Debunked, "Socialism has never worked"

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Patricio Da Silva, Jul 7, 2020.

  1. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    Remember this, Capitalism created the greatest nation on earth. Socialist build walls to keep people in NOT out. People dont build rafts of garbage and cross 90 miles of shark infested water to escape a Capitalist system.
     
  2. (original)late

    (original)late Banned

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    Go visit them.
     
  3. PARTIZAN1

    PARTIZAN1 Well-Known Member

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    I like a quote whose author I forgot.... " a simple solution to a complex problem is usually wrong" . Likewise sustitute philosophy for problem and the quote works.
     
  4. (original)late

    (original)late Banned

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    For the most part, if I were to say socialist I would mean Denmark, a country with robust social programs.

    But our Rightys are working both sides of the street. They aren't using Socialist that way. They mean autocracy, like the old USSR.

    It's not that they don't understand the difference, they don't care.

    That way they can pretend they have something to say. Which, unfortunately, they do not.
     
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  5. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    If it's so great move there.
     
  6. PARTIZAN1

    PARTIZAN1 Well-Known Member

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    There is truth in what you said. The NAZIS let the AG Fabers, Bayern, Mesherschidts, Henkel etc be private as far as profits were concerned but they had control . The "government" provided slave labor to many German companies. An one argue that is a form of "socialism" ? Maybe
     
  7. Fangbeer

    Fangbeer Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Ignorance is bliss
     
  8. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    The more accurate term is 'simplistic solution', which is simplifying something complex past the threshold by which it can be simplified, i.e., an unworkable oversimplification.
     
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  9. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    Who ignorance, yours?
     
  10. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    How would you know? You haven't watched the video. So how much would 15 minutes of time cost you? A dollar? Not a very good excuse.
     
  11. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    The video, with documentation, debunks that assertion, which is the entire point of the OP.
     
  12. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    Almost, we are at the plutocracy stage, teetering in the direction of fascism ( Trump would have to become permanent, for me to ascribe America as fascist)
     
  13. Fangbeer

    Fangbeer Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Oh. Personal attacks? We're doing that now?

    I'm referencing ignorance of other systems by which one could qualify such feelings of happiness. The Ford Pinto is generally regarded as one of the worst cars ever built. If your poll sample is taken from a group of pinto first time car buyers, that rating significantly increases. They generally love them.

    That is to say your comparison ignores completely all the vectors that contribute to that happiness, culture, climate, geography, etc that are not transferable with a system of government, yet influence the very subjective emotion of happiness.

    https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2019/03/which-countries-have-the-most-immigrants-51048ff1f9/

    If the system is so superior, why do immigrants choose to come here instead?
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2020
  14. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    I saw a lot of fascism during the recent riots. I think we could already be there.
     
  15. Fangbeer

    Fangbeer Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  16. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    So I watched the first video and realized the second video was by the same person so I'm going to skip it. I found so many issues with his definition there isn't any point.

    First he defines socialism so incredibly broadly that he could claim just about every form of government is socialism. Generosity and charity are socialism. Anarchy is socialism, dictatorship is socialism.

    People don't mean charity or publicly owned property or any form of taxation or government benefits when they mention socialism. They mean what he hilariously termed right wing socialism.

    So basically I reject his definition because it is so broad to include everything out miraculously excludes Socialist regimes.

    I think person in the video is dishonest and attempting to engage in newspeak where words mean nothing.

    Socialism is people understand it has never worked. Newspeak socialism doesn't mean anything.
     
  17. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    the world is laughing at us for electing Trump
     
  18. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    The narrator in the video likely thinks his audience is stupid. It sounds like the kind of thing first-year philosophy professor would tell his class. Try and manipulate the children in it that don't know much about life.

    He basically says any form of hierarchy that doesn't absolutely leave people on their own is socialism and anarchy is socialism.

    but the only times it's ever failed in the case of Venezuela and the Soviet Union it has been far right socialism.

    Jesus Christ was a socialist all the gods were all the religions are.

    Everything good is left-leaning progressive socialism and everything bad is far-right regressive socialism.

    It reminds me of white fragility. where they just to make the definition mean anybody who disagrees with you about it is wrong.
     
  19. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    Not as loud as they laughed over this disgrace... upload_2020-7-7_18-10-22.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2020
  20. PARTIZAN1

    PARTIZAN1 Well-Known Member

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    That sound right!
     
  21. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    False, you're just flat out denying the truths spoken in the video. Socialism is not a simple dictionary entry, as the wikipedia entry on it is 73 pages. But, thank you for watching the video. The second video explains where Pakman is on the scale, which is that of a social democrat, as distinct from a democratic socialism.

    The countries that work the best have elements of socialism, but are not full on socialist regimes, social democracies, such as those of the netherlands, which are socially guided capitalist countries.

    Thing is, whenever a democrat recommends such things, people on the right shout 'socialism' and 'Venezuela'.

    I hear it all the damn time, and when we point to a socialistic program that works, what do we hear then from the right?

    "That's not socialism".

    Make up your ****ing minds.
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2020
  22. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    All the time?? When do you sleep?
     
  23. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    Basically the video says socialism isn't limited to Socialist countries, capitalist countries that have benefits like social security or WIC are Socialist, which to some degree I could agree, but then he goes on to say charity and generosity is socialism.

    The narrator suggested that Jesus, Christianity and Judaism are Socialist because of the concept that we are all connected.

    It was quite a far reach.

    Basically my opinion is he's trying to clean up the image of socialism. He goes on to say the governmental version of socialism we all know as socialism is really far right socialism... As if that makes sense to anybody but a progressive and everything that is good is left wing progressive socialism. If you can get past the faux erudite manner if speaking basically he is a partisan hack. All good is my side all bad is the other side.
     
  24. Booman

    Booman Banned

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    How many Americans would tolerate the progressive taxes these incredibly happy countries have? That's the one thing the advocates of socialism fail to mention. The cost and the restrictions. Yeah they have free everything but they massive taxes. Americans like having the freedom to have two cars and a big house. When their family is sick they want the doctor to do every test possible to take diagnose them. Not wait for some government bureaucrat to tell them what they can and can't get done.
     
  25. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    lots of people believe propaganda is truth that's why it's called propaganda.
    The ability to generate content on a subject is not evidence of it's complexity
    thanks for telling me what the video was about now I know I don't need to watch it.

    He basically said that Venezuela wasn't social democracy and that's exactly what it is so I'm not interested in his opinions.
    socialist regimes are what people talk about when they save socialism doesn't work so he doesn't understand what people are talking about. He goes on to say Christianity is socialism which is absurd. Christianity talks about giving of yourself not the government taking what you learned and then redistributing it as they see fit. That isn't generosity that isn't charity that's theft.
    yeah they're conservative and right-wing they don't like left-wing stuff otherwise they would be left wing.

    We see people on the left calling people on the right Nazis and far-right than extremists For not being left. Rhetoric and hyperbole are a thing.
    I hear people point out socialist ideas that work in Sweden and Denmark which are countries that are pretty homogeneous as far as culture goes. Something that works in Sweden won't necessarily work in the United States. We have a more diverse culture here.


    The only confusion that you're seeing is fabricated by people like the guy in your video trying to get to define socialism so broadly to where everything is socialism.

    So My mind Is made up socialism never works. There isn't disagreement on that from the capitalists and conservatives.
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2020
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