Did my dead brother communicate to our nephew during a dream?

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by K9Buck, Jan 19, 2020.

  1. K9Buck

    K9Buck Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Messages:
    667
    Likes Received:
    544
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    Ok. 8)
     
  2. Market Junkie

    Market Junkie Banned

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2016
    Messages:
    2,390
    Likes Received:
    1,920
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Blind faith is for suckers...
     
  3. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2010
    Messages:
    78,717
    Likes Received:
    19,868
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Likely, just Matt's subconscious doing a little expansion of the days events.
     
  4. rahl

    rahl Banned

    Joined:
    May 31, 2010
    Messages:
    62,508
    Likes Received:
    7,651
    Trophy Points:
    113
    no it takes a rejection of reason.

    Nobody makes the claim the universe caused itself to come into existence
     
    JET3534 and Diablo like this.
  5. K9Buck

    K9Buck Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Messages:
    667
    Likes Received:
    544
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    The universe has not existed forever. Science demonstrates that it had a beginning. What caused the universe to come into existence? To say that it has always existed is illogical. Everything has a beginning. There is only one uncaused first cause and that is our creator, otherwise known as God. You may ask "Who created him". Logically, we KNOW that there had to be something, or someone, who has always existed and who did not need another to cause it/him to come into existence.
     
  6. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2010
    Messages:
    78,717
    Likes Received:
    19,868
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    What is God's beginning?
     
  7. K9Buck

    K9Buck Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Messages:
    667
    Likes Received:
    544
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    He doesn't have a beginning. He has just always been. It's beyond our comprehension, but it is the only logical answer. Besides, there is all sorts of other evidence for his existence, if one is willing to open their mind and their heart.
     
  8. James California

    James California Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2019
    Messages:
    11,335
    Likes Received:
    11,469
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    ~ Some believe death is actually another beginning ...
    I believe there are other dimensions we know nothing about .
     
    dairyair likes this.
  9. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2010
    Messages:
    78,717
    Likes Received:
    19,868
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    You said the Universe has to have a beginning. Because, EVERYTHING, has a beginning.
    Now you say at least god doesn't need a beginning. So why do you claim the Universe needs a beginning if god doesn't need a beginning?

    I grew up and spent a good part of adulthood as a LCMS Christian. And then I opened my mind and heart.
    Now I see mankind in a completely new way. No hating of people for who they were born to be anymore.
     
  10. K9Buck

    K9Buck Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Messages:
    667
    Likes Received:
    544
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    Something HAD to come first that didn't require another to cause it to come into existence, right?
     
  11. JET3534

    JET3534 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2014
    Messages:
    13,350
    Likes Received:
    11,517
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You say the universe could not have always existed yet an invisible God has always existed. This is a logical contradiction.
     
  12. K9Buck

    K9Buck Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Messages:
    667
    Likes Received:
    544
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    Something has always existed that didn't need another to cause it to come into existence. You tell me, what was it?
     
  13. JET3534

    JET3534 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2014
    Messages:
    13,350
    Likes Received:
    11,517
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I am not making the claim that something has always existed. That is your claim. People making claims get to provide the proof.
     
  14. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2010
    Messages:
    78,717
    Likes Received:
    19,868
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    And why not the universe?
    Besides, it is now believed there are more than 1 universe.
    Energy also. Can not be created nor destroyed.
     
  15. K9Buck

    K9Buck Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Messages:
    667
    Likes Received:
    544
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    Is it your belief that there was once nothingness and then, from nothingness, nothingness created existence?
     
  16. K9Buck

    K9Buck Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Messages:
    667
    Likes Received:
    544
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    There is ZERO evidence for that but, for the sake of discussion, let's say there is more than one universe. It would still need a creator to make that initial "push" to get it all started.
     
  17. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2010
    Messages:
    78,717
    Likes Received:
    19,868
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiverse

    More evidence than your god having always existed.

    A creator would need a creator in your world.

    Energy can not be created or destroyed.
     
  18. K9Buck

    K9Buck Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Messages:
    667
    Likes Received:
    544
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    If you say so. Good luck.

    Matthew 10:14
    If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet.
     
  19. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2010
    Messages:
    78,717
    Likes Received:
    19,868
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    If you say so. Good luck.

    BTW - It's not my say so. I didn't create or contribute to the wiki.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2020
  20. K9Buck

    K9Buck Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Messages:
    667
    Likes Received:
    544
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    John 10:26
    Context
    26“But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep. 27“My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; 28and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish
     
  21. JET3534

    JET3534 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2014
    Messages:
    13,350
    Likes Received:
    11,517
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I don't have a belief about the origin of the universe. Sometime ambiguity has to be accepted.
     
  22. K9Buck

    K9Buck Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Messages:
    667
    Likes Received:
    544
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    Can you name something in the universe that can cause itself to come into existence? I can't. Not even the universe could have caused itself to come into existence. Sadly, many have closed their eyes and their minds and adamantly refuse to accept the logic of a creator that is staring them in the face. That's their choice. God doesn't make anyone seek or follow him.
     
  23. JET3534

    JET3534 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2014
    Messages:
    13,350
    Likes Received:
    11,517
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Maybe the universe always existed the way you believe your God always existed. How is your claim that God always existed not a special pleading logical fallacy.
     
  24. K9Buck

    K9Buck Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Messages:
    667
    Likes Received:
    544
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    Science demonstrates that the universe had a beginning.
     
  25. K9Buck

    K9Buck Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Messages:
    667
    Likes Received:
    544
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    And the universe will have an end.

    ...the birth of new stars must eventually cease, since there's a limited amount of hydrogen, helium, and other stuff that can undergo fusion. This means that all the stars will eventually burn out. ... These will run out of hydrogen about 1013 years from now, and slowly cool.Feb 7, 2016
    upload_2020-1-26_23-36-34.png
    math.ucr.edu › home › baez › end
    end - UCR Math
     

Share This Page