Debunking The Misleading Panic Over 3-D Guns

Discussion in 'Gun Control' started by 6Gunner, Aug 1, 2018.

  1. yiostheoy

    yiostheoy Well-Known Member

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    iggy list.
     
  2. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    99% of NICS checks are approved.
     
  3. Rucker61

    Rucker61 Well-Known Member

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    0.02% of felons caught lying on the Form 4473 are convicted of that felony. All the rest are free to get guns illegally.
     
  4. Xenamnes

    Xenamnes Banned

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    Irrelevant and off topic.
     
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  5. Enuf Istoomuch

    Enuf Istoomuch Well-Known Member

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    There is no such thing as a gun made on a 3D printer. Some gun parts, yes, but not a gun. not an entire firearm. Metal parts are still needed.

    Even the "Liberator Pistol" is a poor stunt as a single shot pistol. Large and bulky parts that are easily detected by modern airport scanners. A metal firing pin. A low power cartridge (metal, again) and a habit of cracking apart. What criminal wants that risk? Especially when simply going out to get one of the several hundred million real guns in this country has always worked so very well for criminals? Why play games with this toy? This stunt?

    By the way, 3D printer files for gun parts have been freely available on the internet via file sharing sites for at least six years. 3D printed gun parts are not a threat because the files have been out there in the internet wild for many years and nobody cares. Millions of copies exist all around the planet. Sure, Defense Distributed and Cody Wilson made a big splash in the news. But that was for two reasons having nothing to do with making already available files available. He is out to make a statement about two of our most cherished Constitutional Rights, Free Speech and Firearms. Plus, he has a business wanting to market his little milling machine for home use. So, fight for our rights and get lots of free advertising out of it, a win-win all around.

    So 3D printed gun part files are much ado about nothing.

    On the other hand, Amazon sells books. Go there and search for books on making your own guns. Many titles come up. Real guns, made of real materials. Same is true of gun powder and bullets and cartridge cases.

    Books are not your only source, there are many YouTube videos covering the same topics.

    Point is there is no secret here. Couldn't ban this information with a million laws and court decisions. The genie is out of the bottle and the bottle has been ground up for raw material. The fat lady has sung her piece, slimmed down and is rock'n her new bikini bod on the beach. The cat is outta' the bag and pissing in your slippers. Pandora, as it turned out, never had a box in the first place.

    Feel free to add to the list.
     
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  6. Turtledude

    Turtledude Well-Known Member Donor

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    you keep pretending that is all it takes. I guess when you have never bought more than a couple guns you wouldn't know that
     
  7. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Ive had say 5 background checks.

    all went smoothly.

    I guess Im just special. ;)
     
  8. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    that's because YOU guys refuse to fully fund and staff the ATF.
     
  9. Rucker61

    Rucker61 Well-Known Member

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    What do you mean, YOU guys? You have no idea who I vote for.

    How many agents would it take to enforce the 4473 laws?
     
  10. Enuf Istoomuch

    Enuf Istoomuch Well-Known Member

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    I've gone around asking a number of gun shop owners about their experiences with sales refused by NICS (think "FBI"). Only rarely had any of them heard of any law enforcement response happening to the prohibited person trying to buy a gun. I have witnessed NICS refusals in gun stores and every time the failed buyer just walked out the door. A few tried to talk the seller into helping figure out a way to make the sale pass. Always saw them refused.

    I recall one such transaction at the gun counter in a Cabela's store. That's a major chain for those who do not know. The buyer was refused and kept asking the gun department manager about ways around it. At one point he said if he could get his uncle or a friend to come in, would they make the sale to that person and he'd just up and pay for it? The manager said no way, but said nothing else, just "No way!"

    So I chimed in and told the guy if Cabelas sold his friend the gun knowing the circumstances, that would be a Federal crime called a "Straw Purchase". Both the real buyer and the "straw-man" could go to prison and the gun shop could lose it's license to sell guns. I told him it was the kind of thing that would bring a SWAT team to his door, it's that serious.

    The dummy left and I have to say I got excellent service from the folks at the gun counter.
     
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  11. Turtledude

    Turtledude Well-Known Member Donor

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    Only five?
     
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  12. Turtledude

    Turtledude Well-Known Member Donor

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    that's not accurate. Why should we fund an unconstitutional entity in the first place anyway?
     
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  13. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    NRA guy says: the ATF doesn't arrest enough people who lie on their NICS forms!!!!!

    American responds: well, why doesn't the GOP agree to give the ATF the funding they need to hire the personnel they need to do a better job?

    NRA guy says: screw the ATF!!!! they are an evil unConstitutional entity that should not exist!!!

    American responds: well how can the ATF do a better job, which you claim to want, if we don't fund them or even dismantle them?

    NRA guy says: MAGA!!!! MAGA!!!!! I don't care!!!!!

    ;)
     
  14. Turtledude

    Turtledude Well-Known Member Donor

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    translation-most GCAs are Democrats who don't like how the NRA members vote
     
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  15. rover77

    rover77 Well-Known Member

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    I have called ATF on suspected straw purchases , and all I got was 'send the paperwork in,we'll look at it'
     
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  16. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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    They've already been able to do just what you describe with home CNC mills and plans from the internet.

    They make snap togethers ffs.

    You can't stop the signal Ron.
     
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  17. Enuf Istoomuch

    Enuf Istoomuch Well-Known Member

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    False. There is no such thing as a 3D printed gun, that does not exist and is unlikely to ever exist under current technology and materials science.

    What a 3D printer can do in soft plastics is make some gun parts. Not enough to make an entire gun, metal is always needed. Not enough to make a durable gun either, nor a concealable gun. Even the "Liberator Pistol" is nothing better than a stunt. Large bulky blocks of plastic easily detected by modern scanners. As are the metal parts, ammunition included.

    You are running scared from a stunt, spun up by talking points that are detached from the reality of the very thing being talked about. You are being played by the overly excited news media and also, this may comes as a surprise, by Defense Distributed and Cody Wilson.

    Meanwhile criminals and terrorists the world over have access to many hundreds of millions of conventional firearms. No matter what laws you care to write, this fact cannot be altered. For the simple reason that laws are only useful in determining guilt and punishment, in providing the mechanism and processes of justice.
     
  18. Enuf Istoomuch

    Enuf Istoomuch Well-Known Member

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    When a prohibited person is denied by NICS there is no reason that the budget or staffing of the ATF need be any hindrance to arresting the person. The NICS is run by the FBI. Some states use their own agency as a middleman and add their own databases to the check. If there is a refusal, all that is needed of the FBI bureaucrat is to alert local law enforcement. Not exactly a big challenge to pick up the phone.

    But that's all about budget and sharing the workload.

    The reality is that so very many refusals are found to be incorrect, it is more likely to be a mistake to send out the cops in a big rush.
     

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