Free trade

Discussion in 'Economics & Trade' started by TerraBackTax, Sep 13, 2018.

  1. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    Utter drivel of course. The US benefits from trade (and issues of fairness are typically about economic development and the poor South). You've just allowed a political system that ensures those benefits are skewed in favour of the elite.

    Perhaps stop whinging, get off your arses and put that right, rather than being manipulated by cretinous nationalism?
     
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  2. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    One step at a time.

    Cretinous globalism is the bigger threat.

    Mayhaps our corrupt local elites will be a bit easier to squish after they're not getting so rich by bending us over to the corrupt international elites.
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2018
  3. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Oh, come off your High-Horse.

    America got what it deserved, THE GREAT RECESSION. That was an American Born cataclysm organized and produced by Wall Street!

    The facts of the matter: Financial crisis of 2007–2008 excerpt:
    We Yanks have nobody to blame but ourselves:
    *Wall St. avarice to earn megabucks, instigated by
    *Reckless Ronnie's drastic reduction of Upper-income Taxation in the 1980s!
    *Which resulted in this!

    A people who think that the Key Objective of life-on-earth is for individuals to amass incredible Wealth have their heads far up their anus ... !
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2018
  4. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Blah, blah, blah.

    Moving right along ...
     
  5. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    Why is globalism a threat? You think Germany thinks that way? Nationalism guarantees economic loss. No way around that.
     
  6. Thought Criminal

    Thought Criminal Well-Known Member Donor

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    Meanwhile, we continue to ship tons of money to China so that they can continue to build weapons to aim at us.
     
  7. expatpanama

    expatpanama Active Member

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    Maybe the establishment Republicans are idiots for always fighting Trump:

    Trump Got Trade Right at the G-7: All Tariffs Must Go
    https://www.bloomberg.com/view/arti...ot-trade-right-at-the-g-7-abolish-all-tariffs

    Trump Proposes Mutual Removal of All Tariffs in Trade With EU

    https://sputniknews.com/us/201807251066658993-trump-idea-remove-eu-tariffs/

    This is just a tactic, Trump really wants to eliminate all tariffs

    https://www.laconiadailysun.com/opi...cle_7450dc54-8ce8-11e8-938c-7f230aae6a3f.html

    Trump says trade should be 'tariff free' between G-7 nations
    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/06/09/tru...be-tariff-free-barrier-free-subsidy-free.html

    Trump floats scrapping all tariffs, barriers at G-7 summit: report

    https://thehill.com/policy/international/391465-trump-we-should-consider-scraping-all-tariffs
     
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  8. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    You listen to what Trump says? Wow! The WTO moved its focus from tariff to the more important concern, non-tariff barriers, yonks ago. Imagine if he was aware of that? That would help!
     
  9. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Oh, really?

    Then what about this from Politico: Silicon Valley blasts Trump’s tech tariffs - excerpt:

    We are in (deep) a Trade War with China. Nothing economically good in the history of the US has ever resulted from a Trade War.

    As a result, the layoffs in some industries is only the beginning ...
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2018
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  10. expatpanama

    expatpanama Active Member

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    We can agree that usually trade wars are bad. We can also agree that the leftist pundits hate Trump no matter what. Meanwhile, those of us working for a living are far better off (from bls.gov):

    Employment as a Percent of the Population

    .....from 2009 to 2016 ......................58.9%
    .....beginning of "trade war"..............59.9%
    .....since the "trade war" began........60.4%​

    What's happening is that even while the stand off is resulting in some import tax hikes, there've been a number of import tax cuts that our trading partners have come around to:

    Mexico's Free Trade Agreements - Federation of American ...
    https://fas.org/sgp/crs/row/R40784.pdf

    European Union Agrees to Lower Industrial Tariffs

    https://www.thestreet.com/politics/european-union-agrees-to-lower-industrial-tariffs-14662353

    China likely to reduce near-term spot US LNG imports on tariff uncertainty: sources
    https://www.spglobal.com/platts/en/...-us-lng-imports-on-tariff-uncertainty-sources

    China-Canada WTO Agreement Will Reduce Tariffs on Imports
    https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB943639475934387539

    U.S. and China reach agreement on reducing trade deficit ...
    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...ment-reducing-trade-deficit-article-1.3999788

    So the reason we're so much better off w/ this squabble is we're benefiting from all the (import) tax cuts
     
  11. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    I'm not up to speed on US history so I'll counter with some British history.

    In the mid 1900's a trade war took out Chinese china production.
    An era of delightful domestic china production ensued to the great good of all employed in it. Entire towns popped up to meet that supply.
    Wedgewood.

    [​IMG]

    Still trading today.

    The effects of trade wars vs France and Spain are that the US is an English speaking nation that has prospered from access to the largest global markets.
    The slave trade was ended world wide.

    And so on.
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2018
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  12. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Look at the longer historical picture of the E-to-P Ratio from here:
    [​IMG]
    Note this:
    *The Replicants took power of the HofR in the 2010-midterms
    *They refused all-further-stimulus spending. It was afterall Obama's 2009 ARRA-bill that provided the economic stimulus to bring unemployment down from the 10% level in the first place. And the Replicants were looking forward to replacing him in the 2012-elections. So, NO MORE STIMULUS SPENDING! And no more job creation!
    *The result of which is that for four lonnggggggg years (2010 to 2014) NO FURTHER INCREASE IN THE E/P RATIO OCCURRED. Employment creation had stagnated for four long years!
    *Finally, in the midst of Obama's second-term the E-to-P Ratio began to improve all by itself. Americans started spending again. BUT ...
    *If you take that line you see in the graphic above, and project it outward in a straight line (which I have done), then
    it will intersect the previous high of 63% of 2008 in ANOTHER SEVEN YEARS (2025)!!!!!!!

    I think my above explanation is a lot more closer to the truth than yours. We are not anywhere near recuperating from the Great Recession! Moreover, we must face the Gruesome Fact that the world economies have changed profoundly with the advent of the Information Age.

    Meaning what? This:
    *Unfortunately the past is no real predictor of the future given that the economic ground-rules have changed fundamentally

    *We must educate our children quickly to a higher level of certification if they are to find good jobs.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2018
  13. expatpanama

    expatpanama Active Member

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    So we agree that your prior post was in error and the employment w/ the this so-called "trade war" is giving us an employment situation better than anything we got from the previous administration.

    Sounds great!
     
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  14. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    There will be layoffs in some industries.

    Potentially retail and more potentially in multi-national companies foreign operations.
    This will also negatively affect the profits of the SNP 500 disproportionately.
    Expect muchos lobbying by them against these tariffs.

    Those politicians who cry loudest, those are your most corrupt.
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2018
  15. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    More useless nonsense.

    Bad habit - get rid of it ... !
     
  16. expatpanama

    expatpanama Active Member

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    We'll take that to mean you suddenly don't want to look at the long term E%P Ratio any more.

    Smart move for politics, bad move for trying to keep up a connection with reality.
     
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  17. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Take it to mean that you are not competent to post in an Economics Forum ...
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2018
  18. The Rhetoric of Life

    The Rhetoric of Life Banned

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    It seems the EU is a big problem in free trade forcing developing economies to drop their tariffs and protectionist laws.
    Dumping excess European stock onto Cameroon out pricing local farmers who are agreeing to drop their tariffs for an EU deal.
    Free trade between the EU and Cameroon is forcing EU's excess onto their markets at a cheaper price, the EU is dumping on to Cameroon through free trade.
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2018
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  19. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    When you have nothing to add, troll.
     
  20. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    Bad policy for Cameroon. Expect famines when the EU has a poor crop yield.
     
  21. The Rhetoric of Life

    The Rhetoric of Life Banned

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    These people won't listen to the EU for long.
    Expect protectionism and maybe if we're lucky, a hissy fit from the EU worthy of popcorn.

    Some economies need protecting through protectionism so they can grow, raise, sell and feed.

    The day ever come the EU gets a famine, these Cameroonians get a break; they don't need EU farmers dumping cheaper produce on to them.
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2018
  22. james M

    james M Banned

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    they are trying to push China toward free trade with tariffs, obviously!! How would you do it??
     
  23. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    I don't think there ever was a time when the R party was for free trade.
    They are just as responsible for subsidies, incentives, corporate welfare, and other giveaways to large businesses.
     
  24. james M

    james M Banned

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    wrong of course they are more for capitalism than Democrats who are now openly socialist. This means opposed to capitalism.
     
  25. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    Nope I'm correct. The R party is not about free trade.
     

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