of naturalistic and female worship with only 2,000 years of stupid literal reading of myths.

Indeed, which ended when Christianity then Islam stupidly started reading their myths literally. That was the demise of the intellectual study or seeking of God.

I am not well versed on Hinduism but if their are dysfunctional and believing in the supernatural, then I agree.

Regards
DL

 

I don't need help in understanding my "anecdotal rendering". Maybe the 'experts' need help in wrapping their mind around something as magnificent and beautiful as the experience I described.

 

I expected you would see that religions or religiosity is just the forming of tribes designed to appease or hivish tendencies and instincts. Religiosity has nothing to do with spirituality.

Most recognize this. The show of hands at the beginning of this link shows this distinction.



Regards
DL

 

This following answers you nicely, I hope.

Modern Gnostic Christians name our God "I am", and yes, we do mean ourselves.

You are your controller. I am mine. You represent and present whatever mind picture you have of your God or ideal human, and so do I.

The name "I Am" you might see as meaning something like, --- I think I have grown up thanks to having forced my apotheosis through Gnosis and meditation.

In Gnostic Christianity, we follow the Christian tradition that lazy Christians have forgotten that they are to do. That is, become brethren to Jesus.

That is why some say that the only good Christian is a Gnostic Christian.

On being reborn, here is the real way Jesus taught.

Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Allan Watts explain those quotes in detail.


Joseph Campbell shows the same esoteric ecumenist idea in this link.


The bible just plainly says to put away the things of children. The supernatural.

Regards
DL

 

I believe in some of the paranormal, telepathy for sure, having experience it twice, but nothing of the supernatural.

No argument against the rest of what you put.

Regards
DL

 

Our myths, sure. Our beliefs, no.

We are knowledge and Gnosis seekers. Not believers if fantasy.

Regards
DL

 

I liked your thinking except for this.

You are not seeing reality. Note the stats at the end of this presentation and bite your tongue.



Regards
DL

 

See post 128 and the link there on spirituality and religiosity.

What is still putrid about most of Christianity is it's homophobias and misogyny.

If the West would not have brought it to heel, they would still be using Inquisitions.

What is also putrid is their idol worship of a genocidal son murdering God while calling that prick good.

Regards
DL

 

That expert has. Perhaps you missed that.

Regards
DL

 

What stats, that you mentioned, would disprove that human nature corrupts all that it touches? It corrupts a gov't, it corrupts police departments, and so on. In fact, I cannot think of anything that it does not and has not corrupted at some point in time. If not for human nature, there would be no need for laws of any kind. Laws exist because of what we call human nature, the dark side of it. Not all of human nature is bad of course.

I thought this was self evident, the corrupting effect of human nature. One can observe it in so many areas of existence.

 

to be spiritual, wouldn't you have to have belief in spirits ?

 

Taking the latter point first: About whom are you referring, precisely, when you speak of Christians' "idol worship" of a "genocidal murdering God"?

That surely cannot refer to Jesus.

And you claim that Christianity is to blame for its "homophobias" (just why the plural, I have no idea) and "misogyny."

As to the latter, you could possibly have a point; Paul's teachings as concerning the relationship of men and women do strike me as being...well, a bit unenlightened.

As for the former, however, the very word, "homophobia," is a modern invention. It speaks to the thoroughly modern (or perhaps postmodern) idea that homosexuality is just as natural as heterosexuality--it is not a perversion at all--and is, therefore, nothing less than political correctness...

 

I certainly do. I have noted that most people who say they don't want to live forever are either fairly youthful and/or put their death off to some years in the future. Think of reality without YOU in it, that can be rather terrifying

However, that being said I don't believe in an afterlife and I think the majority of the world's religions (Buddhist, Hindi, Confucian, Shinto and Tao) don't either (I'm not sure about Judaism). It seems the very epitome of wishful thinking to me.

As for being spiritual I dunno. I remember reading about this helmet some guy had invented that had some sort of electric/electronic doohickey that could produce a feeling of an overwhelming closeness to God and I thought, "****, this is the same as not eating or taking lots of strong drugs" which didn't seem all that earth-shaking somehow.

A gf once said I had all the spirituality of Attila the Hun, (that was part of what she liked about me). I never thought that was really fair, I think religious/spiritual people are often very good for themselves, others and the world

 

The bible isn't a road map or a history book. It is a guide pointing the way. YOU must find the way. And "reborn in Christ"? Like all spiritual writings, that is not spelled out definitively in the bible. But it points the way, and those with ears to hear can hear the truth in it. To be "reborn in Christ" is to die to self daily until it is done, and surrender all you are, all you have, all you believe, all you understand including all your knowledge, desires, fears, hopes, purposes, expectations and all claims as filthy rags. You "overcome the world" in you this way. Then you will find the Logos within, and you will discover your own identity. That is "rebirth in Christ". But it is a very rare person who will actually do this, and most will even fight to deny it so they can hold the belief in salvation being very simple and done. Such self-deception is normal. So is the failure it brings.

 

Do you know approximately when that was? It's ok if you don't.

Hinduism has produced many times more awakened, realized adherents than Christianity has.

 

Ok great. Please get me 1) quote(s) of Gnostic beliefs, and 2) links to reliable original translations of the sayings or books or tractates where those quotes can be found. I would appreciate that very much as I would like very much to read them (your quotes and their context). Thank you.

 

Are you reborn in Christ?

 

If you understood this, you would know that no one who is truly reborn will ever admit it. But anyone with the least spiritual insight can easily see it in the words such a person speaks.

 

You're a Christian then?

 

If someone claims to be 'reborn' then that must by definition make them either Buddhists or Sikhs doesn't it? They're the only religions that believe in reincarnation, as far as I know.

 

I agree that the forming of tribes has similarities with religion and that religion played an important role in the formation of tribes in humanity's past, but that's not to say that religions are just that. I think the show of hands in the beginning of that talk is due to another distinction, the distinction between beliefs/feelings about human nature, in particular one's own human nature (spirituality), and beliefs about the nature of the world, in particular it's cause (religion). Haidt even says it himself in the very video you posted (at 15:42):
"If it is an adaptation, then we evolved to be religious. I don't mean that we evolved to join gigantic organised religions..."
Clearly, Haidt makes an explicit distinction between religiosity and organised religions.

There is a feature of religiosity which draws us together, but it is not a defining feature, i.e. if you found a religion which somehow didn't have that feature, it does not stop us from calling it a religion. It might stop the religion from existing for very long, but not from being identified as a religion.

 

The Sistine Chapel ceiling was painted by Michelangelo, NOT DaVincii.

 

Yes, but as those stats show, should you choose to view the link, shows how much less corruption is happening.

Regards
DL

 

No. The imaginary spirit world has nothing to do with spirituality, which is a way of thinking.

Regards
DL

 

The Trinity is the only God that the bible posits. That is a genocidal son murdering God.

I do indeed. Do you deny that Christianity preaches for both?

As is the whole bible.

If not natural, it would not exist in nature.

Where a person gets sexual gratification between consenting adults is not an excuse for us to deny gays the right to seek loving partners. Love is more important than sex.

Regards
DL