My dad was a high school teacher, and I've seen some of the inside drama. When I was a kid, they were trying to keep up with Japan. Every few years there would be some new way to "fix" education. The teachers would have to completely change their courses for whichever way the wind blows. Every few years they would go in a radical new direction. We get in futile arguments about year round school, testing methods, ect. I spoke to my next door neighbor, a substitute teacher, and she said our states test scores are dropping. She said the problem is the same as it was 40 or 50 years ago. The kids come to school thinking that learning is not important. There is no one at home telling them to give a darn. We expect teachers to fix or overcome this. How are they supposed to do that? How can we encourage parents to help their kids learn? If you figure this out, you have finally "fixed" the American Education system.
I've spent a lot of time volunteering in schools for the kids who are one **** up away from being chained to a desk in a "school" that looks much more like a prison than a learning environment. I dropped out of high school, enlisted in the Marine Corps, joined the union, and now spend all day running work. I know how long it took me to get to a point where I could call myself successful because I didn't have a stupid piece of paper. I'm a realist, and know exactly what happens to those kids if they don't shape up and get inspired. Do you think someone my age, who might have graduated college a year or two ago with a child like voice and not a wrinkle to be found is going to be the one to do it? Eliminate educational requirements beyond the actual education credential, and focus more on what people have actually done in their working lives. Having teachers who actually give a ****, and have relevant backgrounds, would fix a whole lot of problems.
Mostly the innovative solutions concocted by the educational field was doomed from the get-go for two reasons; first they were conceived by educators with exalted and specialized degrees, most of whom had almost no meaningful experience actually teaching children and dealing with parents and administrators on a daily basis for year after year and so they effectively knew NOTHING about real world teaching; and second, most of the schemes were heavily influenced by leftists who belonged to the cult of self-esteem and multiculturalism where education was concerned; memorization was verboten outside of the STEM subjects and history had to be sanitized for Politically Correct acceptance and so forth and so on. I do not write this in an experience vacuum. I was a private tutor for several decades and my wife was both a school teacher for many years and is today a private tutor. Now here is the irony . . . she and I differ on the possible solution. Her idea adheres to general conservatism in allowing each state to totally take back control of their own educational processes in regards to public schooling. Mine is on the surface leftist in nature, but with a distinctly conservative twist. I think that the public schools educational process should be exclusively controlled by the government BUT with the same educational standards that were both widespread and very successful during the 1950s BEFORE liberals and lefitsts gutted standards. So we agree to disagree.
I could solve this mess stick to what works in most countries that matter. 1. Demand every child give their best but also admit not all children are the same some are great at academic skills, some are great socially, some favor physical talents and some artistic and some won't be all that good at anything but might work hard when they work. 2. Educate all children in general subjects through eighth grade then in areas they are likely to do well in maybe the football jock is only good at physical work but what work do we have that is physical mostly skilled trades so why not teach him to be good at Construction work while in High School or Automotive Mechanics or Plumbing or anything else his fit body helps. The socially talented student might be good in Sales or could work in a Medical Support area or something. Make sure they are challenged and re-trainable and explore their other interests. 3. Disabled students and I was one of them should be given needed help but face it some will never get a good career or be employable for them perhaps self-work or even permanent government support should be the thing needed and I would cut off education if they can't benefit after 8th grade if needed. Someone with an IQ of 65 and in a wheelchair paralyzed won't ever work so why waste money on them after eight years? I might even cut them off earlier. 4. Give employers input and get students tracked from High School into jobs waiting or into a good school to get more education. 5. Out best students the ones who are geniuses need to be sent to schools where they can focus with peers on being geniuses and tracked into good universities.
There is no easy answer that will work for all kids. I taught for 8 years in the 1990s, and my wife has been an educator (teacher, school librarian, asst. Principal and Principal) for all but 3 of our almost 21 years of marriage (she took care of our sons for three years). My main takeaways: 1) we aren't doing a good enough job teaching the basics, like multiplication and division; 2) we have an awful lot of mediocrity in the schools--in the adults who work there and in the kids who study there; 3) it's almost impossible to teach a kid who's parents don't give a **** about education; 4) our general curriculum is a watered down college prep curriculum that neither prepares kids for college (not rigorous enough) nor does it appropriately educate people not planning on college and 5) this won't change until the parents demand it.
Speaking of parents demanding it, it's not so much the parents as it is the administration/elected officials. A good friend of mine is a school board member back home. He's a great guy who wants to give teachers, students, and parents every possible tool to succeed. When he first ran for school board, he was relentlessly attacked for not being a college graduate, for being a homosexual, for being a pedophile because apparently that's what some people think being gay means, and more importantly NOT BEING A PARENT. I spend quite a bit of time volunteering in schools and attending school board meetings. Management and the elected side know for a fact that the average parent who makes a fuss has a short amount of time on their hands. No matter who they are, their kid's getting older, and will be moving on. Who in their right minds would continue being the pain in someone's ass who no longer effects them? I had an absolutely terrible teacher my senior year, who by all responsible measures should have been forced into early retirement if not fired outright. Was literally the reason I dropped out. She really thought that the day she signed my paperwork to leave high school was the last day she'd see me, but like with many things she was wrong. My little brother had her, and every, single, day, I was in that classroom. I showed up at every single school board meeting, had a meeting with the principle at least once a week, for 5 YEARS until that woman was no longer able to write her own lesson plan. For years I got blown off because "there's nothing we can do", until they finally realized that I wasn't going away.
Until the parents demand it, the elected officials won't budge. I would never vote for somebody to be on the school board unless they were a parent or an educator. I don't care if they are black/white/gay whatever. Just my personal choice. Not talking about individual parents at individual schools, but when parents as a group demand better education, then it will be provided. Who's the principle? Oh, you mean the principal. Doesn't sound like what you did worked, if it took five years to do it. Of course there was stuff they could do. They were just too lazy. My wife used to be an assistant principal. She got rid of a worthless teacher (as in got a tenured teacher fired), and ran several off without firing. The principal involved in your case didn't want to fire her, or was too lazy to fire her.
I tell you that I'm a high school dropout, and you point out a minor error while admitting you completely lack proper reading comprehension. Administration waits out pissed off parents, because they have a limited window. Mostly because they know that few people will ever challenge them, and that most voters place ridiculous, frivolous expectations on candidates. I'd never vote for someone running for school board who was over 30, unless they had other current, relevant experience in the classroom. What could someone who hasn't been in a public primary or secondary school in decades possibly know about the current, pressing issues?
The whole principle thing is just a pet peeve of mine. The easy way to remember it is the principal is your pal, to refer to the school employee. I point this out all the time, and to not point it out because you didn't finish high school would have been patronizing you. You don't get a pass on being criticized for spelling just because you dropped out. I've found that school administrations give in fast to parents who are vocal. May just be the local area, but in my interactions with school admins, I win 3/4 times. Maybe it's because I'm right when I do. Nobody under 30 has any idea as to what the goal of education is. Rarely do they have old enough children to be able to see the big picture. Parents have a much better understanding of what's going on in the schools today than silly 20 somethings. Believe it or not, things change in ten years, and in today's environment, ten years out of the classroom is the same as thirty used to be.
It seems like teaching the basics is something we can fix. In my son's schools, I've seen a boatload of mediocrity. To be blunt, there are many teachers who just shouldn't be there. The least they could do is tell the kid to read a chapter and give them a test at the end. I don't see how to improve the teacher pool. Again, many adults have no interest in education. My grandmother used to look down on my father because he got summers off. If you talk about giving teachers a raise, you are going to hear people howl in derision. Education is not a core US value. It is sad, but that is how I see it. I haven't thought much about the nitty-gritty of curriculum stuff. I would say computer programming should be one of the new basics like math and English. I'd also think some real world skills would be nice for these glow babies. Teach them a skill besides working their phone. In Asia, they have academies after school. Honestly, the Asian model goes a bit too far. The kids get out of school, go to their academies, come home to an avalanche of homework, go to bed, wake up and do it again. They have absolutely no lives other than school. Still, it would be nice to extend the day a couple of periods for some hands on real world electives. Finally, any teachers on here will tell you their is a special education problem. A teacher with 30 kids will spend most of their time doing paperwork and sop forms for a few special ed kids. I realize the need for fairness, and I know this is not politically correct, but these heaping piles of paperwork make it almost impossible to teach the rest of the students. There has to be some other way to be inclusive yet allow the teachers to do their job.
Meh, can't find statistics on 1967 - 1977, so I can't take your word for that. I did find this: https://nces.ed.gov/programs/coe/indicator_cnb.asp Take a look. Many graduate today and cannot read. That would be an indicator that times indeed have changed. It would also indicate there is no comparison to years gone by. Sorry.....
I'm serious why not investigate what people actually learn and hold onto in K-12 education then break the system to teaching a reduced core curriculum then track students for the rest into technical applied education OR pre-college preparation for the seriously committed to it smart children who want to go. I will note in colonial times a book like the Last of the Mohicans a book demanding a good amount of reading skill and had complex issues in it was a best seller of its day which means many working people bought copies not just the educated elite. And most people had six years of education this up through much of the 19th century some less and some a bit more and some few did go to a college level. So what the hell is the issue it seems 13 years of education repeating the same stuff over and over is babysitting not education that is useful. What matters is skills can you do things employers want this applies to any kind of education. So figure what core education is needed, do that in nine years, then track students to be good workers out of High School if possible employers want or get them ready for a rigorous college education.
How could anyone be so Brain Dead? The country has taken in a massive population influx from the Third World. "Not Sending Their Best": World Map of IQ Drop Due to Immigration The generational gap is especially large in some places. In California, for example, less than 24% of students in public schools are white, compared to 62.8% of the teachers. (2016-2017, source here: https://www.cde.ca.gov/ds/sd/cb/ceffingertipfacts.asp ) Are teachers ignoring the obvious because it doesn't compute with their ideology? If you want the country to be more like Japan, bring in a million Japanese couples and financially incentivize them to churn out lots of babies. People say it's ALL about culture and then are bewildered at the things they see happening.
At least in Florida, nobody graduates high school (with a regular or college prep diploma) today and cannot read. If you can't read, you can't pass the graduation requirements, plain and simple.
Public education cannot be 'fixed' if society cannot agree how to clearly and concisely define public education. Last I looked at the Department of Education website I could not find a mission statement...what are the goals of public education? Just toss out some information and let kids pass or fail? Should 100% of kids learn to a rigid quantified education requirement? Or, are we happy with 50%? What is society doing about the 50% who fail or learn little to nothing? What is society doing about kids with little to no parental involvement and/or live in the bowels of society? Good luck encouraging/forcing parents to do better...
Excellent observation. People think pre-public education that Americans (and all pre-20th century people) were illiterate and stupid. Not true at all. Technology was less advanced but that does not mean people were stupid. What was a common activity of the time? People did not sit around the tv wasting time watching foolishness or texting gossip or posting irrelevant narcissistic drivel on facebook. People sat with their neighbors reading the newspaper or pamphlets and discussing the issues, the made up elaborate stories for entertainment (such as Moby Dick), they built musical instruments and learned to play them. Look at tests from the late 19th and early 20th century. https://newrepublic.com/article/79470/1895-8th-grade-final-exam-i-couldnt-pass-it-could-you https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smar...-smarter-than-a-1912-era-8th-grader-19949041/ Yes, some of the data are no longer that relevant to today, but thats not the point - 8th graders were expected to know that depth and breadth of information and have that level of skill. Its puts todays public education tests to shame.
It would be the practical approach, now not popular, you would be saying some very incapable children won't get a public education but nothing says private education from charities and parents paying for it can't be an option.
Childish behavior, and childish thoughts are completely relative to one's environment. James Monroe was more than capable of leading American forces into Trenton, despite being 17. When maturity is required and/or demanded, it is developed. When you coddle children they remain children. Most of my friends, all of us in our late 20's, are remarkably accomplished and have held positions in middle and upper management in our respective career fields and government. All of us suffered the death or permanent disability of a parent in high school, and had no choice but to become adults.
Public education should be focused on the production of citizens, not the futile pursuit of emulating the wealthy.
I have no answer since I did and still do teach my kids at home to be good in school and it will pay you back.
There is a harsh answer which few will accept; if we truly wanted to educate every kid to their fullest potential, after maybe grade 4-5 we would need to place all kids into an education system in which the kids are separated from their parents, live full time at an education camp. Even with this the potential for each kid varies from failure to genius but at least there would be 100% education focus no matter the kids parents or home environment. At least have this option for the kids who need a different structure than what they have at home...
