Charlottesville, VA protests white nationalist vs Antifa

Discussion in 'Opinion POLLS' started by KJohnson, Aug 12, 2018.

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Which is WORSE of these two hate groups? And should anyone be allowed to wear masks?

  1. White nationalist

    8 vote(s)
    25.0%
  2. Antifa

    13 vote(s)
    40.6%
  3. Think both groups are hateful thugs that harm the nation.

    11 vote(s)
    34.4%
  4. I think legislation should be passed against wearing masks at protests

    8 vote(s)
    25.0%
  5. I don't care if they wear masks and possibly kill someone and then can't be identified

    2 vote(s)
    6.3%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    lots of private businesses and industries thrived in Nazi Germany.

    if they were truly socialist ALL large private businesses, banks, companies would have been nationalized and their owners/ceos sent to Gulags.
     
  2. Wildjoker5

    Wildjoker5 Well-Known Member

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    Like what?

    Psst...Gulags were Russian.
     
  3. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The German economy, like those of many other western nations, suffered the effects of the Great Depression with unemployment soaring around the Wall Street Crash of 1929.[1] When Adolf Hitler became Chancellor in 1933, he introduced policies aimed at improving the economy. The changes included privatization of state industries..

    The Nazi government developed a partnership with leading German business interests, who supported the goals of the regime and its war effort in exchange for advantageous contracts, subsidies, and the suppression of the trade union movement.[10] Cartels and monopolies were encouraged at the expense of small businesses, even though the Nazis had received considerable electoral support from small business owners.

    Among the slave labourers in the occupied territories, hundreds of thousands were used by leading German corporations including Thyssen, Krupp, IG Farben, Bosch, Blaupunkt, Daimler-Benz, Demag, Henschel, Junkers, Messerschmitt, Philips, Siemens, and Volkswagen

    The Nazi government took the stance that enterprises should be in private hands wherever possible. [41] State ownership was to be avoided unless it was absolutely necessary for rearmament or the war effort, and even in those cases “the Reich often insisted on the inclusion in the contract of an option clause according to which the private firm operating the plant was entitled to purchase it.”[42] Companies privatized by the Nazis included the four major commercial banks in Germany, which had all come under public ownership during the prior years: Commerz– und Privatbank , Deutsche Bank und Disconto-Gesellschaft , Golddiskontbank and Dresdner Bank . [43][44] Also privatized were the Deutsche Reichsbahn (German Railways), at the time the largest single public enterprise in the world, the Vereinigte Stahlwerke A.G. (United Steelworks), the second largest joint-stock company in Germany (the largest was IG Farben) and Vereinigte Oberschlesische Hüttenwerke AG , a company controlling all of the metal production in the Upper Silesian coal and steel industry. The government also sold a number of shipbuilding companies, and enhanced private utilities at the expense of municipally owned utilities companies.[45] Additionally, the Nazis privatized some public services which had been previously provided by the government, especially social and labor-related services, and these were mainly taken over by organizations affiliated with the Nazi Party that could be trusted to apply Nazi racial policies.[46]

    One of the reasons for the Nazi privatization policy was to cement the partnership between the government and business interests.[47] Another reason was financial. As the Nazi government faced budget deficits due to its military spending, privatization was one of the methods it used to raise more funds

    Nazi ideology held entrepreneurship in high regard, and “private property was considered a precondition to developing the creativity of members of the German race in the best interest of the people. [50] The Nazi leadership believed that “private property itself provided important incentives to achieve greater cost consciousness, efficiency gains, and technical progress.”

    Many business leaders welcomed Hitler's rise to power due to his anti-Communist and anti-trade union stance.[53] The month after being appointed Chancellor, Hitler made a personal appeal to German business leaders to help fund the Nazi Party for the crucial months that were to follow. He argued that they should support him in establishing a dictatorship because "private enterprise cannot be maintained in the age of democracy" and because democracy would allegedly lead to communism.[54] In the following weeks, the Nazi Party received contributions from seventeen different business groups, with the largest coming from IG Farben and Deutsche Bank.[55] Many of these businesses continued to support Hitler even during the war and even profited from persecution of the Jews. The most infamous being firms like Krupp, IG Farben, and some large automobile manufacturers.[56] Historian Adam Tooze writes that the leaders of German business were therefore "willing partners in the destruction of political pluralism in Germany."[57] In exchange, owners and managers of German businesses were granted unprecedented powers to control their workforce, collective bargaining was abolished and wages were frozen at a relatively low level.[58] Business profits also rose very rapidly, as did corporate investment.[59]

    The rhetoric of the Nazi regime stated that German private companies would be protected and privileged as long as they supported the economic goals of the government - mainly by participating in government contracts for military production - but that they could face severe penalties if they went against the national interest. However, such threats were rarely carried out in practice, and "companies normally could refuse to engage in an investment project designed by the state without any consequences."[66] Private firms refused government contracts and directions on many occasions. In 1937, de Wendel, a coal mining enterprise, refused to build a hydrogenation plant. In 1939, IG Farbendenied a government request to increase its production of rayon and refused to invest in a synthetic rubber factory despite this being an important project for the regime. Froriep GmbH, a company producing machines for the armaments industry, successfully demanded cheap credit from the Nazi government under a threat of cutting back investment if its demand was not met.[67] The regime generally used monetary incentives, such as guaranteed profits, to persuade businesses to support its goals, and freedom of contract was generally respected even in projects important for the war






    socialism huh?

    LOL!!!!!
     
  4. therooster

    therooster Banned

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    Lol.... oh you guys ... just make stuff up cuz you got nothing else.. too much.
     
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  5. Wildjoker5

    Wildjoker5 Well-Known Member

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    The government is a monopoly. The Nazis "gave" businesses to those who were loyal. If those business owners ever stepped out of line, they were no longer the owner of the business. How does this escape you that what Nazis did, is the exact same process Venezuela did? Once the leaders of VZ oil companies stepped out of line, Chavez replaced them with another crony. You don't actually think the dictator of any socialist country is making every decision for every company do you?
     
  6. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    socialists do not embrace large private businesses.

    they do not privatize state-owned industries.

    they do not use slave labor to benefit large corporations
     
  7. ArmySoldier

    ArmySoldier Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes, SOCIALISM. The government seized control of PRIVATE German (and not to mention JEWISH- the people you "claim" to support) businesses.

    That's literally the exact opposite of capitalism.

    Your support for the German government is noted.
     
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  8. Wildjoker5

    Wildjoker5 Well-Known Member

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    "Privatize" with a huge amount of cronyism is no different than socialism. The companies still gave massive amounts of taxes off their profits.

    That's called delegating. And not a single industry went to anyone not supporting the party.

    Socialism is all slave labor, and the government cronies always get large kick backs to keep faith with the authoritarian party as to not be executed for their disloyalty. Slave labor was also the way the businesses could keep making a decent profit while funding the huge tax burden needed to fund the war machine. Why do you think the government allowed such a practice?
     
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  9. ArmySoldier

    ArmySoldier Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    He mixed his words up obviously.
     
  10. Bridget

    Bridget Well-Known Member

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    Is it just my imagination that it is just the left wing hate groups who wear the masks? Indicating that they are ashamed and fearful that someone will find out what they do? I mean, take a good look at this picture posted of the "white supremacists". They may be morons for all I know, but they aren't wearing masks.

    I saw on the news that, in Charlottesville, on Saturday, left wing hate groups showed up expecting to meet right wing hate groups, but none showed up. So they were at loose ends and wound up just arguing with each other.

    In DC, I understand that twenty right wing folks showed up, but over 1,000 left wing haters to counter protest. Do you think there just isn't very many white nationalists and KKK, but an awful lot of left wing haters looking for a fight??
     
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  11. ArmySoldier

    ArmySoldier Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The KKK is a much smaller portion of the country than Antifa. Antifa has millions. Both are scum. There's just more of the scum from Antifa. Millions more
     
  12. Wildjoker5

    Wildjoker5 Well-Known Member

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    I think after last year when many of the right who were duped into coming to a clan rally figured it was the wrong crowd to be associated with and skipped the event this year. Not to mention, the right were doxed and some lost their jobs even if they weren't part of the white nationalist group, they just want preserve history. That was the point from Trump last year that not everyone that showed up either in protest to the tearing down of the statues and the counter protests were all bad people, "some were". Those in the right are not racist, and don't want to show up in protest where racist are obviously the center point of the group. Every TEA party event where someone (typically leftist plants) showed up in Nazi regalia or KKK motif were quickly expelled from those rallies.
     
  13. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    I agree maybe it's a good idea that we ban masks in these sort of protests.
     
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  14. Wildjoker5

    Wildjoker5 Well-Known Member

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    Last edited: Aug 13, 2018
  15. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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  16. Wildjoker5

    Wildjoker5 Well-Known Member

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    And they also turn around and dox those in the crowd who weren't on their side claiming they were white nationalist and racist to get them fired.
     
  17. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    If it is radical to support free speech and the right to carry a gun and should be proud of my nation and vote for the president I want regardless of the cry baby shrieking of people who disagree then I guess I'm a radical.

    So maybe we should listen to Saul Alinsky when he says to force the opposition to live by its own rule book.

    I personally think this is petty and the only good that will come from it is Maybe by forcing these ridiculous standards upon the standard makers they will stop making the standard.

    I would much prefer if someone said something that people don't like that people criticize what they said and simply agree to disagree. And that's it. But it seems that isn't possible.
     
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  18. jimbo1

    jimbo1 Banned

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  19. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Antifa are usually the aggressors in these clashes, but I voted against yet another law banning masks for civil liberties reasons.

    One law after another gets passed, with more restrictions every year, while the society slowly slides into a police state. The right to be anonymous is not an unimportant right.

    I also don't think this freedom hinders the police much. (Outlaw masks and only outlaws will wear them, etc)
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2018
  20. bhoyal

    bhoyal Active Member

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