Do you feel it's difficult to provide a modest middle class life today?

Discussion in 'Economics & Trade' started by kazenatsu, Apr 2, 2018.

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Is providing for oneself a modest middle class living standard difficult?

  1. No, anyone with a half decent brain and strong work ethic can do, not extremely difficult

    8 vote(s)
    32.0%
  2. Not really much more difficult than it's always been

    8 vote(s)
    32.0%
  3. only for those who aren't college material

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  4. Yes, it is substantially more difficult today, people are treading water trying to stay afloat

    9 vote(s)
    36.0%
  1. Idahojunebug77

    Idahojunebug77 Well-Known Member

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    It appears you have discovered yet another label that is misused. What you(and many others) call liberals are not liberal at all, but instead authoritarian.
     
  2. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    @OldManOnFire

    Actually I find stereotyping to be a very useful social tool.
    It very much isn't false or unnecessary.
    It's true and time saving and will protect you.

    It can be rude. It can used rudely or also people may take offence when the self image they have is "rudely" discovered not to be shared by their peers.
    But it can also be complimentary. Japanese people are honest.
    This is a stereotype, I bet my wallet on this stereo type and often. And it is in my eyes a most complimentary stereo type.
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2018
  3. james M

    james M Banned

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    liberalism is big govt and therefore authoritarian. Simple enough?
     
  4. james M

    james M Banned

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    I generally agree, if you say blacks cause 55% of the crime while being 14% of the population you are stereotyping correctly. But this may be unfair, impolite, discouraging to blacks who are not criminal.
     
  5. rahl

    rahl Banned

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    Conservatives are big government, and authoritarian.
     
  6. james M

    james M Banned

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    Even Trump just cut taxes massively to shrink govt. Its been in all the papers! See why we must be positive that liberalism is based in pure ignorance?
     
  7. rahl

    rahl Banned

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    Lol, by expanding government? You understand he increased military spending right?

    The ****ing irony of this statement is absolutely hilarious.
     
  8. james M

    james M Banned

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    for 4th time: military is not govt. You need a massive military to defend and tiny libertarian country.
     
  9. james M

    james M Banned

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    if liberalism is not based in pure ignorance then why so afraid to say something intelligent in defense of it? Go ahead give it a try. Then ask a conservative to defend conservatism and see if you find any fear and inability. What does that teach you?
     
  10. rahl

    rahl Banned

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    :roflol::roflol::roflol::roflol::roflol:

    We aren't a libertarian country, and we are in no danger of being attacked by anyone.
     
  11. rahl

    rahl Banned

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    you know perfectly well I have demolished every moronic claim you've made in every exchange we have had. You've lost $40,000 in bets so far, and you run away each time I point it out and ask what your preferred method of payment is. It's amusing.
     
  12. jay runner

    jay runner Banned

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    In what century of human history has life not been difficult.

    Life is supposed to be easy?
     
  13. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    I don't need labels to pitch my tent...
     
  14. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    I know the book definition of 'label'...the problem here is that 99% of people abuse labeling when it's used to pigeon-hole or denigrate others. This type of labeling requires stereotypical labels which are BS...
     
  15. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    The flaw in your example of 'Japanese people are honest' is the fact that not all Japanese people are honest. So why assume this? Some people probably stereotype Japanese people as not honest, cannot be trusted, because of something as simple as the Pearl Harbor attack...
     
  16. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    As Keynes noted, "practical men who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence, are usually the slaves of some defunct economist". The tent comes pre-labelled, you just haven't noticed.
     
  17. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    And, very ironically, these men are (or claim to be) disciples of Keynes today.

    An economist can still go awry by focusing on the aspect of one phenomena too much, to the exclusion of seeing everything else. When you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

    Let's also point out that Keynes advocated saving money during good times to be able to spend it in bad. He didn't actually specifically say what should happen if you never bothered saving money and then bad times came upon you.
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2018
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  18. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    Strange comment, given many countries have suffered the stupidity of austerity
     
  19. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    They got into the stupidity of massive debts that were very difficult to manage.

    And even more difficult to start trying to pay off.
    If starting to pay off the debt causes so much havoc, they shouldn't have got into these debts in the first place.

    Austerity is just the inevitable other side of the coin to taking on lots of debt.
    Some people don't want to recognize that and want to kick the can as far down the road as they can.

    You sound like the sort of person who would blame the credit company for repossessing your car if you defaulted on your credit card debts.
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2018
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  20. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well it's supposed to be a lot better than Third World countries. But the gap has seemed to be narrowing.

    Just the other day I was reading about sweatshop conditions and massive homelessness in England. They also have a big payday lender problem in many working class towns.
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2018
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  21. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    Another untruth! There is no rationale for austerity outside boom. Britain, for example, has significantly increased its debt by adopting austerity (with growth suffering)

    You really need to teach yourself some basic macro.
     
  22. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Unless the boom will never come. That's like continuing to get new credit cards to cover the debt of old credit cards, all the while hoping if you can just buy some more time there'll be some major turnaround in your life that will allow you to pay them all off.
     
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  23. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    You've assumed away the business cycle now? Wow.

    Repetition of false narrative. As I said, you need to learn some macro.
     
  24. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps others need community tents/labels but I resist them and prefer to be judged, and to achieve, based on my own merits. I notice the labels and the way they are used today IMO is a sign of self-serving ignorance...
     
  25. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    That's just a reference to the practical man's slavery though isn't it? You don't give yourself a label, but as soon as you use economic comment you're yelling in favour of a particular political economy (with its own ethical structure)
     

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