Corona Virus Update

You lost all credibility when you started defending an obvious BS artist. You overplayed your hand.

You may understand immunology but your credibility ends there. And 557 goes way beyond that while making obvious and pedestrian errors in logic - Freshman level crap.

I have been around brilliant people far too long to be fooled by this dog and pony show.

And you have far too much time to post pages and pages here for someone as accomplished as you claim to be.

 

I'm on vacation, dear. When I'm not, I post during evenings and weekends. So you have posted 23,859 messages here. How do YOU find the time?
You criticized me for agreeing with 557... I explained why, with solid and substantiated information... you ignored that post. That's your M.O. - when you are caught in error, you ignore the argumentation to the contrary.

While criticizing 557, you are the one who has posted some nonsense. Do you actually think that being a physicist qualifies you to understand Virology, Immunology, and Epidemiology? Sure, you do know the scientific method... but you possess zero expertise in these matters and you arrogantly dismiss those who are far more knowledgeable.

Anyway, I couldn't care less if you don't believe me. As a matter of fact, your style of debating is aggressive and offensive. I have no more interest in reading you. So, you're out of my sight as of now. Have a nice and long life. Over and out.

 

This part of your post best illuminates my point so I'll address it separately.
My point was that @557 's comparison was ridiculous. My original post stated that those who refuse the vaccine without good reason should face some cajoling or censure to make them take it for the good of the majority.
His counter was that because the obese are also a covid risk they would also need to be cajoled. In order to back up this argument he had to deny obesity was a mental issue and claim it was a lifestyle choice. For if it was an illness then one could not assume that any cajoling would help. Whereas the simply overweight in their vast majority do not pose the risks of covid spread/ driving/ accidents etc that formed the other part of his argument.
Our whole debate hinged on this point, which is why 557 was keen to blur the lines between 'obesity' (an illness in many cases) and 'overweight' a life style choice.
Hence the reason for my post addressing yours.

 

While obesity has a component that is akin to a mental illness, like an addiction to food, it also has genetic, endocrine, and metabolic causes. Yes, it is a disease more than a lifestyle choice. It is complex and multifactorial. I don't see such a clear-cut line between overweight and obese. Like I said, there is a large degree of variability in the frontier between overweight and obesity. It is a somewhat blurred line, indeed. Like I said, the more extreme cases are clear-cut, but the more intermediate cases are not. I see it more as a continuum than a compartimentalized categorical division.

I'm not so sure that cajoling and censoring are the ways to go. Look at my thread about how to convince people to take the vaccine. It proposes a more gentle and more respectful approach than that.

 

@CenterField
Re the rest of your post. I am not a great fan of using BMI to judge if someone is overweight as I think (like you?) that there are too many other factors to take into account.
I think measuring around a mans stomach is probably a good enough indication of overweight, for that's where most men put weight on. Equally on women buttocks and thighs.
While this might miss a few unusual cases it does catch most and removes muscle mass, large bones etc from the equation.

Every time I've ever been weight I am told my BMI is too high, even when I was very fit playing squash, snow boarding and going to the gym. Now like most 60 somethings I know I am currently about 8lbs heavier than my best weight (Covid lockdown). But I still exercise regularly and do a physical job, so its coming back off.
Personally the BMI label doesn't bother me, but my fear is that so many people are now labelled as overweight that its lost any real meaning. Further everyone I know whose genuinely overweight is well aware of their condition and trying to lose it.
As a doctor do you meet many patients who you feel need to lose weight who deny they are overweight?

 

Waist circumference is one of the markers we use.
No, most of my overweight and obese patients do acknowledge the problem when I bring it up, not just out of a BMI reading, but out of a combination of markers and factors, like you and I said. People are generally aware of their weight issues and self-conscious, half-ashamed. This, however, unfortunately doesn't make them very willing to work hard to correct the problem with the persistence that is needed to manage this chronic issue.

See for example how membership in gyms explodes in January (New Years' Resolutions) but then in February or March people quit.

 

https://www.modernhealthcare.com/ho...ed-er-he-waited-hours-then-his-appendix-burst
I just cannot believe that these things are happening and having to wait in the emergency rooms while attendants have their hands full doing overtime. There are still those refusing to get the shot and run the risk of getting the virus of COVID-19. I think the President out to make it mandatory that everyone in this country and elsewhere to get the vaccine whether they want to or not and we should be all for it. This has to be stopped and stopped now. These hospital emergency places are full to the max and you have to wait for many many hours to be waited on. How long can this go on? this has been going on way to long and action must be taken. That's all I'm going to say for now.

 

I had a varruca on my foot for at least 10 years and I've tried every treatment going from physical methods (using scalpel myself), chemical methods, laser, freezing and nothing worked so gave up late 2019. I was embarrassed about the varruca especially when with a new partner but there was nothing I could do.

I had the AZ vaccine in May and within few weeks I began thinking is my varruca going. It's completely gone. It seemed like the vaccine gave a warning to my immune system that it better start working. Anyway just came across this study;
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...YQFnoECAcQAQ&usg=AOvVaw1zIt3WMlGjcZPOBL44vHmQ


COVID-19 and human papillomavirus: Paradoxical immunity

I would have had the vaccine just to remove my varruca!

 

Wow, how cool is that.

 

Father, 24, who didn't get vaccinated because he heard it was 'not real' dies from Covid-19 | Daily Mail Online
https://billingsgazette.com/news/lo...age_4ecb87f7-e90d-540b-8e4b-a9c519387ae5.html
There is one person who didn't get to celebrate his 25th Birthday because he wouldn't get vaccinated hearing that it wasn't real ending up in the hospital and then dies. What does that tell you? His son will never know his father later on. That's a shame isn't it?

 

How many people do you think died because they “heard” cloth masks were as good as medical grade masks? How many people died because they “heard” masks, distancing and vaccines are the only way to prevent infection and poor Covid outcomes? How many people died because they “heard” masks only prevent infections in public places?

 

FDA authorizes Pfizer's Covid vaccine booster shot for older adults and people at high risk of severe illness

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/heal...=857693951420692326&utm_medium=Email Sailthru

 

It's hard to say how many. There are more still living when they follow the rules.

 

The demographic with the most survivors are the ones that followed science, not the “rules”. Most of the “rules” were not based on empirical evidence.

 

It helps if they want to live.

 

CDC advisory group signs off on Pfizer's Covid vaccine booster for at-risk populations

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/heal...=857693951420692326&utm_medium=Email Sailthru

 

I didn’t follow the “rules” and I was never in any danger from Covid I didn’t CHOOSE to put myself in. Following the “rules” like the “rule” to not wear a quality mask killed untold thousands.

 

OK. Your choice.

 

Yes. But only because I had planned for something like a pandemic in advance. I didn’t have to worry about bad mask advice because when there was risk of infection in public I didn’t go out in public. I didn’t have to go buy groceries or gas/fuel or other supplies because I keep large supplies of things I’m not self sufficient in. I chose a career where I work from home every day without having to make human contact. I made sure family members we wanted to maintain contact with could also self quarantine when necessary.

When you were getting bad advice of being told aerosol transmission was not common I was outside in the sunshine at least a half mile away from another person. When you were told 6 feet social distancing was “good enough” I was again a half mile or more away from others.

When you were wearing nearly useless masks recommended by “experts” I didn’t need one at all unless I was cleaning out a grain bin. When you were never told to utilize masks in the place you were 6 times more likely to be infected than in public I was at zero percent chance of infection in the place you were at greatest risk.

When information on the effects on Covid of obesity, alcohol, diet, and exercise were withheld from you I was taking care of my immune system and urging others to do so.
http://www.politicalforum.com/index.php?posts/1071603217/

Yes, it’s our choice how we deal with Covid. I was just aware of the best choices because I do my own thinking instead of letting others think for me. I encourage you to do the same. You won’t regret it. Making my own decisions on Covid made my pandemic experience very stress free compared to the stress levels of others. I highly recommend turning off the news and “experts” for advice and “rules” on Covid.

 

I recall that months ago, some argued that it was inconceivable that hospitals and doctors would fudge the Covid Stats.
Well now they are fudging (lying) about the vaccine data. https://citizenfreepress.com/breaki...nswers-regarding-unreported-vaccine-injuries/

Further more it is criminal (murder no less) that those institution deny and cover up what have been very effective treatments (almost for the beginning) allowing 100's of thousands to die. The cure for this virus has been exponentially more dangerous than the virus I haven't the time to Name the ways that is true! and I'm sure most of them have been post before.

BTW
B-I-L is sick, going in for a screening, I told honeybunch that under no circumstance should he be put on a ventilator.. I imagine we'll run across the border and get some meds. and , of course , convalesce with us, we have two completely separate houses on the estate

 

I strike my colors.

 

yeah.. they make sure to kill those who are outspoken about the vax, as I'm sure they withheld the proven effective treatments.. and did they put him on a ventilator? There is around a 60% chance you will not survive once that is used.

 

Before he died, He wanted to get people to get the vaccine and not end up like he did.

 

A Montana hospital has so many unvaccinated COVID-19 patients to treat that it's 'running out of hallways' (msn.com)

• A Montana ICU is full of COVID-19 patients, most of them unvaccinated, Kaiser Health News reported.
• The ER manager told KHN it's gotten so bad that they're "running out of hallways" to treat patients.
• Billings Clinic said it might soon implement "crisis standards of care" as cases in Montana surge.

It looks like the Billings Clinic hospital having their hands full and full of problems.

 

The percentage of beds occupied by COVID-19 patients relative to hospital capacity can be a good indicator of how a community is handling the pandemic. Statistics on hospital occupancy are listed below for Montana and for Billings. Data accurate to September 20, 2021.

• There are 2,410 beds across Montana hospitals, 377 (16%) are currently occupied by COVID-19 patients
• Billings has 589 total beds between its hospitals
• Between 70-90% of the beds at Billings Clinic and St. Vincent Healthcare are occupied.
• Billings hospitals report 142 available beds, 108 beds occupied with COVID-19 patients, and 339 beds occupied with non-COVID-19 patients