Decriminalizing cocaine, meth, speed and heroin

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Balto, Jul 8, 2017.

  1. Balto

    Balto Well-Known Member

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    i don't personally use, but the whole War on Drugs I believe is simply for law enforcement and for-profit prisons to profile people, and rack in more quotas. Fact of the matter is, with this whole opioid epidemic going on, it's not the drug that is the problem, it's the person using the drug. If I overdose on heroin or cocaine, it's my fault, and not reason for the drug to be criminalizes. Imagine the state renenue we would bring in, if we decriminalized and sold amphetamines. Amphetamines are already sold as prescriptions for ADHD or to minimize weight gain.

    Cocaine is used in hospitals for certain medical uses. So, it is already commonplace.
     
  2. nra37922

    nra37922 Well-Known Member

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    So if one OD's who picks up the hospital and other costs associated with this?
     
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  3. logical1

    logical1 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    This is about the most ignorant left wing idea yet.
     
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  4. Balto

    Balto Well-Known Member

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    How, because its killing off the failed War on Drugs? Is this leftist idea of putting accountability on the user of the drug too radical for you?
     
  5. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    Not really. Milton Friedman, a Pulitzer prize-winning economist, and what many would describe as very conservative in the libertarian style, has advocated for legalized drugs for 20 or 30 years now. So did William Buckley, an arch-conservative. Any economist worth his salt understands the horrible error of prohibition.
     
  6. spiritgide

    spiritgide Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    De-criminalizing such drugs would go far to eliminate the drug cartels. If the products were cheap, it would lower the amount of drug driven theft and crime. However- it would put the government and to a degree all of us in the position of being drug dealers or enablers. That is a huge moral dilemma. If it results in more overdoses and people lost to drugs, what then? Do we look at the overall cost to a society in terms of human resources and quality of life as well as money?

    The bottom line is that people who become addicts of any kind have a maturity problem; they can't deal with some aspects of life head-on. Most psychologists for example will tell you that while all immature adults are not alcoholics, all alcoholics are immature. Drugs of any kind are an escape mechanism. Making them legal will not affect that at all, and to some extent will validate the use of them. Personally- I feel it your right to make yourself worthless if you choose, but nobody, either personally or by government edict, has any obligation to save you from yourself. No program or support will help such people until they are fully dedicated and determined to help themselves. Our problem socially is that the majority of people don't understand that and think that they can make a difference by insulating these people from the consequences of their own actions. What such people derive from that is that their problems are indeed somebody elses fault, and they are powerless to change them- so they wait for someone else to do it. Those people who "help" are the enablers, which provide the shield that allow addicts to go being addicts. Bad conclusion, but we just can't stand to let them suffer enough to change their point of view.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2017
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  7. God & Country

    God & Country Well-Known Member

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    To quote an old PSA "They don't call it dope for nothing kid!" The message is drugs make you stupid, I don't think anyone can argue with that. America in many ways has devolved in the last five decades and nowhere is that more evident than our attitude towards casual drug use. In so many cases "casual' evolves into a problem.The idea of decriminalizing small amounts of illicit drugs is sound for obvious reasons but it has opened the door to legalization. If we remove the stigma of drug abuse the consequences will be forgotten especially with impressionable youths. Here in the northeast we are experiencing a heroin crisis. It has gone way beyond the addict community and is killing a lot of kids. Local law enforcement is required to carry Narcan Opiate Antidote because overdoses are so prevalent.Even marijuana has attendant problems but there is this great rush to legalize it with no credible studies of long term effects. To legalize all narcotics would be insanely irresponsible and a detriment to society. If we treated the purveyors of street narcotics as we do murderers making it a capital offense the whole industry would eventually dry up.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2017
  8. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Well-Known Member

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    You should know that "for profit prisons" make up a tiny percentage of American prisons.
     
  9. VietVet

    VietVet Well-Known Member

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    Certainly the laws against marijuana are in need of repeal.
    The problem is that since the penal system has been privatized, there is tons of money to be made keeping Americans who did no harm to anyone locked up.
    We have the highest prison population IN THE WORLD - Greater than China with 3 times our population!
    I am not so sure other drugs should be decriminalized, but there is no reason Pot carries such harsh penalties - except for the profit motive of private prisons.
     
  10. VietVet

    VietVet Well-Known Member

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  11. camp_steveo

    camp_steveo Well-Known Member

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    Ron Paul goes on that list too,
     
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  12. camp_steveo

    camp_steveo Well-Known Member

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    That is what's up. This is a little more on the same subject. Dr Paul speech to NORML discussing the racism in drug laws

     
  13. Bravo Duck

    Bravo Duck Member

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    As long as you're not harming or endangering someone else you should be free to do what you want. LIBERTY!
     
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  14. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    You pay for that with taxes on the drugs. Include also taxes that pay for free rehab if wanted.
     
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  15. Balto

    Balto Well-Known Member

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    Once someone is an addict, I don't think they will ever be able to kill off that demon once and for all. That's why these recovery centers are a joke.

    Taxing the sale of these products can lead to development of mental health centers and resources for those who have addictive personalities. Addictive personalities are something I think one is born with, in other words its genetic. For example, if your family has a history of severe alcoholism, chances are if you pick up the bottle, you will be too. It's been medically proven that people cannot overdose from marijuana, but will pass out before they overdose, whereas with alcohol, even water, you can overdose and die.
     
  16. Labouroflove

    Labouroflove Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    A couple doses of narcan costs what? $30? A damn sight cheeper than the budgets of DEA, FBI, State Trooper Drug Task forces, County and City police drug enforcement. Let's not forget the cost of trial and incarnation. We also must add the theft, robbery, prostitution, etc. involved in paying for illicit drugs "artifically" inflated in price through the black market created by the war on drugs.

    That, though, is besides the point. The dramatic rise in overdoses, 400% in 10 years, is the direct result of the DEA putting a jack boot on Doctors. We've driven the only logical practitioner for the treatment of addiction out of the discussion, and we've payed one hell of a price.

    [​IMG]

    Yea baby, centralized policing to enforce drug policy has worked so damn well! Primary care physician's ability to treat and manage addiction on an individual based worked best. But hey big government has the solution, just look, see the progress!

    Cheers

    Brattleboro has 11 opiate overdoses in 24 hours
    Posted: Jul 05, 2017 10:18 AM EDTUpdated: Jul 07, 2017 5:00 PM EDT

    BRATTLEBORO, Vt. (AP) - Police say emergency crews in a Vermont town of about 12,000 have responded to 11 opiate overdoses in 24 hours, including two people who were in critical condition.

    Two victims were flown to regional hospitals. As of Wednesday morning, police said they had survived.

    There are similarities between the overdoses, including markers or stamps on the bags of heroin.

    In the past, police have released those markers as a warning, but police now say users seeking an effective high will look for the batches highlighted by police.

    http://www.wcax.com/story/35814849/brattleboro-has-11-opiate-overdoses-in-24-hours
    ------------

    Great job! Cops, legislatures, Governors, the Treatment Community, take ****ing bow! Killers all.

    Cheers
     
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  17. nra37922

    nra37922 Well-Known Member

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    How about a different course of action. Just start letting them die, think the message will get out?

    Humane NO, effective?
     
  18. Balto

    Balto Well-Known Member

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    It's really a matter of personal freedom. The war on drugs fiasco should be so tame, I could grow fifteen plants of weed in my bathroom, a cop car could pass my residence, and I wouldn't face jail time. When I was in second grade, there was this book our teacher read to us on alcohol and drug prevention. Drugs can create brain damage and tooth decay, I won't deny that. But gasoline fumes when you fuel your car, in developing brains has been shown to kill brain cells. In adults, not so much. The rush to legalize marijuana I am willing to guess, is because states are seeing the gold in tax revenue rushing in states like Colorado and Washington state, aside from the medical benefits that have been proven toward epilepsy and arthritis for example, as well as nausea and chronic depression.
     
  19. Balto

    Balto Well-Known Member

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    Fun fact, the DEA is well responsible for the whole "War on Drugs" fiasco, and that was started by Richard Nixon. In this case, its the democrats and progressives fighting for personal freedom, and Republicans vouching for government control. Just letting them die off is no more effective than when we send Americans citizens to literally kill them off in war.

    Not humane nor effective.
     
  20. BleedingHeadKen

    BleedingHeadKen Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If one crashes a motorcycle who picks up the hospital and other costs? If one jaywalks and is hit by a car, what then? Or is this more about the contents of their blood rather than the poor choices that they make?
     
  21. BleedingHeadKen

    BleedingHeadKen Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yeah, what are they thinking reducing the power of government! Government should get bigger and punish more people!

    Conservatives *love* big government, more so than progressives.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2017
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  22. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    Their policies are all about controlling, but not helping people. Big Government when it comes to personal liberty. Big government when it comes to nation-building in other counties. No support for nation-building at home - that would be socialism. :rolleyes:

    The Republican War on Drugs has done far more damage than the drugs alone could ever do. They turned our cities into war zones.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2017
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  23. Labouroflove

    Labouroflove Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Dry up?

    Lol. How do you think this is being allowed to happen? Cop's are selling drugs or at least being paid, Lawyers and Judges are being bribed.

    Insanity and detriment describe the current policy. Here's the gig, medical science has a good grasp on addiction. Opiate addiction rates world wide have remained the same, about 2-3%. 90% of the world's population isn't addicted because they aren't predisposed to addiction. Only about 10% or so of humans have the neurological wiring necessary to crave an altered state. Your armageddon, pandemic fears are bunk!

    Give this back to doctors, family doctors, I trust them. I do not trust government solutions, centralized v individual. Basic.

    I'm as right wing a it gets.

    Cheers
     
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  24. Pred

    Pred Well-Known Member

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    Make it legal but no ER support for ODs. How quickly would we thin out the herd;)

    It's a win win!
     
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  25. TedintheShed

    TedintheShed Banned

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    Legalize all drugs. No taxes upon them as that only makes the government more powerful.

    Who will pay the hospital bill? No one. Repeal healthcare and the Reagan era law that is used for justification by the left leaning authoritarians for Obamacare.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2017
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