Dossier debunked

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by RodB, Mar 16, 2018.

  1. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    Verified: Former Trump campaign adviser Carter Page met with representatives of Russian state-owned oil giant Rosneft.

    The dossier claimed Page held secret meetings in Moscow with Igor Sechin, a Putin ally who is the head of Rosneft.

    Page vehemently denied that he met with Sechin. But in November, the House Intelligence Committee released a transcript of Page’s congressional testimony revealing he had in fact met with other Rosneft officials, including Sechin's subordinate Andrey Baranov, during a trip to Moscow in 2016.

    According to the dossier, Rosneft officials used their meeting with Page to push for the U.S. to lift sanctions on Russia for its support of armed separatist groups in eastern Ukraine. It is now known that the Trump administration sought to water down a proposed Republican Party commitment to send “lethal weapons” to Ukraine’s army to fight off the Russian-backed separatists.

    The Trump administration later showed little enthusiasm for implementing or renewing sanctions against Russia. In response, Congress eventually passed a law limiting Trump's ability to lift sanctions, which the president reluctantly signed after issuing a statement condemning it.

    Verified: The Kremlin targeted educated youth and swing state voters during its cyber attacks in the 2016 campaign.

    The dossier said educated youth and swing voters were a central target in the Kremlin's campaign of fake news and social media chaos, with the hope of cultivating their anti-establishment anger against Democratic candidate Hillary Clinton. This has been proven by congressional investigations into Russia’s misinformation campaigns during the election, which also showed the cyber attacks were broadly aimed at a variety of voters, with the intent to sow divisions on heated political topics.

    The Kremlin also successfully tricked American activists on the far-right and left into attending protests and signing up for self-defense classes in an effort to accentuate social discord, according to numerous media reports and analysis of Russian social media posts.


    Verified: Trump maintains ties to rich businessmen from Azerbaijan.
    The dossier said Azeri businessman Araz Agalarov knew the details about business bribes Trump had allegedly paid in Russia, as well as Trump's alleged sexual exploits there. Evidence of the bribes and sexual activities has never surfaced, but the connections between Trump and fellow billionaire are now well-established. Agalarov and his pop singer son Emin have known Trump for years, and both men worked with Trump on the Miss Universe Pageant in Moscow in 2013.

    Emails released in July revealed that Agalarov’s publicist Rob Goldstone had written to Trump’s son, Donald Trump Jr., to set up a meeting with a Russian lawyer who supposedly had dirt on Hillary Clinton, as part of what Goldstone called "Russia and its government’s support for Mr Trump." Trump Jr. attended a Trump Tower meeting with the lawyer in June 2016 along with Trump campaign manager Paul Manafort and Trump's son-in-law Jared Kushner. That meeting has become a major focus of the investigations into the Trump campaign. Goldstone allegedly organized the meeting at Emin Agalarov's behest.
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2018
  2. RodB

    RodB Well-Known Member Donor

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    The attention it got within the administration.
     
  3. RodB

    RodB Well-Known Member Donor

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    Pretty much what I said. Though when the author of the dossier casts aspersions and doubts, it gets pretty close to being suspect.
     
  4. Jonsa

    Jonsa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I guess the notion of implication and inference are two alien concepts to some people even while they indulge in "wide open objective analysis".

    I wonder if there is any research that has determined at what level mental gymnastics become mental contortions?
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2018
  5. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    Well... maybe we should refresh your memory

     
  6. tomander7020

    tomander7020 Well-Known Member

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    It doesn't. The belief is that Putin is using the video recording of Trump with two prostitutes to blackmail Trump and influence his decisions. Trump is very obsequious where Putin is concerned. I'm not saying the prostitute story is true, but Putin certainly seems to have some sort of hold over Trump. As to a FISA warrant, your post is the first I've heard or read of it.
     
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  7. RodB

    RodB Well-Known Member Donor

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    If you want to refresh my memory by quoting me saying the golden showers episode was key to the FISA warrant I suggest you provide a quote where I actually said that, not just any old different quote your bumbling eyes stumble across.
    You quoted me as saying, "So the dossier that got the FISA warrant to allow the Obama administration to spy and eavesdrop on Trump and his campaign is (only???) now getting debunked at its core." Give it your best shot and explain your accusation. Or if you ask I may review it 1, 2, 3 to help.
     
  8. TomFitz

    TomFitz Well-Known Member

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    Yes, but that link does not exhonorate anyone. They just simply decided not to press charges.

    He's under investigatation now for his more recent activities, now, for which there has been no exhonoration,
     
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  9. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    And what are you talking about?
     
  10. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    More about Page

    Carter Page, the Russia-linked former Trump campaign adviser at the center of a controversial memo which was declassified on Friday, apparently bragged in a 2013 letter that he was “an informal advisor” to the Kremlin, according to Time. The letter was sent to an academic press amid a dispute over a manuscript the former energy-industry executive had submitted for publication, per the report.

    “Over the past half year, I have had the privilege to serve as an informal advisor to the staff of the Kremlin
     
  11. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    Not sure what you want me to explain. I can't find much that needs further explanation. You say the dossier that got the FISA warrant was debunked, but the only thing supposedly debunked is the golden showers episode. What else do you want me to explain? You explained yourself ;pretty clearly.

    Now, of course, any moderately informed individual knows that attributing the FISA warrant to the mere mention, of a dossier in which the golden showers were one of the minor Trump-related reports, in the FISA request to the cou, is like attributing Trump winning the electorate college to having won... Alaska. But that's your ridiculous statement. Not mine.
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2018
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  12. TomFitz

    TomFitz Well-Known Member

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    The "golden showers" part of teh "dossier" is the only part that most Trumspter actually know anything about, and most of them get that wrong.

    It's the lowbrow tabloid worshiping mind set. They glaze over when you get to the important stuff. But the tabloid stuff; they hang on to every word of that.

    Which is why Trump spent that payoff money to the porn stars, and is now struggling to keep them quiet.
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2018
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  13. RodB

    RodB Well-Known Member Donor

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    HELLO! EARTH to MARS! The difference between not pressing charges and exoneration is......, well, nothing.
    His current investigation is mostly a camouflage to credibly use his ongoing contacts with Russians to get a FISA surveilling warrant against someone tied with the Trump campaign. There have been no charges or hint of charges against Page of his activities in 2015 and 2016 or as the result of their surveillance.
     
  14. RodB

    RodB Well-Known Member Donor

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    You seem to be losing it.
     
  15. Jimbo11

    Jimbo11 Well-Known Member

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    Yup...Steele said he doubted that was true....but if 70% of the rest of it is....Putin picked YOUR president.
     
  16. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    That's complete bullshit. Don't tell me that you're actually stupid enough to believe what you wrote. Please tell me you were just spinning.
     
  17. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    And author Steele puts the odds of it actually happening at 50/50


    Ok and?

    All that says is that Steele was trying to be accurate. He had reports that he couldn't verify and said so in his dossier.
     
  18. RodB

    RodB Well-Known Member Donor

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    WOW! All of a sudden you are mostly accurate. That is almost exactly what I said, which was the dossier [in its entirety] was used to obtain the FISA warrant, and the debunking of the of the golden showers episode taints (getting debunked) the dossier. In court protocols false testimony by a witness taints the witness' entire testimony, and often throws the entire testimony out.
    We do not know how much the dossier played in the warrant or how much the showers part was used. But the warrant application is even more tainted.
     
  19. RodB

    RodB Well-Known Member Donor

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    Here are the six major points claimed in the Steele dossier:
    1. Trump had cooperated with Russian authorities for years.
    2. Trump is vulnerable to Russian blackmail on sexual matters.
    3. a Trump-Russia “conspiracy,” managed by Paul Manafort, with Carter Page serving as intermediary
    4. Trump’s team knew and approved of Russian plans to deliver emails to WikiLeaks,
    5. according to an “ethnic Russian associate” of Trump’s, Carter Page had “conceived and promoted” the idea that the DNC emails to WikiLeaks should be leaked during the Democratic convention,
    6. Michael Cohen played a key role in the conspiracy.
    In terms of an election collusion or conspiracy, none have come close to being verified. The FBI didn't even try.
     
  20. RodB

    RodB Well-Known Member Donor

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    OK smart guy, you tell me the difference between not pressing charges and exoneration.
     
  21. One Mind

    One Mind Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    And if a frog had wings, he would not bump his froggy arse.

    To even think that putin is that powerful is one helluva joke. An absurdity. Nonsense.

    But the truth is that powerful, as long as you don't expect hillary democrats to be enlightened by it. They prefer the darkness of ignorance, IMO. And to say putin picked our president originates from such an ignorance.

    Putin got a big head, from just listening to hillary dems. That you guys actually believe it, made him feel good, even if it involves a lie. As it would any other leader accused of such.

    Hell, I am not a leader, and it will gratify this old ego when the conclusion is that there was never any hard evidence putin picked the president, or that the trump campaign was involved in a conspiracy with putin or the russian state. I would be shocked to find out differently. But not as shocked as the hillary boys are when they are never given any evidence to back up their own beliefs. Of course, given the nature of this crowd, they will never believe it, and will invent another tin foil hat story to justify their disbelief. Very predictive once you get to know these people by their posts on political forums.
     
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  22. For Topical Use Only

    For Topical Use Only Well-Known Member

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    It's the notion that anyone would ever need to invent something terrible to say about Trump which is the funniest part.
     
  23. Jimbo11

    Jimbo11 Well-Known Member

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    How do you know what Mueller has verified? I think there is a connection between these players

    trump
    Russia
    Cambridge Analytics
    NRA

    There IS complicated web here. It involves money laundering and extortion. If given the time....Mueller will find the truth.
     
  24. Jimbo11

    Jimbo11 Well-Known Member

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    Putin is having people killed all over the world and you doubt his power? Then...as beyond belief....trump calls him and congratulates him on six more years as a Dictator. This was done after his his national security people warned him not to congratulate him.

    Face it....trump OWES Putin....
     
  25. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    To think that Putin is some cuddly little Teddy Bear is profoundly naive.

    He is the former head of the Russian State Intelligence Agency (the FSB) and a lifelong KGB agent

    He has murdered opponents and journalists and he has looted the nation.

    He is the dictatorial head of a nuclear armed country that has turned from a nascent democracy into the world's biggest organized crime center. And he wants to reconstitute the Russian Empire with him as the head.And he has invaded numerous neighbors and destabilized countries around the world.

    Yea...nothing to worry about there
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2018

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