Deconstructing Gender War

Discussion in 'Women's Rights' started by ibshambat, Aug 26, 2019.

  1. ryobi

    ryobi Well-Known Member

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    Really, lol...

    In post # 63 you wrote:

    Where did this 60% reduced sentence crap come from?


    Then in post number #95 you wrote:

    .
    I did not ask you about the 60% gap, I already knew it
     
  2. ryobi

    ryobi Well-Known Member

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    Feminists are not working for equality. They're working for unaccountability.

    Take the wage gap for example,

    Women are getting more degrees than men at every level from AA degrees to PhD's yet they're choosing not to major in subjects men are more likely to major in that result in them being qualified for the more lucrative careers and this is men's fault???

    Blaming men for the consequences of your choices and actions is not Accountability.
     
  3. edna kawabata

    edna kawabata Well-Known Member

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    You are acting like you have a legitimate argument. Let's look at my full quote after I asked you to backup your statement:
    "Where did this 60% reduced sentence crap come from? Feminists have argued that giving women lighter sentences is infantilizing, based on stereotyping, and incompatible with gender equality.(I can give you the citations if you want)
    Anyway, you have not even attempted to prove your original points have you?"
    The 60% gap had nothing to do with your previous statement and feminists agree it should not be happening so it had no point. It was a dodge,
    And that is your response after all of that?
     
  4. ryobi

    ryobi Well-Known Member

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    Well there's more...



    Equality is Equal Accountability

    Equal Accountability Equals Equality
    “Today, the average full-time working woman earns just 77 cents for every dollar a man earns…in 2014, that’s an embarrassment. It is wrong.”
    –President Obama, remarks on equal pay for equal work, April 8, 2014

    Liberals believe stupid things because they believe completely in things in the complete absence of evidence in the presence of overwhelming contradictory evidence, and The Wage Gap is an excellent example of this. That’s why it’s another stupid thing Liberals believe.

    Normally you’ll always find these three statistics in every single study you read: a mean, a standard deviation, and a measurement of statistical significance like confidence intervals. However, a study exists on the wage gap that’s so good it doesn’t need to have a measure of statistical significance like confidence intervals. Normally a study will calculate confidence intervals because they tell you how likely population statistics are within a certain margin of error of the sample you actually took based on things like the samples size. However this study was so inclusive there was no need to calculate population parameters like confidence intervals, because the sample in this study is the entire population. This study is that good. The study titled tiled “An analysis of the reasons for the disparity between the wages of men and women” was prepared for The United States Department of Labor Employment Standards Division in 2009 by the CONSAD research corporation.

    The 2009 study for the United States Department of Labor Employment Standards Division found that all but 5% of the 22% wage gap is explained by choices made by the genders and there’s no evidence to suggest the remaining 5% is the result of discrimination. In fact evidence suggests the remaining 5% gap is the result of more choice. Namely the Researchers at CONSAD believe the 5% gap is the result of women choosing more compensation in the form of non-wage benefits but the Researchers at CONSAD couldn’t quantify this factor statistically because of the limitations of their model, namely multivariate regression analysis. However, this does not mean that women do not choose more compensation in the form of non-wage benefits. They do. This factor just couldn’t be quantified statistically.

    When there is a high R value (coefficient of correlation) between independent variables in multivariate regression analysis the results can’t be quantified because there is said to be collinearity. Basically, when there is collinearity, you can’t tell what’s influencing what. Is the independent variable, benefits, being influencing by the dependent variable, gender, or is the dependent variable being influenced by another independent variable in the model? However, it’s likely the remaining 5% is the result of more choice that just couldn’t be quantified statistically. In a forward to the CONSAD study Charles E. James, SR, Deputy Assistant Secretary For Federal Contract Compliance wrote:

    Although additional research in this area is clearly needed, this study leads to the unambiguous conclusion that the differences in the compensation of men and women are the result of a multitude of factors and that the raw wage gap should not be used as the basis to justify corrective action. Indeed, there may be nothing to correct. The differences in raw wages may be almost entirely the result of the individual choices being made by both male and female workers

    Even though it’s almost been entirely proven that the wage gap is the result of choice, not discrimination, liberals insist on blaming the consequences of women’s choices and actions on men. For example, Barack Obama also insinuated a 22% wage gap exists that’s the result of discrimination in his 2013 and 2014 State of the union addresses. [5]

    Some of the pay gap can be explained by what the genders tend to choose to study at university. For example, men are much more likely to study STEM (science technology engineering and math). For instance, in a paper by Andresse St. Rose titled “STEM Major Choice and the Gender Pay Gap” she found in 2007 women earned 17 percent of Bachelor’s degrees in engineering, compared to earning 79 percent of Bachelors degrees in education. In 2006 women earned only 20 percent of Bachelor degrees in physics, computer science, and engineering.[2] In a 2007 paper by Dey and Hill titled Behind the Gender Pay Gap they found STEM degrees tend to have higher salaries than their peers with degrees in other disciplines. For example, one year after graduation, an education major working full time earned, on average, about 60 percent as much as an engineering major working full time ($525 versus $851 per week)[3] Despite earning most of the degrees in post-secondary education women are choosing not to major in subjects that result in them being qualified for the lucrative careers men are more likely to be qualified for when they graduate, and according to Liberals this is men’s fault? If liberals believe in equality then shouldn’t they believe women should be equally accountable for the consequences of their actions and choices as men? Blaming men for the consequences of your actions and choices is not accountability.

    For decades, liberals have claimed that discrimination blocks women from landing academic positions in STEM fields. However a paper published online by the National Academy of Sciences by Wendy M Williams and Stephen J. Cecil titled National Hiring experiments Reveal 2:1 Faculty Preference For Women on STEM Tenure Track found that in experiments with professors from 371 colleges and universities across the United States that science and engineering faculty actually preferred women two-to-one over identically qualified male candidates for assistant professor positions. [4]

    If you’re preferred 2:1, you’re not being discriminated against. Some people might even suggest a 1:1 preference of identically qualified candidates would be equality and a 2:1 preference for women over identically qualified male candidates is actually an indication of discrimination against men, not women.

    Bibliography

    [1] CONSAD Research Corporation 2009. “An Analysis of Reasons for the Disparity in Wages Between Men and Women” Prepared for The United States Department of Labor Employment Standards Administration Accessed August 23, 2015. http://www.consad.com/content/report…l Report.pdf

    [2] Andresse St. Rose 2010. “STEM major choice and the gender pay gap” On Campus with Women
    http://archive.aacu.org/ocww/volume3….cfm?section=1

    [3]Dey, J. G., and C. Hill. 2007. Behind the pay gap. Washington, DC: AAUW Educational Foundation
    National Association of Colleges and Employers. 2009. Salary survey

    [4] Stephen J. Cecil and Wendy M. Williams, “National Hiring Experiments Reveal 2:1 Faculty Preference For Women on STEM Tenure Track,” Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/…ulty-positions

    [5] Glenn Kessler,” President Obama’s persistent ’77-cent’ claim on the wage gap gets a new Pinocchio rating,” The Washington Post, April, 9th, 2014, The Washington Post, https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/…occhio-rating/
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2019
  5. edna kawabata

    edna kawabata Well-Known Member

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    Yes, historically women were paid less than men for the same job and that is much improved with the help of feminist complaints, but what has that to do with:
    Feminists do not value motherhood but they do abortion.
    Feminists wish they could get pregnant so they can abort, it is a badge of honor.
    Feminism is an unaccountability movement.
     
  6. ryobi

    ryobi Well-Known Member

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    If feminism is an equality movement and not an unaccountability movement then why do Feminists blame men for the consequences of women's bad choices. That's neither accountability or equality.
     
  7. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    we are not blaming individual men but rather we blamed the patriarchy. Where men only were allowed in the top networking colleges. Where only men could get credit cards in their own names if they were married. teaching was a predominantly female profession so I guess you would consider women who went into it making poor choices. That’s an example. Women dominated professions are paid less. What can be more important than educating children? Women were nurses and they got paid very little but now the same women are going into medicine or nurse practitioners where they get paid what they are worth and now we have a shortage of nurses.Another interesting example was men were called custodians and the women with the janitors. They did the same work but the custodians got paid more
     
  8. ryobi

    ryobi Well-Known Member

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    Sure only 24.7% of congress are female but 99.9% of garbage collectors are men.



    Men have always done the difficult, grueling, disgusting, painful, dangerous unglamorous work

    Feminists aren't out protesting that there aren't enough female garbage collectors but they are out protesting that there aren't enough women in congress.

    Feminists want more women in the glamorous jobs. They don't care about the other jobs men have always done that make civilization possible.

    That's not equality.
     
  9. edna kawabata

    edna kawabata Well-Known Member

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    You are making even less sense. What "consequences of women's bad choices" are feminists blaming men for?
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2019
  10. ryobi

    ryobi Well-Known Member

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    Equal Accountability Equals Equality
    “Today, the average full-time working woman earns just 77 cents for every dollar a man earns…in 2014, that’s an embarrassment. It is wrong.”
    –President Obama, remarks on equal pay for equal work, April 8, 2014

    Liberals believe stupid things because they believe completely in things in the complete absence of evidence in the presence of overwhelming contradictory evidence, and The Wage Gap is an excellent example of this. That’s why it’s another stupid thing Liberals believe.

    Normally you’ll always find these three statistics in every single study you read: a mean, a standard deviation, and a measurement of statistical significance like confidence intervals. However, a study exists on the wage gap that’s so good it doesn’t need to have a measure of statistical significance like confidence intervals. Normally a study will calculate confidence intervals because they tell you how likely population statistics are within a certain margin of error of the sample you actually took based on things like that samples size. However this study was so inclusive there was no need to calculate population parameters like confidence intervals, because the sample in this study is the entire population. This study is that good. The study titled tiled “An analysis of the reasons for the disparity between the wages of men and women” was prepared for The United States Department of Labor Employment Standards Division in 2009 by the CONSAD research corporation.

    The 2009 study for the United States Department of Labor Employment Standards Division found that all but 5% of the 22% wage gap is explained by choices made by the genders and there’s no evidence to suggest the remaining 5% is the result of discrimination. In fact evidence suggests the remaining 5% gap is the result of more choice. Namely the Researchers at CONSAD believe the 5% gap is the result of women choosing more compensation in the form of non-wage benefits but the Researchers at CONSAD couldn’t quantify this factor statistically because of the limitations of their model, namely multivariate regression analysis. However, this does not mean that women do not choose more compensation in the form of non-wage benefits. They do. This factor just couldn’t be quantified statistically.

    When there is a high R value (coefficient of correlation) between independent variables in multivariate regression analysis the results can’t be quantified because there is said to be collinearity. Basically, when there is collinearity, you can’t tell what’s influencing what. Is the independent variable, benefits, being influencing by the dependent variable, gender, or is the dependent variable being influenced by another independent variable in the model? However, it’s likely the remaining 5% is the result of more choice that just couldn’t be quantified statistically. In a forward to the CONSAD study Charles E. James, SR, Deputy Assistant Secretary For Federal Contract Compliance wrote:

    Although additional research in this area is clearly needed, this study leads to the unambiguous conclusion that the differences in the compensation of men and women are the result of a multitude of factors and that the raw wage gap should not be used as the basis to justify corrective action. Indeed, there may be nothing to correct. The differences in raw wages may be almost entirely the result of the individual choices being made by both male and female workers

    Even though it’s almost been entirely proven that the wage gap is the result of choice, not discrimination, liberals insist on blaming the consequences of women’s choices and actions on men. For example, Barack Obama also insinuated a 22% wage gap exists that’s the result of discrimination in his 2013 and 2014 State of the union addresses. [5]

    Some of the pay gap can be explained by what the genders tend to choose to study at university. For example, men are much more likely to study STEM (science technology engineering and math). For instance, in a paper by Andresse St. Rose titled “STEM Major Choice and the Gender Pay Gap” she found in 2007 women earned 17 percent of Bachelor’s degrees in engineering, compared to earning 79 percent of Bachelors degrees in education. In 2006 women earned only 20 percent of Bachelor degrees in physics, computer science, and engineering.[2] In a 2007 paper by Dey and Hill titled Behind the Gender Pay Gap they found STEM degrees tend to have higher salaries than their peers with degrees in other disciplines. For example, one year after graduation, an education major working full time earned, on average, about 60 percent as much as an engineering major working full time ($525 versus $851 per week)[3] Despite earning most of the degrees in post-secondary education women are choosing not to major in subjects that result in them being qualified for the lucrative careers men are more likely to be qualified for when they graduate, and according to Liberals this is men’s fault? If liberals believe in equality then shouldn’t they believe women should be equally accountable for the consequences of their actions and choices as men? Blaming men for the consequences of your actions and choices is not accountability.

    For decades, liberals have claimed that discrimination blocks women from landing academic positions in STEM fields. However a paper published online by the National Academy of Sciences by Wendy M Williams and Stephen J. Cecil titled National Hiring experiments Reveal 2:1 Faculty Preference For Women on STEM Tenure Track found that in experiments with professors from 371 colleges and universities across the United States that science and engineering faculty actually preferred women two-to-one over identically qualified male candidates for assistant professor positions. [4]

    If you’re preferred 2:1, you’re not being discriminated against. Some people might even suggest a 1:1 preference of identically qualified candidates would be equality and a 2:1 preference for women over identically qualified male candidates is actually an indication of discrimination against men, not women.

    Bibliography

    [1] CONSAD Research Corporation 2009. “An Analysis of Reasons for the Disparity in Wages Between Men and Women” Prepared for The United States Department of Labor Employment Standards Administration Accessed August 23, 2015. http://www.consad.com/content/report…l Report.pdf

    [2] Andresse St. Rose 2010. “STEM major choice and the gender pay gap” On Campus with Women
    http://archive.aacu.org/ocww/volume3….cfm?section=1

    [3]Dey, J. G., and C. Hill. 2007. Behind the pay gap. Washington, DC: AAUW Educational Foundation
    National Association of Colleges and Employers. 2009. Salary survey

    [4] Stephen J. Cecil and Wendy M. Williams, “National Hiring Experiments Reveal 2:1 Faculty Preference For Women on STEM Tenure Track,” Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/…ulty-positions

    [5] Glenn Kessler,” President Obama’s persistent ’77-cent’ claim on the wage gap gets a new Pinocchio rating,” The Washington Post, April, 9th, 2014, The Washington Post, https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/…occhio-rating/
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2019
  11. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    What a ridiculous argument why would women protest to get jobs as female garbage collectors? They don’t want those jobs and if they do they should be able to have them. Why aren’t male out protesting that there aren’t enough male kindergarten teachers?
    What glamorous jobs do feminists want? You mean doctors and lawyers and accountants and stockbrokers are what you call glamorous? Why shouldn’t they want these jobs?
     
  12. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    What I find so interesting is that you interchange feminism with a liberal. That means that conservative women do not believe in equal rights for themselves
     
  13. ryobi

    ryobi Well-Known Member

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    That was an excerpt from my book about the dumb things Liberals believe.

    There is a wage gap that is the result of discrimination is one of the chapters
     
  14. ryobi

    ryobi Well-Known Member

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    What I find interesting is you equate Feminism with Equality.
     
  15. ryobi

    ryobi Well-Known Member

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    Male are out to protest that there aren't enough grade school teachers.

    Another excerpt from my book about the dumb things liberals believe.

    Isn’t giving someone an opportunity based on their race and/or gender and denying another person that same opportunity based on their race and gender, racism and sexism? If affirmative action isn’t sexist then why isn’t there affirmative action for males in fields dominated by females, like elementary education, where 87% of the teachers are female? [129] If affirmative action isn’t racist, then why isn’t there affirmative action in the NBA, were 76 percent of the players were African American in 2015 while only 12.6% of the population in the United States was African American during the same period? [130]

    Aren’t affirmative action laws against the equal protection clause of the fourteenth amendment, the same equal protection clause that resulted in the end of segregation in the south in the 1960’s? The equal protection clause provides that no state shall deny to any person within its jurisdiction "the equal protection of the laws," but affirmative action laws give preferential treatment to some people based on their race and/or gender and they deny others that same preferential treatment based on their race and gender. Shouldn’t affirmative action laws be unconstitutional? How are white males privileged when they’re the only race and/or gender combination discriminated against via unconstitutional racist and sexist hate laws?
     
  16. ryobi

    ryobi Well-Known Member

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    l
    Feminists value motherhood so much that they want to kill children before they have a chance of being born.
     
  17. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    Is it published?
     
  18. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    How do you kill children? Or are you talking about ZEFs What I suggest is you remove thr 1/10 of 1 ounce fetus and dress it in a sailor suit. Feminists do value motherhood they know when they are capable of being good mothers. Men just walk away from born children!
     
  19. ryobi

    ryobi Well-Known Member

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    Yes.
     
  20. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    Your book is filled with fallacies. The first one that is so silly is that most elementary school teachers are female The fallacy is that men want those jobs but they can’t get them. It’s not true. Men don’t want those jobs. Same with nursing and secretarial and by the way the coincidence is that they were low paying jobs.I know that elementary schools seek qualified males for the diversity. So you really think that the NBA doesn’t want white guys? Of course they do....white guys love to see white guys play. They would love to have super basketball players who are white.Most black basketball players grew up in poor housing projects like my students did and basketball hoops were available in the projects ...so they developed the skills. You don’t hear people complaining about no black men playing volleyball?
    What you don’t seem to understand is white males are not specifically banned from any profession or university strictly because they are white or male. Blacks and women were victims of institutionalized sexism and racism . You are just are angry because you resent the diversity. When white men are told they may not go to Harvard or Yale or Princeton then we’ll talk. When sports don’t allow white people, then we’ll talk. When white men cant get business loans, we’ll talk.....I think you just suffer from victim envy
     
    edna kawabata likes this.
  21. edna kawabata

    edna kawabata Well-Known Member

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    We seem to be stuck on repeat. You deny that women were and are, in some cases, paid less than a man for the same job and because feminists brought that inequality to the general public you call them the "unaccountability movement"? https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone.../2018/08/23/worst-paying-jobs-women/37504673/ That seems to be all you have to back up your slurs and lies. I think some self examination is in order and I think I can make better use of my time.
     

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