I do understand your point that it is easier to find gas giants outside the Goldilocks zone than the most likely candidates for finding life. And I would hope that anyone who espouses the Rare Earth theory or the notion that because there are billions of stars out there, so therefore life has to exist, realizes that we are working with an enormously incomplete data set. Tomorrow's astronomical observations may completely and radically change one or both of the competing theories. Right now, the trend is that the more we learn, the better the Rare Earth Theory looks, but one discovery could change everything. I think we should continue looking, but only by the use of passive means. I think it monumentally unwise to broadcast radio waves or x-rays into space in an effort to contact another civilization. In the anthropological history of the world, it was never a good thing to be 'discovered' by others. Peaceful intent does not lend itself to friendly exploration. Just ask the Mayans, Aztecs, Incas, and Anasazis how being discovered worked out for them.
That ship sailed long ago. You can't hide in this universe. Anyone with a halfway decent telescope would have known there's life here for the past hundreds of millions of years and could have eliminated us with a trivial effort (for a reasonably advanced race), if they were so inclined. I suppose there could be alien civs that are all progressing along the same timeline, and it wouldn't be wise to broadcast your existence to them, but that seems really unlikely.
If you have an argument I'll trust you to make it. In general, evidence of life outside of our planet (let alone solar system) would be huge throughout the entire world wide scientific community - and throughout all populations, for that matter. And, I don't believe that it would be possible to create an international conspiracy of hiding that. This is a world event and is of huge interest to nations that are just as advanced as we are in science and technology and have equal ability to examine the events that happen in THEIR part of the world, which would be of as much interest to aliens as would the USA. Today, Europe is taking the lead in searching for life in our galaxy with 3 different satellites that will use different strategies for searching for life on the exoplanets that have been discovered. This interest in life is not limited to the US.
I doubt we could be so easily found even from within this one galaxy. And, there are an estimated 2 trillion galaxies. We're reasonably well advanced and we have a hard time even finding likely planets around "near" stars within our own galaxy - let alone determining whether there might be life there.
Agreed. And, I don't see any good reason for trying to make us easier to find. Besides, lightspeed isn't enough to allow communication even if we found friendlies. So, what's the upside?
We're not having too hard a time of it, and we have some next-gen telescopes coming online soon. For an alien race that's just ahead of us technologically by 100 years or so would already have identified every habitable planet within 100 LY and would have probes on the way to those systems. We'll be doing the exact same thing before too long.
The question is why has our govt dismissed this deal with craft that exist and defy what we know of physics? Blue Book and the Condon report were used to deny and ridicule the existence of non human technology . There is govt documentation that proves our govt and military know these craft exist and they are not the work of humans. But where are they from ? If the govt knows they aint saying . Of course there exists that old report tthat this knowledge would create social chaos. Make people question religion etc. And it is best we not know . The media has always treated these craft with ridicule and jokes. ..little green men! Have you not noticed how the media and govt has treated the existence of these craft? Even when there is evidence that these craft have shut down icbm sites and changed targeting ? Msm didnt cover it once the evidence appeared. Why? Given the importance! There is plenty of eevidence out there from legit sources that these craft exist and have interacted with our military with beyond our tech. They are untouchable even with our most advanced fighter jets . And yet most are acting like these craft from somewhere dont exist as they argue about other intelligent life existing outside of humans on earth. Lol If the creators of these craft exist and of course they must that should be evidence of other life in this universe and far ahead of us in science and tech. Yet this is ignored in your arguments for or against us being alone. Obviously we are not alone but given the nature of this advanced intelligence it doesnt want to interact with us face to face. These craft infiltrate our war games and have messed with our nnukes shutting them down at different locations while the media talks of little green men in laughter. And as our govt denies it for 70 years. And as those who argue if other life exists in our universe . The incoherence here is like the ludicrous side of poop hitting the fan. Of course the ufo community is filled with new age people and nuts which doesnt help in this most serious subject . Yet for the serious person the evidence is overwhelming and comes from released govt documents via foia.
There are UFOlogists all over the world, studying reports from the US and other countries. I just don't see any justification for giving this issue more focus than it has today and has had in the past. There really isn't justification for suggesting that a serious person must admit that the evidence of extraterrestrial visitors is overwhelming.
Anyone who would suggest that the odds of life on other planets is essentially 100% isn't very science minded. Sure, there are lots of galaxies with lots of stars with lots of planets, but the unknown factor is the development of life itself. Just how common is it that the chemistry on any given planet will develop life? That is absolutely unknown. It is possible that the environmental/chemical conditions required for life are so astronomically rare that earth is the only place where the conditions occurred. Of course, it is also possible that life exists throughout the universe. But again, the probability of life emerging on a given planet is absolutely unknown. The Drake Equation leads to an unknown because at least one of its factors is unknown. And therefore, the odds of life existing elsewhere is absolutely unknown. If a so-called "scientist" claims anything else, well, that "scientist" is not speaking from science.
I would add that when we humans wist other worlds we leave plenty of crap lying around to prove we were there e.g. Mars is littered with our cast offs. All I want is some physical proof Aliens have landed on Earth sometime/any time. I don't care what it is. The E.T. equivalent of a empty coke can or a cookie wrapper dug up during a an archeological dig somewhere would do. In other words I want something other than video footage of (something) or the first person accounts accounts of people who have met, had an affair with or been anally probed by an alien. If nothing else it would make a refreshing change.
How a serious person cannot look at the evidence and arrive at the conclusion is a serious problem. Of course where the intelligence hails from is what needs to be answered . What are the options ? The less reasonable option is this is human tech given the history of these craft go back 70 years. Back to when we were fighting with ICE and props. Have you ever looked in depth at the evidence just seen in govt documents? Not to mention military reports of interaction ? There is just too much to dismiss and more than enough to ignore when talking about life outside of our solar system.
So far, I think those such as Condon who have investigated these things have not said there are no interstellar visitors. I think they've just said that what they've looked at isn't evidence of that.
I personally believe that intelligent aliens exist elsewhere in the Universe but I don't believe they've ever come to visit Earth. I think that the Universe is just simply too big and even using the needle in the haystack analogy doesn't even come remotely close to demonstrating how hard and/or coincidence it would be for somebody to bump into us over here. I've been a huge Astronomy nerd ever since I was 5 years old and even to this day when I think about the sheer size of the Milky Way alone it makes me want to vomit. And to think that the Milk Way itself is tiny in comparison to even our Observable Universe it just never ceases to blow my mind. I know that we humans always like to see ourselves as something special. And we might very well be or we may not be. We could be the only intelligent space faring civilization in the Milk Way and our manifest destiny is to go out and colonize the galaxy. We could be one of hundreds of Star Trek type civilizations here who just haven't bumped into each other yet. We could be the "cavemen" of a Star Trek type galaxy to where our advanced counterparts and watching us through super Hubble type telescopes the size of planets and choosing to not bother us until we advance on our own. Or we could be those crazy 2 legged things who are nuts who built huge nuclear weapons to blow each other up with and the rest of the peaceful galaxy thinks we are radical psychopaths and refuse to talk to us. Or any number of things inbetween. From my own personal perspective it just makes no logical sense, whether we are talking pure nature or religion, for the Universe to be as vast as it is and we are the only living thing in it. If we're talking religion and God and whatnot then I ask the question of what in the actual hell is the Universe so big for if we are the only things in it that can even comprehend it's size? And if we are talking pure nature then it's 99.9% irrational that out of the entire Universe, of which human beings brains aren't even really physically equipped to comprehend it's size, life only spawned on this random little insignificant rock and NOWHERE ELSE. That just makes no logical sense to me.
` We have many aliens here in California and yes they know we are here. Most speak a Spanish language . ยด
Amen. I'd add that the universe is vast in terms of time, too. We could miss other civilizations by a few billion years, too. There are between 10 and 100 supernovas per DAY. Our own system is time limited due to our sun. If no alien finds us in that time period, it's reasonably likely that our existance will go undetected. And that could be happening to life in other places, too.
I find it hard to believe that with just how vast and expansive space really is, that there is not one other planet out there that has earth like qualities that could develop an atmosphere and sustain life. So I have to come down on the side that life is flourishing somewhere else. I have no idea how advanced that life would be or anything else about it. It's just too vast to think we are that unique. I don't think aliens have been here and I don't think aliens or other life forms know we are here. The United States Government and the military are not hiding alien bodies anywhere and they don't have a crashed spaceship or advanced technology given to us by a much more advanced alien race. I'd bet the farm on that. I have seen a lot of crazy, unexplainable things that could be listed as UFO's but none of them qualify as alien ships being chased through the night sky. Has anyone been out to Marfa, Texas? Off oh Highway 90 just a bit East of Marfa is a viewing center where you can go see a phenomenon called the "Marfa Lights". They are real and this is not made up. Nobody knows what they are and they have been filmed and documented for a long time. They were thought to be reflections of headlights except they have been seen since the 1850's, well before cars. I have seen them myself when I was out there. White spheres of light that seem to defy gravity and move erratically from time to time or get brighter and dimmer and then vanish only to reappear in other places. It's really crazy and for a long time people associated them aliens and alien craft. Nobody knows what they really are. Maybe reflections of other lights or heat off the desert or.... well, Here is a website about them: https://www.wideopencountry.com/really-deal-marfa-lights/ If you get a chance, go see them. The night sky is also brilliant on cloudless nights and it's worth it just to star gaze. Marfa is not the first time I have seen things like this, though. I think in time they can all be explained as we advance scientifically and discover what causes such things. Many times, they are just optical illusions. I was hoping sometime in my lifetime we would discover life on other planets but as I get older, I doubt that will happen. I think we have a long way to go and are just scratching the surface of what really lies outside of our fields of vision. Or maybe we are the first life forms and will set the standard for the rest of space. Who knows? Not me.
Based on my own beliefs and based on how vast space really is. The more we learn and discover, the more I think we really are alone, at least on our little corner. I have also logged quite a few hours in the air so that shapes my opinion as well. We literally have scientists and astronomers staring at the heavens 24/7/365 and if they spotted anything that looked like life or a spacecraft, they would be screaming it to the world because they would get unlimited funding and fame. Is life out there? Most likely, somewhere, just not near us. I hope I am wrong though because it would be monumental if we really did get a visitor or if we looked onto another planet and discovered any life or any type of civilization.
I've never understood why people just make wild-ass guesses and then make that guess a belief. But I guess that is what makes you a trumper.
The best I can do is to note existing studies. What I find is that so far nobody has found any lasting physical evidence and numerous of these events have been studied by scientists - all with negative or indeterminate conclusions. Very few on this board have the time, access and education to perform a better analysis. I know I don't.
I do, yes. Given the estimated number of planets in the Universe, it is a statistical certainty that there is intelligent life somewhere else, and If Spacefaring is possible then it is again a statistical certainty that other races have learned how and have come here. We have not been human for more than about a quarter million years or so and the Universe is at least 13 billion years old. Again, just the numbers say that any other races we find will be at least some millions of years beyond us. Look at how far we have come in just the 10 millennia we have been civilized and then think of beings who have been far beyond us several hundred if not thousands of times that total number. They would be able to live among us undetected with no difficulty and I believe they do since, for one reason or another, we are of far more use to them if we do not know of them than if we do.
How anyone can look at the tic tac and other craft with the same abilities and not conclude this intelligence is not human is the height of stupidity. As far as I know there has never been a serious and honest inquiry inti these craft and who has created them . What we have seen is guffaws and dismissal and talk of little green men. The question is why? Given the implications of these craft that defy what we know of physics . The attitude seems to be that these craft cannot exist so they dont exist ! Really scientific! Yet our military know they exist and have interacted with them and always get smoked by the technology. The incoherence involved here is unbelievable. Has fear trumped the curiosity inherit in men of science? The most plausible explanation is that our govt does not want to scare the **** out of us by telling us some one has tech we cannot make and can control the airspace of earth and destroy humanity if they want to. That this is not human tech and comes from somewhere else . That would explain blue book and the laughter over little green men. And how we can have 70 years of interactiob with these superior beings by all kinds of pilots with the threat of losing their right to fly if they talk about it. The amount of suppression is the smoke that implies a fire . Only recently with the nimitz encounter has the navy admitted the existence of these craft. But little follow-up . The whole damn thing is just weird . From the existence of these craft to the war against admittibg their existence
