I think Corbyn was an IRA supporter. Clear as day. But then so were Trump and Clinton. I would describe Mr Corbyn as a "fifth columnist". The enemy within. Those here whose natural sympathies are for our enemies. He wants to sell it as some smarmy smarter than you ****, but it isn't. It's a straight forward loyalty call and he showed it to mass murdering and mutilating ********s over his own people. Happy to go and honour their dead, not so happy to honour ours. I'm not up to speed with his position on Islamic terrorism. But frankly given his past, I'm not willing to listen to it. A fifth columnist says we should get rid of Trident? Good enough reason not to. Siding with the enemy is unforgivable. He's done. With that out in the open he can never rule here. We won't take him. Don't get me wrong, he was never going to become PM before this came out. But where before I felt sympathy for him. (underdog, good for his party, honest to his convictions, modest tone, immature but well meaning if you see what I mean). Now I feel only anger towards him. Scum. He took it all too far. All his anti-social, holier than thou bullshit, and he took it too far. Way too far. So far he can't come back.
Ulsterman, the enemy of my enemy is my friend. Ireland, don't care as long as they aren't trying to kill me. Fight amongst yourselves. I'm sick of us putting ourselves in the middle of it and getting shot at by both sides. No thanks in that one. On the other hand, friends are hard to come by and any who actually wants so hard to fly my flag, I'm going to support. I'm flattered by it to be quite honest. Honoured. If you kill them, I should be trying to kill you. I have their loyalty. It is beholden on me to reciprocate it if I can. Ireland has been split as neatly as it can be. Republicans have their country, Unionists theirs. I'm part of the union. Happy and proud to be so. I seek for everyone who also wants to be, to be in it with me. If I think you are trying to oppress them, to rule over them, happy to see you bombed. Great. Die mofo. You messed with the wrong people. And that goes equally for Scotland. Separate off as neatly as you can please. Avoid bloodshed at all costs. Don't try and take unionists with you. Split the country and each have your own Scotland. I seek really to avoid, upsetting the families of the dead. I don't think any of them post here. I'm not saying this live on national TV after a terror bombing, and I gain absolutely nothing from doing so and am in no way attempting to personally profit or advantage myself from anyone's tragedy. Just jawing with you. I have however been consciously avoiding discussing Manchester for these reasons. In the end the family will be reading things in the press and on the media and my poisonous little thoughts may be hurtful or unwelcome at this time.
Jeremy Corbyn sounds like he's all for socialism. Don't be afraid of capitalism and remember what Tony Blair did to the NHS.
May trying to exploit the Manchester terror attack to change her falling position on the polls. https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ng-at-heart-of-election-with-attack-on-corbyn She must be hoping the British public are extremely ignorant and gullible.
I thought the Manchester bombing would cause an increase in votes for her- trust in conservative goats in times of trouble.
She called this election largely because she had an unprecedented lead in the Polls. It was to be a walk over. The Labour Party had worked on destroying itself after Brexit - at that time it was just a few points behind but the Right of the Labour Party cannot bare to have a Left leader so have been working since then, first to get rid of him and when that did not work to destroy the Party. They are still telling people not to vote for the Labour Party. In such a situation how there ever could be any chance of the Tories not winning the election was difficult for anyone to see. It was imagined she would have a majority of over 100....but despite all the odds her lead started to fall substantially in the polls as I reported in another thread. May had decided to run the election as a popularity contest between the two leaders, her and Corbyn - as he was massively unpopular in the polls. Her intent was to get into as little debate as possible (refused tv debates) and to simply repeat that a government of hers would be 'strong and stable' while a vote for Corbyn would result in a 'coalition of chaos' and she repeated this ad nauseous till all the papers were making fun of her. May had been advised that the electorate just responds to emotion and slogans and that is how she intended on doing the election with it being simply a battle between her, rather than the Tories, against Corbyn. Then Corbyn brought out the Labour Manifesto which was well received and May brought out hers which was not so well received. In particular she had decided that the way to deal with the cost of social care for the elderly was to make them pay retrospectively for it from the sale of their house after they had died. That is everyone could keep the first £100,000 to give as an inheritance but after that they would need to pay after they had died. This went down like a lead balloon and was called the 'Dementia Tax'. On the doorstep the old, their best voters, said they did not like it at all. Within 4 days May had back stepped on this and said there would be a cap on how much people had to pay. This was presented in the media as illustrating that she was anything but 'strong and stable' and god knows how she would manage in Brexit negotiations. To this she simply denied that there had been any change in substance (there had been) and blamed it all on Corbyn which every one knew not to be true. Then there was the terror attack. She shut down politics for two days saving herself from this position which she was rapidly deteriorating in and was able to present her self as the capable leader in charge. She might well have halted electioneering for longer but UKIP decided enough was enough and the other parties followed them. People believe that she should be the one to benefit from the attack and that having soldiers on the street ought to help her as well .....but in this poll done after the terror attack Labour have narrowed her lead to 5% - something which does not write out a Labour win and if she did not improve her lead she may win the most seats but the result would not allow her to have an overall majority. Of course she is now going to try and use the terror attack in Manchester to regain her position. It remains to be seen whether she will succeed. The only strategy she has used in this election is to diss Corbyn and blame him for everything. This she continues to do exploiting the terror attack to that end. The terror attack may indeed save her. That is clearly what she is relying on.
That's interesting. I'd missed that she'd dropped in popularity and thought that that the election would be a foregone conclusion.
There seems to be some polling to suggest a Labour surge. I'd trust your gut if I were you. Pollsters expect Labour to lose about 15% of it's seats. https://www.theguardian.com/science...right-about-labours-gains-but-also-misleading Bookies give 7:1 odds against My Corbyn. Down from 9:1. With regards to Mrs Mays unpopular manifesto, she is playing for the middle ground. To grab the left. If you cut an oldies pension, will they vote Labour? No. They know Labour will cut it more. They don't have anywhere else to go politically. But if you cut pensions for wealthier pensioners, you might attract centre lefties, who currently seek somewhere else to go. On another forum I did one of those... Who shall I vote for? quizzes. We all came out Tory. None of us vote Tory, but the policies they promote are broad church policies. They hold the centre ground.
OK lets look at this. Corbyn has said repeatedly that he did see IRA and Sinn Fein people in connection with the Peace Process. As it happens this is true. Someone has taken the time to get the information together. He met with both Republicans and Loyalists working on the peace process. https://skwawkbox.org/2017/05/25/world-exclusive-corbyn-mowlams-envoy-to-ira-and-loyalists/
In June, this man woke me up to vote... For the referendum. Some guy with a list going door to door saying 'Don't forget to vote'.. I was polite/thanked him, but I didn't appreciate being woken up about it.
Another attempt by the Tories to exploit the terrorist attack in Manchester for Political Gain - something which according to Craig Murray is not managing to impress the readers of the Daily Mail Tories Losing Daily Mail Readers and in Disarray
Corbyn, Shadow Leader, a Trot who is surrounded by Militant McDonell, Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer, a Marxist Leninist Abbot, Shadow Home Sec, hates the English and said Mao did more good than bad - The two main questions in this election were over how we left the EU and over immigration and especially the very big problems which are coming from within the very very large and non-integrated Muslim community - the choices? Hard NWO =Tory or soft NWO = Labour. They will take us to the same end --- if allowed! The societal problems caused by mass immigration of Muslims ( particularly Pakistanis) affect the old working class which was the Labour stronghold, problems being rape gangs, they own the streets and the prisons which are now radical Islamic training grounds - I know the young Jeremy Corbyn cult see him as the second coming but old Labour are torn - they do not know who to vote for.
Oh blimey you are back! Hello again. Still in contact with Jack? Dianne Abbot hates the English does she? Hmm. Well I know she is tolerant towards Scottish Independence but I very much doubt she hates the English given that I have never ever seen one thing to make me think so. Do you think your belief may have something to do with her being black. Your accusation of her being a racist suggests you may be projecting your own view onto her. What on earth is NWO. I did a search and all I got was New World Order. The change in voting patterns of wc which you are correct about does not come from your prejudice but from Blair giving up Labour values and making Labour favour neo liberalism and corporate power while selling our democracy down the drain to Plutocracy. So lets go to some legit source rather than your imagination believing everyone thinks the same as you. This is from a recent poll. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/0/who-will-win-general-election-2017-latest-polls-odds-tracker/ Basically in Brexit, Scottish Independence and now current polls the people on the hard right whether that is pro Brexit, Unionism or the Tories tend to be the old. The older people get the more to the right the majority go. Older people being the more likely to vote obviously helps the right. Obviously not everyone who has voted in these ways is bigoted or even to the right. Most people vote simply on what they believe will be the best for them and in this Corbyn and May's perception from the public has been important and this has changed massively during this election. May's popularity has spiralled downward and Corbyn has become much more popular. In addition the Labour Manifesto was well received and as I said earlier not only was the Tories not so well received, May's Uturn has not impressed. That is what most people are voting on. What is best for them, not racism. Of course as I have said more than once the Tories are going to try and use the Manchester Attack to get votes back.
alexa, post: 1067535374 Just passing through, no we never had contact outside here --- has he gone? I gave up forum cafe society and decided to do some studying and have taken to Law of all things xxx Darling I don't come here to voice what most people or this or that percentage of people think ------ I come to say what I think. And I said it ---
Yes he has gone. Marlow as well. Good luck with the degree if that is what you are doing. Well possibly it would help if you said that was just your point of view because the way you put it suggests you believe that what you are saying is a fact. I have read your post again and you definitely seem to be claiming to know what the most important issues are for other people in your paragraphs beginning 'the two main questions' and 'the societal problems' That being said, what you believe does not stand up to scrutiny. something which I must say has delighted me. Maybe England is getting a bit tired of the move to the far right.
The main question for the Tory p[arty at this election should simply be? Does the government operate a deficit? If the answer is yes, don't vote Tory.
Both of them - ahh but one can't keep the same battle going on forever eh? Thank you , yes in second year coming up to exams - It is just the way I post ---------- my voice is actually quite soft but yes I suppose that is what I make of the facts --- as I know them What ever reason she said she called the election for, part of it was so that she could see the end of Article 50 out. It would have coincided with the next election and also because she was unelected she was vulnerable, she expected a majority Gov giving anything she intended to do validation, as this Gov never had because they won by default --------- I agree, the arrogance of her, that she thought her lead would stand if she hit at the heart of her electorate - madness. But where do the voters which bring in a large majority come from? One side must sway to the other - those who voted for Leave were with her, some with very heavy hearts, because they did/do? believe that she will bring about a 'hard Brexit' and with control of our borders --------- as far as Islam is concerned after 'Three Girls' and other such cases more and more of the worrying factors of multiculturalism, which have been covered up, have been coming out into the open - many northern and midland communities have known and lived with the effects for at least 3 decades, but left to cope alone and with no voice. Also at the same time as hitting her heart lands she has touched those who might have swayed to the Right ------- she has hit every vulnerable group, from children to the old -- so crazy one could even imagine she doesn't want to win. The kids? They are so uneducated now, we have also had no real politics in the EU years, I get that Corbyn seems like Jesus, I get it ----------- especially since the last time we saw such words coming from one of our politicians was probably from dear old Micheal Foot. But ..................... everything comes at a price, they must find out for them selves - I give neither my consent to rule and shall spoil my ballot Interesting one though ------------- we shall see ps I have never voted Tory in my life ---------- just incase you thought I was excusing MI5 May and her hubby who btw has interests in the company which is handing out all of the equity release, life time mortgages and ect ---- a subsidiary of Legal and General. ****! It is raining and I didn't get the washing ( which has been out all week) in! Ah well second rinse.
All political parties in Westminster lack leadership, all of them, even the ruling Conservative party. There are no Obamas, no Churchills, nobody from any political party to inspire the people to rally around, not since Tony Blair.
WOW! Well done. Good luck with the exams. and it is a debating forum so people will disagree. I'd say she went primarily for those reasons and because she was so high on the polls and so were the Tories. 21% above Labour. Now it is down to in one poll 5% She had said multiple times that she was not going to do a snap election and I think the polls as well as the reality that it is beginning to hit financially and most people seem to be suggesting will have hit a great deal more before we have even left - she could not resist going now. It looked like a dead cert. I do not think anyone disagreed with that. One of the things she did not take into account when she decided to make it a popularity contest between her and Corbyn was that actually seeing her in action turned people against her where as they grew more to like Corbyn. As far as the arrogance in believing she could keep her followers with her social care policy. Well they were already down by a considerable amount by then. She was already losing on the polls. People seem to think that she thought this would have appealed to the 'working man' who she is supposed to be helping or maybe that is the jams. Only £100,000 value of house is a very low amount nowadays - so she likely would only have picked up on the poorest who are unlikely to vote for her or anyone else anyway. In reality I thought it might be good. We could get house prices down but then of course everyone would need to get Dementia - which I think was why people went against it. Dementia tax did not go down well....but I think what made that worse was that she went and did a uturn on it and did not even have the ability to admit that was what she was doing. That has caused a lot of people not to trust her. It does not seem to have solved the problem she created...and they did not stop there, they then started going on about the number of times she had said there would be no snap election. This got people really going on about her 'strong and stable' slogan and saying she would buckle at the first problem over Brexit negotiations. The old of course. The very people she could rely on were the ones she was upsetting and that does appear to have been arrogance - they won't try that again!! However it also was trying to make another move away from collective help - trying to change ideology a bit more. She says she voted remain! I do not know how many Brexiteers believed it was going to be a hard Brexit. I think the Tory Leaders were just playing a game not expecting it to happen. They did not even cost anything. Quite out of order. I think May's insistence on going for a hard Brexit and being cantankerous towards the EU will backfire. I am way not sure that half the country wants a hard Brexit. I know people who say they were not quite sure what it meant but thought maybe a change would be good. Without the old there would not have been a Brexit which is way out of order as it is the young they are inflicting it on in their retirement and after their death. (by the way I myself am old, just not one who votes that way! _) It may be that in the end this election will result in some degree of change from the hard Brexit + she wants to do it in a dictatorial way and I do not think that is good for anyone. I didn't see the three girls. The reason this went on for so long was because the police and social workers and so on decided it was a 'life choice' of the girls and different perceptions on what rape was - things which really seem to have been brought out with the Saville case. Yes it needs to be stopped but that is for the police to do and it most certainly was not all Muslims. I seem to remember they came overwhelmingly from a particular area of Pakistan - where that was the sort of way they acted but even Pakistanis hate them!!!!! So an issue like rape in general that has been allowed to happen in this country. I think we have something like 80,000 rapes a year so a very small part of that despite it being the part which has been receiving the most publicity. I know at the beginning of the VIP investigation (which I think still has come to nothing) Theresa May said we had better be prepared because rape was endemic in British society. Also I have a memory that it was actually a Muslim lawyer/judge or someone who eventually got those cases started. I live in Scotland and we do not encourage hatred of ethnic minorities here so it is different from areas in England that you are talking about. We have been in a recession since 2008. People need someone to blame. The other is usually that person. In addition from everything I read if we try to have the levels of immigration May is now saying she intends, we will be economically bankrupt, likely with no NHS and unable to bring food in from the fields. This seems to be an accepted 'fact'. As you will know May did not manage to make much change when she was Home Secretary. I was listening to people talk about the fact she is claiming she is going to now and they were saying, 'well, not really, if you look into it there is.. this.. and that. Obviously some issues like regulations on pay, school places and drs are definite needs which the government had and has a responsibility to take care of. However if we are still going to need immigrants roughly as now then imo it is crazy to deprive ourselves of the free market. One person on here was suggesting we got third world ex commonwealth people in, paid them much less and sent them back home when they became sick! Sounds to me like reinvented slavery. Good point. She wants to win and she probably still will. It does appear she was somewhat over confident in herself and over confident that people would not like Corbyn. You will know when things have moved too far one way they tend to slip back the other and Corbyn unlike the Labour Right is actually offering something different. It also appears people are warming to him and seeing through her. You think so? I hear it is the same in Scotland. However I have three grandchildren who go to the local school and learn magically and seem to be doing really well. I am well pleased with the education they are getting!!! (youngest just starts in August!) It wasn't the EU which stopped politics. It was Thatcher followed by Blair going for neo liberalism and corporate power in preference to Democracy. Neo cons do not like democracy. So now we have basically moved to become a plutocracy - ruled by the most wealthy - and Brexit is not going to change that - indeed it may make it worse. I was fine with hanging out with the people who were interested in changing the EU from within. At the current moment I believe the UK is heading towards completely splitting up with England almost certainly heading towards an authoritarian future. This is because we are now a Plutocracy created by neo liberalism and Corporate Power - who the government answers to. Corbyn is not a Neo Liberal. He does not believe in Corporate Power. In that he offers hope but the real place where we need change is in our economic system. The only real thing which I have seen suggested so far being that the Labour Party intends on when a factory is going up for sale - giving first choice to buy to the workers - on a government loan. This would keep the money in the country, would allow them to work a bit less when automation comes in, instead of losing their job and all the loot going to the monopoly who owns it and also would have the added advantage that as they would live in the areas where the factory was they obviously would not want to contaminate the area - something which is happening all the time now -certainly in the US so I imagine here now. We really need fundamental changes if we do not want to end up in authoritarian societies. I think it would be best if Labour do not get in right now. Let May in on a tiny majority and then when the **** hits the fan and we discover the dreadful financial mess in a couple of years she can be got rid of and Labour can come in. If they get in now it is very likely they would get blamed for the economic downturn which seems inevitable...but what is needed is a new economic model and work to get us out of this plutocracy and back into democracy whether that is in the EU or out. If Scotland goes for Independence I will be working for that there. Fine make sure you spoil it then. I do take that as a vote! - a wee vote for the Greens perhaps? I never have either. Hope that is all sorted now.
Thank you for you lovely long reply ------------ I'll have to take a rain check literal as well as mmmm revision! ( no didn't get the washing in, suddenly the skies opened and it poured down) I'm not very good at getting down to it ( never gets easier) -------- but as soon as exams are done I'll get back -------- I agree the best thing now would be a Tory Gov with not too huge a majority - never thought I would ever hear myself wish for a Tory Gov - and no I am no fan of the Greens either - none of them would get my consent - The real issues are barely mentioned, they treat us as fools - the economy is tied up with the rest of the World's and it stinks - as we are owned by Saudi, the EU and Israel - well and Canada owns our water doesn't it? It is to them and Corporate that our wealth goes, for some reason we were always a wealthy Island, always in demand ------------ but now we are just being impoverished and plundered - Must go and ps Islam is not a race or ethnicity, in the past it nestled under our respective state Christian religions but now it is run from Saudi, who also own a great chunk of us -------- there is a problem, a dangerous clash of cultures, which will spill on to the streets within the next few years - but -------------- for another day After the election --------- xxx
I think I was 6 the first time I got racially abused in Scotland. Just saying. Some drunk old Rab C Nesbitt type caught my English accent in the street and that set him off. Cetlic vs Rangers. Savages!
An adult attacked you as a child in Scotland because you were English. I assume your parents told the police.
