Dual loyalty? No. Single loyaltly.

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by Jack Napier, Jun 17, 2013.

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  1. Shiva_TD

    Shiva_TD Progressive Libertarian Past Donor

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    This is completely unsupported by any known facts. While it is true that Pollard passed classified information for money to Israel there is no evidence whatsoever that it resulted in the death of Americans ("Assets" is a rather silly way to refer to Americans). We don't even know exactly what classified materials were passed by Pollard to the Israelis because they were classified.

    People really shouldn't be making things up. Yes, Pollard was a spy, but we have no idea of what specifically he revealed and if any Americans died it would have been because of their covert activities and not the revelation of their activities. The belief that our "spies" have sacrosanct status is rather hypocritical IMO. When a person engages in covert activities then they can be risking their lives and if they die it was because of them being involved in covert activities. Spies are spies regardless of nationality, period.
     
  2. Marlowe

    Marlowe New Member

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    Shiva , I know absolutely nothing about DNA - but I do know a little about my fellow beings, - their trickery.

    I've got some doubts abt any so-called scientific studies /reports funded + carried out by a specific group (Ill not name) with motives /intentions to support their political aims .i.e . to claim land ownership + justify the displacement /dispossession of another ethnic group.

    Mixing political agendas with science sounds tricky to me.

    ......
     
  3. Karma Mechanic

    Karma Mechanic Well-Known Member

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    again go be a bigot somewhere else unless you have similar outrage when Republicans speak at Bob Jones, the CPAC conference (where this year someone said slavery was good for black people), work with the Family Research Council a known hate group...etc. etc.

    Ovaida is a political figure....he is denounced by most Jews. Photos mean nothing. There are photos of George Bush kissing leaders of the Taliban and President Obama with all manner of horrible people. No one is saying the Rabbi isn't a bigot, difference is when I do I do it in a forum that matters and I don't give others a pass. You do.
     
  4. Karma Mechanic

    Karma Mechanic Well-Known Member

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    Prime example of what I have pointed out before. What you are saying is "Jews are tricky so anything they say is a lie so there is no evidence of the Holocaust, their linage, their history". Do you believe all the archeological evidence going about almost 3 millennia is all planted?
     
  5. Art_Allm

    Art_Allm Banned at Members Request Past Donor

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    I have quoted a recent study that deals with all previous studies, and a paper that mentions the results of all known studies.

    No, Jews do not have a common maternal lineage, not even the Ashkenazim from different countries stem from the same founding mothers.


    The Old Testament is nothing else but a book of fairy tales, and the claims of Zionists are just idiotic bigotry.

    The "Jewish heredity" is just symbolic.

    Like Karma Mechanic said, after the conversion a person becomes a descendant of Abraham, and his conversion is never mentioned.
    That sound schizophrenic, but this is the truth.

    Before WWII the representatives of Jews in the USA protested when Jews were called a people, a race or an ethnicity.
    They insisted that Jews are just religious group, like Christians.

    The Zionists got their way only after WWII.
    Before WWII only Zionists and non-Jewish racists called Jews a race, a people or an ethnicity.

    Well, if all Jews really had the same paternal lineage, then they would all have the same Y-DNA-haplogroup. But this is not the case.

    It is no rocket science, the genetic studies are easy to understand.

    The first genetic studies (Hammer etc) just look for the direct paternal lineage of Jews (Y-DNA, passed fro father to his sons), but it turned out that Jews do not stem from the same male that lived 3000-5000 years ago. Not even the Levites and the Kohanim stem from the same male.

    Then they looked for the direct female lineage, speak for the mitochondrial DNA, passed from the mother to all her children. And it turned out that most European Jews stem from European women who never lived in the Middle East.

    Recently the Jewish scientist Eran Elhaik did a complex research of ALL Jewish DNA, not only the direct lineage.

    The direct lineage is only a tiny fraction of the genome.

    To find out where the majority of ancestors lived, you have to look for the Autosomal DNA, and that is precisely what Elhaik did in his research.

    The result of his research:

    The Ashkenazi Jews are more closely related to the population of the former Khazaria, than to the population of the former Canaan.

    Why should a healthy person care about the religious or racial prejudices of his ancestors?
    Every human being has 2 parents, 4 grandparents, 8 grand-grandparents and so on.

    If we go 2000 years back then we will discover thousands of different ancestors, and the probability that there was one female ancestor that happened to be member of a Jewish group is very high.

    There are hundreds of millions of people around the world who may have had a female ancestor that was member o a Jewish group 1000 years ago, and according to this idiotic logic there are hundreds of millions "Jews" around the world.

    All Palestinians may have had female ancestors that were members of Jewish religious communities 2000 years ago.

    The probability, that a Palestinian stems from Hebrews is much higher than the probability, that an Ashkenazi stems from Hebrews.
     
  6. Shiva_TD

    Shiva_TD Progressive Libertarian Past Donor

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    The archeological evidence actually establishes that the Jewish People were not the first inhabitants in the "Land of Canaan" (i.e. Palestine) and their dominance over that territory was very short-lived and that subsequently others, predominately Muslim Arabs made the land their homeland and that lasted up until the mid-20th Century.

    We can also note the "Zionism" was predominately supported by non-Jewish Europeans based upon anti-Semitism as a means to rid Europe of the Jews by convincing them to move and providing a means for them to Palestine. The "Jewish Zionists" didn't have the political power to accomplish the goals of taking over Palestine from the Arabs and relied on those in Europe that wanted to rid Europe of the Jews as allies. What couldn't be accomplished by the Spanish Inquisition and the Holocaust was accomplished by the anti-Semites in Europe that supported Jewish Zionism as a means of ridding Europe of the Jews that they hated.

    It made strange bedfellows because the Zionist Jews were tired of the tyranny against them by anti-Semites in Europe so they worked together with the anti-Semites to provide a means to immigrate to Palestine and get the hell out of Europe. In all of this the fact that Palestine was already predominately an Arab homeland seemed to be ignored. Basically the Zionist Jews and Anti-Semite European Zionist supporters mutually said "To hell with the Arabs."
     
  7. Knuckleballer

    Knuckleballer New Member

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    But no doubts when the conclusion supports your bigoted hateful agenda.

    Remember Dr. Lindsey and his "expert testimony" that gas chambers didn't exist at Auschwitz? I think his studies were funded and carried out for a specific group, The Institute for Historical Review with the motive of not paying a promised $50,000 reward to anyone who could prove that Jews were gassed at Auschwitz funded Lindsey's research to support their revisionist, Anti Semitic claims.

    Seems a bit hypocritical on your part.... but you seem quite confident of your ability to deal with the tricky mixing of political agendas with science.... sadly the confidence seems misplaced.

    I know a bit about DNA because I paid attention in school and I know a bunch about people and their deception, lies and trickery.

    SHALOM sweety....
     
  8. Ivan88

    Ivan88 Well-Known Member

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    Dual Loyalty explains all the lies the US officials tell to justify so much slaughter.
    Colin Powell, both Bushes and many other regime leaders lie because they have dual loyalty.
    They say they are serving the American People, when in fact they are serving the war crazy manipulators and profiteers.
    [video=youtube;3ohm3XOBzY4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ohm3XOBzY4[/video]

    Whistle blowers are not traitors. They are serving the American People and the rest of humanity that doesn't want to be ripped off.

    Whistle Blowers are serving Truth.

    But when you are serving lies, Truth is your enemy.
     
  9. Shiva_TD

    Shiva_TD Progressive Libertarian Past Donor

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    Once again I'm merely relating what the Hebrew religious teachings are and not what is common belief or understanding might be. Much or what I've learned is because of my wife of 30 years that is a hereditary Jew and knows the Torah and it's teachings although she's not a practicing Jew. She will point out something about Judaism and I'll look it up for confirmation and she's been 100% correct so far but I always double check any source.

    Of course the Jewish people were much more exclusive going back thousands of years. There is no evidence that they accepted "conversion" to Judaism going back to Biblical times and marriage was very strict where a Jew could only marry a Jew and these were arranged marriages. Marriage for "love" is a relatively new invention of society only a few centuries old as I'm sure most are aware. A dowry, for example, was the fundamentally the "purchase of a husband" by the parents of a "daughter" because "men" were superior and women were typically little more than property under Judeo-Christian religious beliefs.

    Nonetheless the "Zionist Jews" claim heritage to "Palestine" which can only be based upon actual heritage established through Hebrew teachings of matriarchal lineage for those that actually lived in Palestine over 2000 years ago. I dispute that claim but that is the claim made by the Zionists. Such a claim could never be made by a "conversion" to Judaism of someone with no historical linage to Palestine.
     
  10. Karma Mechanic

    Karma Mechanic Well-Known Member

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    Again your lack of facts is stunning. There was never a Palestine as a country. It was conquered but the archaeological evidence clearly shows Jewish settlement in the land for 2000 years. Even when under occupation by Greek and Roman cultures. Arabs didn't make it their homeland, that is silly. it was part of empires, but not all arab and not all Muslim.

    While this is an interesting take, it suffers from being not true.


    At the time you are speaking, Israel was part of the Ottoman Empire....Turks aren't arabs.
     
  11. Karma Mechanic

    Karma Mechanic Well-Known Member

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    But she is wrong about Jews by choice. As a practicing Jew and someone with I dare say a ton of knowledge on the subject you might want to actually go to Jewish sources to find things out.

    Again, nothing you write here is true. Conversions to Judaism are all over the Bible. You learn more about it if you pick up the book, open it and read it for yourself. As for the dowry, it isn't a purchase. Ask your scholarly wife what a Ketubah is and what it means to the wife in a marriage.


    I dispute you have the knowledge to dispute anything. You have used extremely bigoted websites to promote your ideas based on lies. I am sorry that you have been brainwashed.
     
  12. Marlowe

    Marlowe New Member

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    I've said my piece . in the post you appear to be responding to or diverting from . You are of course at liberty to interpret anything I've said in whichever way youso choose to.

    Byeeee.
     
  13. Ivan88

    Ivan88 Well-Known Member

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  14. Karma Mechanic

    Karma Mechanic Well-Known Member

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    oh look,,,another cowardly act/
     
  15. Knuckleballer

    Knuckleballer New Member

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    And more cowardice in the face of truth.... what an intellectual joke! Typical.
     
  16. Art_Allm

    Art_Allm Banned at Members Request Past Donor

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    It resulted in the death of many people who worked for America.

    Well, I think that the half-Jew Casper Weinberger (his father must have been a decent Jew) had an idea what he revealed and what more he can reveal if America eventually lets him go, bowing to the pressure of Zionists.

    If the passed information was not important, why did Israelis (the supposed "best friends" of Americans) not cooperate and not return the stolen documents?

    It is obvious that the stolen documents are important, and that the Jewish Lobby is pressing for the release of Pollard, because they hope that Pollard can help them with reading these documents.

    They demand the release of Pollard, but they refuse to return the stolen documents!
    Is this like "friends" treat their "friends"?
     
  17. Art_Allm

    Art_Allm Banned at Members Request Past Donor

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    One picture tells more than thousand words, but if you see the world through your "Jewish glasses", you will remain blind.


    So what? American presidents are doing the bidding of their sponsors.

    Did Israeli President or Netanyahu make an official statement, saying that this Rabbi is a bigot?

    If not, then bigotry is a main stream phenomenon in Israel, and it is a duty for any decent person to point out the bigotry.

    If somebody tries to hide this facts, then he himself is a bigot.
     
  18. Jonsa

    Jonsa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    For somebody that isn't an expert on DNA, I am not surprised you would fall back on your extensive knowledge of the human condition, especially - trickery? did you obtain this knowledge thru practice or victimization?

    Its always amusing when jew haters who make idiotic claims resent the fact that such nonsense can be debunked by actual scientific evidence. They express doubts about scientific studies that they can't even understand the foreword of. they express doubts about science being funded by (unnamed nefarious agenda drivers), demonstrating further ignorance of the scientific process.

    Everyone is entitled to their own opinions. Unfortunately that means that there are a lot of totally uninformed, hate mishappen opinions out there that shame the species.
     
  19. Stuart Wolfe

    Stuart Wolfe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Who cares if they did? I don't need Our Glorious Messiah Obama telling me Westboro Baptist (or better yet, Jeremiah Wright) is a collection of Ninnynoodles in order to know that they indeed are such.
     
  20. Art_Allm

    Art_Allm Banned at Members Request Past Donor

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    Well, Jewish lobbies cared a lot what the German pope (Joseph Ratzinger ) and the German canceller (Frau Merkel )said in their official statements about the catholic bishop who told in a private conversation that he does not believe in the existence of homicidal gas chambers in Auschwitz. They were literally forced to make an official statement and take measures.


    Why do you think that nobody cares about the official statement of Netanyahu or Peres, concerning the hate speeches of very influential and prominent Israeli Rabbis in Israel?


    So when a catholic bishop says in a private interview that he does not believe in some events of WWII, then Chief Rabbinate of Israel suspended contacts with the Vatican, till Vatican makes its official statement, condemning the catholic bishop.

    But when an Israeli Rabbi tells in an official speech that he believes that all non-Jews (99% of world population, including Catholics) were created to serve their self-appointed Jewish masters (less than 1% of world population), and that the life of non-Jews has the same value, like the life of a donkey, then nothing happens.

    Vatican does not protest, Abraham Foxman does not demand the excommunication of this hater from the Jewish community, and Nethanyahu or Peres do not have to condemn this hater.

    One picture tells more than 100 words, the pictures that I have presented show that Peres and Nethanyahu cringe to this Jewish Rabbi.

    Only if somebody sees the world through the "Jewish glasses", then he is blind to this obvious hypocrisy and this outrageous double standard.
     
  21. Marlowe

    Marlowe New Member

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    What truth ?

    ...
     
  22. Karma Mechanic

    Karma Mechanic Well-Known Member

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    Platitudes....that is all you have.




    So the Jews now are in control of the Taliban?

    I don't know but then that isn't the point. The point is you are using him to paint all Jews like that and in fact the vast majority of world Jewry did. So your argument is trash.

    Yes that is why I point out your bigotry every day.

    Perhaps your white hood is a little tight because you sound delusional.
     
  23. Stuart Wolfe

    Stuart Wolfe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You're moving the goalposts there. Your point was that a statement is considered valid or not only if some government agency makes a statement on such. Joe Biden once said "Barack says, a three-letter word: jobs. J-O-B-S, jobs." Because the Vice-idiot said it, does that really mean that Obama thinks "jobs" is a three-letter word, or that it has been made such by administrative fiat? Of course not.

    What this rabbi said, you can't consider that it is or is not official Israeli policy just because Net hasn't cared to comment on it.

    And as far as the RCC and Merkel standing down on this comment, they weren't forced to do anything, they just kowtowed. Really, what could Israel have done if they said "Nah, he has the right to his opinion." Nothing, and everyone knows it. Although you're the first person I know that's defending Ratz. The guy condoned child abuse; frankly anything that humiliated him is a good thing. In this case, I would side with Israel just on principle.

    Because no one considers them important outside of people who keep focusing on Jews all the time.
     
  24. Jonsa

    Jonsa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Since it was you that said "i don't know much about DNA" and then proceed to make a couple of ignorant statements about jewish genetic outcomes, your response above seems rather disconnected with reality.

    I have to agree it doesn't take much intelligence to point out how ridiculous your post actually was, but the fact that it goes right over your head does indicated where the thickness resides.

    At least one positive thing has come out of our sparring. Your true character is revealing itself.
     
  25. Stuart Wolfe

    Stuart Wolfe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I don't see Jonsa posting about how Jews might be a distinct species.
     
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