Ganster-Like behavior of "Official Liars"

Discussion in '9/11' started by Kokomojojo, Oct 23, 2011.

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  1. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

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    no gramatical errors, looking for the speck in my eye again to distract us from the boulder in yours eh.....


    come on git with it.



    I think this proves the gangster style behavior of all officials involved.



    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82ialxI0SvE"]'Evidence proves 9/11 story is a lie' Buildings Were Taken Down by Controlled Demolition - YouTube[/ame]





    Where is this stuff in any official reports? Oh wait they are official lies I almost forgot.
     
  2. happy fun dude

    happy fun dude New Member

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    You claimed I agreed with you when I clearly didn't and in fact said the complete oppositte.

    Here's the quote:

    Patriot911: "Way to prove your complete incompetence! So you agree there was nothing the "top brass" could have done, yet you claim they are guilty of not mounting an "effective defense".

    You said it.. "So you agree there was nothing the "top brass" could have done..."

    Hell, you even opened the conversation by demanding I come up with an example order of something they could have done.

    No straw man here, these are the arguments you made.. You've just lost track.

    They did NOT have adequate protocols for THIS attack, which is OBVIOUS from the response that did occur, pilots flying default paths over the ocean, etc. But the top brass can issue orders, right? Of course.

    Really.. So you think the air defense system was set up that initial planes can be airborne but not relieved? In the event of aerial assault against America a TOTAL of four planes will respond? Nothing to follow?

    I'll just need some evidence.. Explain to me how long it takes for replacement fighters to be airborne, and/or airborne refuelling planes to be deployed to keep a patrol pattern alive. This must definatily be much longer than a patrol position over DC can last?

    No... By 9:03, or soon after, they knew that two hijacked airliner collissions have occurred in NY AND there were additional hijacked aircraft. DC is the capitol it is therefore potential target in a time of attack. The Pentagon upgraded their alert status at around this time for this obvious reason.

    Soon after this point is when you could expect fighters from Langley to be awaiting a target for interception while in a patrol position of the most critical airspace, rather than sat on the tarmac. When you do finally find your target, would you rather tell it to a pilot in the sky and airborne, or one sat sipping on a cup of coffee?

    YOu get airborne.. Establish a patrol pattern.. No afterburners necessary.. When the threat is identified, you can proceed to it, and put on the afterburners, if necessary.

    Regardless the reason why, the fact remains, those jets were launched withOUT the necessary updated orders, weren't they?

    If you argue there is no difference these leaders could have made, it means you couldn't save lives at the Pentagon with evacuation. It's not lying, it comes with your argument.

    Clearly I said NON ESSENTIAL personnel, you should have read more carefully. That is accountants and janitors and such.

    I wouldn't expect the military leadership to go running.. Only the top two rungs did that... Now this is interesting because you specify the Pentagon is the "military hub" and it's a time of attack.. Do you know who is the leader of this military hub? Who's the boss of the Pentagon?

    I'm not referring to "mistakes" I'm referring to a lack of action and concern.

    By 9:05 a.m. almost the entire WORLD was glued to their T.V.s and/or radios, wanting to know what was going on in NY. Everybody..You me.. Everybody. Billions of people.. True enough? Would you agree that concern/WTF was an almost universal human reaction to this event?

    Yet you have two guys, out of billions, who show the complete oppositte. Complete departure from both human nature and their job description. The President, whose constitutional duty is commander in cheif of the US military, and the secretary of defense, charged with well defense.. THOSE are the only TWO people out of BILLIONS who actually DON'T want to know what's going on with these attacks.

    Business as usual... Routine CIA briefing... My Pet Goat... Address the nation.. etc..

    This is a bit inexplicable to me.

    Malfaesesense, or a desire to let the attack play out, is the ONLY possible motive that explains such behavior, and explains it PERFECTLY.

    But if that's not it, do tell me, what OTHER explanation is there?

    Why ELSE would Rumsfeld be "out of the loop" as he put it during this time of crisis? What other reasons would make the SECDEF know LESS about the attacks than the billions of people glued to their TV screens? Why was the SECDEF the only one out of billions withOUT the desire to find out what was going on?

    You are aware that, according to the official cover story, the FAA took an aweful long time to notify NORAD of things. Why does it take so long?

    Why does the FAA wait so long to alert NORAD of various happenings like the flight 11 collission, the hijackings etc.?

    They can only have the information if they seek it first! That's the POINT!

    They didn't seek the information. Other things were more important, like routine CIA breifings and writing a speech to tell your countrymen. And "projecting calm" to kids.. And whatever other NON constitutional duties they could do in leue of focusing on the crisis at hand.

    So finding out about Flight 11 at 8:40 and not issuing a scramble order to your pilots till 8:46 is what they were supposed to do? Ordering planes to take off but leaving them with the default orders to fly over the ocean instead of give them new orders, that is what they're supposed to do?

    No that's just you making stuff up. They can be airborne and patrolling while they await targetting orders.

    Okay so you don't want the fighters to patrol the critical airspace because that's wasting fuel and going out of position, but taking off and flying across the ocean on the default heading is NOT?!?
     
  3. Patriot911

    Patriot911 New Member Past Donor

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    And I still didn't quote you. You still can't understand such simple little details. :lol:

    Nope. You've made the claim that the top brass are somehow guilty because they didn't DO something. I've proven there was nothing they could have done given the information they knew at the time. You've come up with some seriously bull(*)(*)(*)(*) excuses for what they might have ordered if they were clairvoyant, but other than that you don't have (*)(*)(*)(*).

    So why don't you once again fumble around in the dark trying to come up with a psychic order the top brass could have given that would make a difference. BTW, the order was given for them to fly direcly north, but the ATC and the pilots both thought the protocol took precidence.

    :lol: They couldn't get more planes into the air for at least an hour, and those were basically unarmed. The truth speaks louder than your second guessing, doesn't it.

    Eventually, yes. The inital planes are suppose to take care of the initial threat. Look it up. There were only a total of 14 planes for the entire United States and only four of them for the northeast seaboard. It is historical fact.

    Source

    I'll just need some evidence.. Explain to me how long it takes for replacement fighters to be airborne, and/or airborne refuelling planes to be deployed to keep a patrol pattern alive. This must definatily be much longer than a patrol position over DC can last?[/quote]

    Well, it's not like you've ever let evidence convince you before, but there is always a chance.

    Andrews AFB
    Here is the story of what happened at Andrews AFB. It took them well over an hour to get three planes in the air and they weren't even armed with missiles. No unusual circumstances going on. No stand down orders. Business as usual.

    Well, since you ignored this little tidbit before, lets see how you handle it again. Does the Pentagon get evacuated when we are under attack? No. Did it get evacuated completely after Flight 77 hit it? No. It stayed operational. Is any of this getting through? Even when the earthquake hit only non-essential people were evacuated.

    :lol: Way to lie your ass off! We both know they weren't sitting around sipping coffee. They were in their planes awaiting orders. See, this is why truthers have no credibility. They know the truth and ignore it to try and seem intelligent. BTW, when the planes were launched they DID have a target. What does that tell you about what the standard protocol is?

    Or have to turn back to get refueled. Your daydreaming about a perfect world doesn't cut it. Reality is that what you are whining about is NOT what the protocol was. People far more intelligent than you came up with the protocols and for better reasons than you have for monday morning quarterbacking about 9/11.

    Nope. You got it wrong yet again. They WERE given orders to head directly towards the targets. ATC and the pilots both thought the protocols took precidence. This has been documented and explained. A shame you can't seem to keep up.

    Wrong yet again. Once again you are demanding that some top brass make an order based on zero information that would then cripple the military intelligence of the United States. What kind of (*)(*)(*)(*)ed up top brass would give orders like that without any intelligence that the Pentagon was specifically targeted? None. I know it. You know it. But it is the best excuse you have so you won't let it go.

    :lol: Frankly I quit reading that post when it was clear just how delusional it was. Yes, you did say non-essential personnel. Big whoop. Again, one would only make that call if one had viable intelligence that the Pentagon was going to be hit, and the Pentagon isn't as valid a target as the Whitehouse or the Captial Building.

    As for who runs the Pentagon, that would be the President. But again, as has been gone over countless times before, the President is not needed to micro-manage the Pentagon and those under him. Chain of command seems to escape your comprehension.
     
  4. Patriot911

    Patriot911 New Member Past Donor

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    Easy to claim after the fact as you sit in front of your computer instead of dealing with the situation at the time.

    IN NEW YORK CITY. Not Washington. Very few people knew about Flight 93 and almost nobody knew about 77 until it was far too late. There was so much confusion that they thought Flight 11 was heading from New York to Washington, which is why the fighters were scrambled. If not for that, they would have still been on the ground awaiting a target.

    Bull(*)(*)(*)(*). That is just you projecting your hatred onto these men.

    Instead of issuing orders without information. I think I would rather have them doing the above than going off half cocked like you wanted them to do.

    That is because you're blinded by hate and are trying to pretend they knew what was going on or could even be informed of what, exactly, was going on.

    Bull(*)(*)(*)(*). That is all you want to see so that is all you see.

    Well, lets see.... how about planning for the defense of the United States instead of cowering in fear of being the next target? If Rumsfeld knew the Pentagon was a target, why didn't he get out? Why didn't he tell his close friends and advisors to get out? Forget the non-essential people, why didn't he evacuate the top people? Pretending they knew what was going on and just let it happen is nothing but the twisted, insane desire to demonize people for not doing what YOU would have done knowing what you know NOW, not what they knew then.

    More bull(*)(*)(*)(*) claims by you. You don't know for sure what was going on or what Rumsfeld knew. Quit pretending.

    Wait.... I thought you were trying to pretend it wasn't an inside job, now you're pretending there is a cover story? :lol: Truthers make terrible liars, especially when they try to pretend they are better than everyone else. It usually doesn't last an entire post just like this time.

    Define awful long time. Come on. From the time they KNEW the people who could call NORAD knew it was a hijacking until they called NORAD. An hour? Two? Oh wait. Minutes?

    Flight 11 was hijacked at 8:14. ATC suspected Flight 11 was hijacked at 8:20. NORAD was informed of Flight 11 at 8:40, but could not be given a position due to the transponder being turned off. Flight 11 hit at 8:46. NORAD had fighters in the air at 8:52 and tried to intercept Flight 175 once they were informed of it's position.

    Now, until Flight 11 hit the North tower, no hijacked plane had ever been used as a missile. They were used as negotiating devices to get a desired outcome. Thus the FAA would want to get planes in the air, but the urgency to do so, much less the order to shoot down the plane, would not be there. The FAA also had to locate Flight 11 to give NORAD directions. They don't just call up NORAD and say "Hey, we gots a plane hijacked. Go up and find it.".

    They were being fed the information as it became available. You pretending it didn't doesn't change the facts, does it.

    Funny how haters think everything should just happen INSTANTLY. What.... you think it is the same person who receives the call from NORAD who then makes the decision to scramble and is also the same person who gives the pilots the orders? Or do you think MAYBE it is several people along the chain that need to be contacted, informed and then act?

    That was NOT the protocol of the day. If it was, you would have something to hang your hat on. As it is you're just monday morning quarterbacking and pretending like you know what the protocols are all about.

    How many times are you going to use the same lie? They were ordered directly towards the target. ATC and the pilots made a mistake and assumed the standard orders took precidence. Are you now going to blame ATC and the pilots or are you going to CONTINUE to lie your ass off?
     

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