Colletivistic sects in history

Discussion in 'History & Past Politicians' started by Anonymous.Professor, May 11, 2020.

  1. Anonymous.Professor

    Anonymous.Professor Newly Registered

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    This topic is meant as a discussion about collectivistic sects during the history. We know that communists were in a way sympathetic to such sects no matter how violent they were. Mao for example considered Taiping rebellion as unfinished revolution. Engels wrote with sympathy about militant anabaptist Thomas Muntzer and his heavenly kingdom during the rebellion of German peasants between 1524-1525. Muntzer was a former catholic priest who at first supported Martin Luther. Muntzer soon proclaimed himself as a profet and was saying he is a protector of small people. With his inflammatory speeches he started or at least encouraged rebellion of German peasants against feudalism, claiming world must be purged of kings, nobility and priests. Luther became for him a servant of the devil. Serfs at first demanded just that feudal burdens should be weakened. Luther supported them. Later under influence of radicals like Muntzer peasants started armed rebellion But the goal of Muntzer was not that serfs will become private owners of their land but rather he wanted to establish collectivistic communities. He prophesied that second coming of Christ is very near, but before that poor people must by force destroy corrupt old world. Rebellion was crushed by feudal armies and Muntzer was decapitated in 1525. However some anabaptists continued with this so called messianic movement. Dutch baker Jan Mathys with the help of radical preacher Rottman took over the local autorithy in the German town of Munster from lutherans. Soon 'new kingdom of Zion' was proclaimed in the town. All property was collectivized and men were able to have many women. New king of Zion Jan from Leiden took 16 viwes one was executed by him because she was critical about the king and wanted to leave the town. The rebellion was crushed and three of the leaders of the sect were tortured and executed in public.


    History of the church, book3, published in Ljubljana, 1994, pages 73-76, 96.

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    Münster rebellion - Wikipedia
     
  2. Anonymous.Professor

    Anonymous.Professor Newly Registered

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    Taiping rebellion was started by Hong Xiuquan who started his own pseudo christian sect in China. He claimed to be a Son of God and brother of Christ. In 1847, Hong became the leader of the secret society with a goal to overthrow Qing dynasty. He was able to get quite some followers between of them many former bandits. On January 11, 1851 Hong declared himself Heavenly king of a new dynasty, the "Heavenly Kingdom of Great Peace''. Relatively small rebel army was able to defeat some government forces but quite soon they captured Nanjing making it their capital and renaming it Tianjing ("Heavenly Capital"). Because Hong Xiuquan had been supposedly instructed in his dream to exterminate all "demons", which was what the Taipings considered the Manchus to be, thus they set out to kill and wipe out the entire Manchu population. When Nanjing was occupied, the Taipings went on a rampage killing, burning and hacking 40,000 Manchus to death in the city. They first killed all the Manchu men, then forced the Manchu women outside the city and burnt them to death. At its height, the Heavenly Kingdom controlled south China but failed to take over Beijing.

    Internal conflicts weakened the ''heavenly kingdom''. Hong disagreed with his former friend Yang in certain matters of policy and became increasingly suspicious of Yang's ambitions, his extensive network of spies, and his declarations when "speaking as God". Yang and his family were put to death by Hong's followers in 1856, followed by the killing of a few thousand troops loyal to Yang. Taiping delegates tried then to gain support from European powers but they decided to remain neutral.

    Within the land that it controlled, Hong established totalitarian and theocratic state.

    • The subject of study for the examinations for officials changed from the Confucian classics to the Bible.
    • Private property ownership was abolished and all land was held and distributed by the state.
    • Solar calendar replaced the lunar calendar.
    • Foot binding was banned.
    • Society was declared classless and the sexes were declared equal. At one point, for the first time in Chinese history civil service exams were held for women.
    • Several women served as military officers and commanders under Taiping.
    • The sexes were rigorously separated. There were separate army units consisting of women only; until 1855, not even married couples were allowed to live together or have sexual relations.
    • The Qing-dictated hairstyle was abandoned in favor of wearing the hair long.
    • Other new laws were promulgated including the prohibition of opium, gambling, tobacco, alcohol, polygamy (including concubinage), slavery, and prostitution. These all carried death penalties.

    An attempt to take Shanghai in August 1860 was initially successful but finally repulsed by a force of Chinese troops with USA and European support. After this the power of Taiping heavenly kingdom declined.

    Hong declared that God would defend Nanjing, but in June 1864, with Qing forces approaching, he died of food poisoning as the result of eating wild vegetables as the city began to run out of food. Only a few days after his death the Qing forces took the city. His body was buried and was later exhumed to verify his death, and cremated. Hong's ashes were later blasted out of a cannon in order to ensure that his remains have no resting place as eternal punishment for the uprising.

    Around 20 milions of people died during Taiping rebellion, not just in fighting and massacres but also because internal conflict in China caused hunger and other problems.






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    Taiping Heavenly Kingdom - Wikipedia

    [​IMG] en.wikipedia.org

    Black book of communism, published in Ljubljana, 1999, page 566.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2020
  3. Anonymous.Professor

    Anonymous.Professor Newly Registered

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    Taborites in Czechia also practiced some sort of religious communism. Some marxists like Kautsky were sympathetic to them. In 1420 they founded the town of Tabor. Taborites announced that the Millenium of Christ started ( from the book of Revelation in Bible)and declared there would be no more servants and masters, all property would be held in common and there would be no more taxation. As a response to program of moderate hussites taborites wrote twelve articles of Prague in 1420 demanding between others also the abolition of all of the present laws with this in fact demanding that in Prague the same commune should be established as it was in Tabor. They won some battles against catholic armies but then turned against each other. At the beginning of 1421, the Adamites the most radical group of Hussites were expelled from Tabor. They took up the practice of going naked through towns and villages. Taborites were monogamous, but in the sect of Adamites free love seems to have been the rule. The sect practiced the ritual of dancing naked around the fire. Adamites were criticised by other Taborites because they were not thinking to live by the work of their own hands. Adamites were soon destroyed by Taborites and many of them were burned.

    Power of the Taborites was broken with the Battle of Lipany on May 30, 1434, during which their army, led by Prokop Holý, was defeated by the combined unity of Catholic forces. After this defeat they declined. Tabor was taken over by Jiří of Poděbrady the administrator of the land and his forces.

    Socialism, book written by dr. Janez Krek, published in Ljubljana, 1925, pages 210-211.

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    Taborites - Wikipedia

    [​IMG] en.wikipedia.org
     
  4. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Thanks for the thread, I never heard of Taborites.
     
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  5. Anonymous.Professor

    Anonymous.Professor Newly Registered

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    The role of catholic church in bringing down communism should not be underestimated. Already in 1948 even USA counted on pope Pius XII. that he will help to stop communist takeover of Italy for example. However in the past also catholic church was sometimes using communism. Some Indians in Latin America were evangelized with the help of jesuit monks which put them in communes.In 1608, as a result of Jesuit protest against enslavement of the indigenous population, King Philip III. gave authority to the Jesuits to convert and colonize the tribes of Guayrá. In Paraguay in 1610 Jesuits began the first commune or reduction as it was also called. Around 1700 already 30 such communes were established. The land and working tools were owned collectively. Life was organized by monks in a very religious way, with catholic church playing a major role in it with church services, prayers and religious lessons. However punishements were not very strong. Expulsion was the worst one. I was trying to find out if Guarani had private property before being sent to communes and made catholics but did not find any information about it.

    History of church, book3, published in Ljubljana, 1994, pages 259-261.

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    Jesuit reduction - Wikipedia
     

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