How many members would like a firearms discussion area

Dude... there's a JFK forum (it's 2015), a moon landing forum (it's 2015), an Illuminati forum.
If there's one thing PF doesn't care about it's "too many forums".

As will those whose mission is to vilify them.

Seems a separate forum would allow for more civil discussion.

Once the anti-gun whining begins, the normal people stop reading.

 

And that's why there should be a Forum specific to Firearms....and then sub-forums of which Gun Enthusiast would be one of them.

Plus the words GUN CONTROL have a subjective meaning!! LOL!!

AboveAlpha

 

I thought there could be more to add to voice favor of a sub-forum, but it's summed up pretty well.
I went out with a new shooter 2 days ago. It would be nice to have a section where it would be appropriate to share experiences like that.
This guy had been inclined to be anti-gun, but he got to thinking about who is responsible for protecting himself and his wife, and he bought a Glock 23. (I think that's it. The .40 in the same frame size as the 19. I don't care about anything in .40).
It was a little scary to see his unfamiliarity with my guns, but his discipline was good. My discussion would be about how to transition him comfortably over to practical drills. I've been an RSO, but not a defensive instructor.

 

that is a common gun with the FBI and some other feds. I have one and one of my former colleagues was issued one as a Deputy USMS officer when he, a Federal prosecutor, went to Afghanistan for a year on a DOJ task force. I am not a big fan of the 40 since its harder on the gun and the shooter than 9mm (or 45 ACP) and the new 9mm bullets are just as effective. I do own a few 40s for training people like the guy in question, When he got back from the gulf, he had to turn in the Model 23 he was issued so I gave him the one of mine he qualified with. I suggest 135 grain DHS ammo-over the far more abusive 165 or 180 grain loads

 

Funny things come from gun forums. This friend of mine is a doorman at one of the Vegas hotels, and I'm a cab driver. I don't just bypass all of the other cabs in line and drive up to the cab stand and take advantage of our friendship, unless I have "important news" for him. Thanks. 135 gr. Win. Ranger.

 

its the stuff the DHS issued to the border patrol. Winchester Ranger IIRC. I got a ton of surplus from "sources"

it doesn't kick much worse than a 9mm. very accurate

I haven't seen it available cheap for a while though

https://images.search.yahoo.com/sea...sw135jhpq4368winchester-50-3.jpg&action=click

 

And yet when you post your AR-15 thread in the gun control forum, you tell me your thread is not about gun control.

Make up your mind please.

Of course I know you didn't answer because you know where I'm headed with the question, but that's beside the point.

 

its not about gun control.

its about the AR-15.

 

And your statements conflict.

You want to avoid answering gun control questions in the gun control forum. Regardless of your self-appointed thread rules, you either are, or are not, in the gun control forum.

This stance is in opposition to your response in this thread.

 

do you have a point, or are you just trying to provoke me?

 

Yes. I'm pointing out that refusing to answer questions about gun control in the gun control forum, while stating we don't need a separate gun discussion forum that is non-control related, is hypocritical.

You can't take both sides of the argument.

That's my point.

 

its not about gun control.

its about the AR-15

 

I'm not sure why this thread doesn't work for that?

I've noticed that apparently no one on the forum collects firearms, though may have many. I'm been more getting into vintage and serviceable antique firearms. This history of the evolution of firearms in terms of design and concepts - civilian and particularly military - is both interesting, highly influential on battles, war and world history - and lessons learned and not learned for a century or more.

Not into the Civil War or cowboy era firearms, though that is valid - definitely - as collectibles. I also have a standard that the firearm MUST be usable and that is a barrier to many categories of otherwise desirable antique firearms. For example, many beautiful and evolution relevant pin fire guns, mostly handguns, were made. But with rare exception ammo is not available. This also applies to most black powder cartridge firearms including then very popular military firearms - such as early German mausers, British black powder military weapons and others.

Any muzzleloader is no problem for ammo as balls and even most caliber bullets can be molded easy enough. I'm not fond of flintlocks, but vintage flintlocks era converted to percussion are accepted as legitimate collectibles as this was VERY popular back then, required skilled work, and the components to do so were available then - and are not now.

Flintlocks had accuracy and reliability issues - and mostly are knocked out by rain. The worst defeat of the US military in the Seminole wars was 140 soldiers all but one slaughtered - because it was heavily raining and the troops had their flintlock rifles under their heavy rain ponchos - and for length also could not have bayonets fixed. So they were just outright slaughtered.

Studying the evolution of Springfield rifles from muzzleloaders to black powder Trapdoor cartridges of declining caliber and then to modern cartridges is very revealing. Again, military forces suffered terribly in a era battle pitting American Springfields against the superior Mausers of the Spanish.

Since they don't do down in value if bought correctly, antique firearms if viable collecting and I find very interesting. Even just exploring what you can find out about a firearm is an interesting challenge when you get back into the 1850s and earlier.

 

here's a relevant issue:



AZ man shoots self in head demonstrating gun's 'double safety.' GunFAIL CXXXVII



http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/...nstrating-gun-s-double-safety-GunFAIL-CXXXVII



Another typical week, with an initial 35 incidents to report, 14 of which involve self-inflicted accidental gunshot wounds. It's still by far the most "popular" type of GunFAIL accident. Together with those accidentally Second Amendmented by family members (of which there were seven reports for the week), they account for 60% of the incidents listed. Nine minors were among the victims as well, ranging in age from 2 to 15 years old, and including three fatalities.
Three people accidentally fired weapons while cleaning them, which of course means that they were making some pretty serious (if all-too-common) mistakes. Three people were accidentally shot at the practice range. Five GunFAIL incidents involved trained law enforcement or security personnel, and four helpful patriots shared liberty projectiles with a neighboring property owners.

I don't have a whole lot for you by way of additional narrative this time. The stories that stand out from among the collection are just a little too tragic. But there's definitely something in common and very much worth pointing out about the stories from Opelousas, LA, where a man who accidentally shot his brother to death then turned his gun on himself in remorse and took his own life, as well as the title story this week, from ****r-Overgaard, AZ, involving a man who contrived to prove the "double safety" of his gun by putting it to his head and pulling the trigger. And that something is: we have seen both of those fact patterns before. This is at least the second time I've passed on a story of a man who shot himself demonstrating what he thought was the impossibility of his gun firing, and the third time I've reported on a pair of brothers who died by a combination of accidental gunshot followed by an immediate, grief-stricken suicide.

Even the most shocking tragedies are beginning to fall into regular patterns. And it hasn't even been three years yet.

This week's full list appears below the fold.

OCEAN VIEW, DE, 8/30/15: State police on Sunday arrested a Sussex County man they say accidentally shot his 2-year-old daughter as she slept. The girl was shot in the leg about 1:10 AM Sunday in a home in the 37000 block of Muddy Neck Road near Ocean View, Master Cpl. Gary E. Fournier said. Investigation determined the shooting occurred as Joseph M. Jenkins Jr., 38, showed his wife a gun he had gotten from a friend after his shotgun was stolen during a burglary, Fournier said. State police had taken a burglary report from the couple about 9 PM Saturday, he said, noting that an undisclosed amount of cash also was stolen. After troopers left the home, Jenkins went to visit a friend of his, returning home about 1 AM, Fournier said. Upon his entering the house, Fournier said, “his wife woke up from sleeping on the floor in the living room.” As the couple’s three children – two 2-year-old girls and a 10-year-old boy – slept on a nearby sofa, Jenkins sat on the floor by his wife to show her a .40 caliber handgun he had gotten from his friend, Fournier said. As Jenkins pulled back on the gun’s slide and let go, a bullet fired and hit one of the girls, he said. The mother immediately called 911, he added. A Delaware State Police Aviation Unit helicopter took the girl to Nemours/Alfred I. du Pont Hospital for Children in Rockland, Fournier said. She was being treated later Sunday, he said, but her condition was not disclosed. Her father was taken into custody and charged with first-degree assault, firearm possession during commission of a felony and three counts of endangering the welfare of a child. Lacking $41,500 secured bail, he was committed to Sussex Correctional Institution near Georgetown.
IRA, VT, 8/30/15: Vermont State Police say a man cleaning his handgun at a campsite accidentally shot his 9-year-old daughter in the stomach, sending her to the intensive care unit. The shooting happened Sunday morning at a campsite in a wooded area off U.S. Route 4 in Ira. Police say the father, Randy Babcock, was cleaning the .22-caliber handgun when it went off. Family members carried McKenzie Ezzo to a rest area, where they were met by emergency personnel. Police say McKenzie underwent surgery and is in guarded condition at a hospital. Police are investigating the shooting.
LONGVIEW, TX, 8/30/15: At approximately 11:30 PM on August 30, 2015 Harrison County 911 dispatchers received a call from Good Shepherd Hospital in Longview regarding a shooting victim in the emergency room. Deputies were dispatched to the emergency room and met with Trey Glenn Adams, W/M/ 07-03-1969, who stated he was target shooting with a friend earlier in the evening. He left the friend’s residence on Waldron’s Ferry Road and placed the weapon on his lap. He stated he thought the weapon was unloaded and when he reached for the weapon, he placed his finger on the trigger and it discharged. He was struck in the left thigh by the bullet and it then went through the driver’s door.
OPELOUSAS, LA, 8/30/15: An Opelousas man shot himself late Sunday night after seeing that he had accidentally shot and killed his brother while they were playing with a handgun, St. Landry Sheriff Bobby Guidroz reported Monday. Two brothers died last night after a double shooting just outside of Opelousas. Guidroz said the shooting occurred at about 11:30 PM Sunday in the 200 block of Magnolia Street. Deputies responded to a report of a suicide. When deputies arrived at the residence they found two men with gunshot wounds in the outdoor kitchen area of the home. Both of them died from their injuries. A witness, in the room when the shootings occurred, told deputies that Joshua Miller was playing with the handgun which he believed to be unloaded. According to the witness, Joshua Miller, 27, of New Roads, picked up the handgun, pointed it at his brother, Jeremiah Miller, 25, of Ventress, and pulled the trigger. The younger brother was shot in the chest, Guidroz reported. After realizing what he had done, Joshua then turned the gun on himself and fired a fatal shot, killing himself, the sheriff said. “After talking to the witness and from all indications, it doesn’t appear to have been an intentional act to kill his brother,” Guidroz said.
SALINAS, CA, 8/30/15: A stray shot at a Salinas firing range sparked a blaze that burned 48.8 acres and took dozens of firefighters to contain. The Monterey County Herald reports (http://bit.ly/... ) that the fire began around 1 p.m. Sunday when a shooter at the Laguna Seca Rifle and Pistol Range accidentally shot a concrete culvert that diverts rainwater. A spark from the bullet ignited nearby grass. Ten fire trucks, two air tankers, two helicopters, about 40 firefighters and two prison inmate crews responded to the blaze. It was extinguished after about an hour. There were no injuries and no structures were destroyed. Officials say there will be no charges for the shooter or fines for the range, which will be taking out the concrete culvert.
MADISON TOWNSHIP, SANDUSKY CO., OH, 8/30/15: 10:13 AM, a man was taken to the emergency room after shooting himself while cleaning his gun, County Road 74, Madison Township.
LEXINGTON, KY, 8/31/15: A woman was grazed by a bullet after a gun apparently was accidentally discharged in a neighboring house, Lexington police said Monday. The shooting was reported shortly before 2 PM in the 3600 block of Bold Bidder Drive, Lexington police Sgt. Ann Welch said. The victim's injury wasn't life-threatening, Welch said. The person responsible for the accidental discharge fled and had not been located by 4 PM Monday, Welch said. Bold Bidder Drive is off Armstrong Mill Road, inside Man o' War Boulevard.
WEST VALLEY CITY, UT, 8/31/15: A confrontation between a security guard and another man inside a state Driver License Division office resulted in a shot from the security guard's gun being fired. No one was injured in the incident and the man the security guard was fighting surrendered immediately after hearing the shot, according to police. The incident happened just after 10 AM at the Driver License Office at 2780 W. 4700 South. A 21-year-old man got into an argument with one of the clerks at the counter and was asked to leave, said West Valley police spokesman Sam Johnson. The man walked outside, but then turned around and went back in to continue his argument. As the security guard attempted to escort the man back out, the two became engaged in a physical fight. At one point, both were on the ground struggling with each other, Johnson said. During the struggle on the ground, a shot was fired from the security guard's gun into the ceiling. Investigators were looking Monday at whether the shot was fired intentionally or accidentally or whether the gun was even removed from the security guard's holster when it went off. Rujal Hassan Abdi, 21, was arrested for investigation of assault and disorderly conduct. A 17-year-old boy originally believed to be involved was also briefly taken into custody but was released a short time later when it was determined he was not involved in the altercation, Johnson said. A protective order was taken out against Abdi on June 30, according to state court records, and he was charged with aggravated assault, a third-degree felony, in 3rd District Court on Aug. 7 in a domestic violence-related case for allegedly attacking his girlfriend who was five months' pregnant with their child. A pretrial protective order was reinstated on Aug. 18. Abdi was booked into the Salt Lake County Jail on Thursday on a warrant, according to court records. The Department of Public Safety contracts out security at the driver license offices to private security companies. Citadel Security employs the guards at the West Valley office.
HOUSTON, TX, 9/01/15: A 19-year-old is dead, after accidentally shooting himself while posing for photos with a gun. According to Houston police, some youth at an apartment complex in the 9800 block of Forum Park in southwest Houston found a gun and brought it back to their apartment. Police say they were posting photos to social media when the 19-year-old accidentally shot himself and died. "It's the worst feeling of my life," said Eric Douglas, the victim's uncle. "A numb feeling. It's like still unbelievable," said Alma Douglas, the victim's grandmother. "Yesterday was my birthday. He came to wish me a happy birthday. And then to hear this kind of news. He was starting community college tomorrow." Family members say the teen was supposed to start classes at Houston Community College. The young father leaves behind two small children, ages one and three, according to relatives. There's no word yet who may have owned the gun, and if any charges could be filed.




and there are MANY more which follow ....

 

These people are known as idiots. Every community has some.

This was my favorite one:

BRONX, NY, 9/01/15: A 28-year-old man was arrested for fatally shooting a man in the Bronx — then accidentally shooting himself when he ran away from the scene, police said Wednesday. Adonijah Colbourne was charged with murder in the slaying of Rahim Minkins, 22, Tuesday morning in front of 1023 Rev. James Polite Ave., cops said. Minkins was blasted in the forehead and body at 4 AM, cops said. He was rushed to Lincoln Hospital but couldn’t be saved. Colbourne accidentally shot himself in the groin as he ran off and called 911 from his home on E. 166th St. looking for help. He was treated at Lincoln Hospital, officials said. Colbourne was also charged with manslaughter and criminal possession of a weapon. His arraignment was pending Wednesday. The alleged gunman had 15 prior arrests for drugs and robbery. Minkins had 11 prior arrests, mostly for robbery, officials said. The shooting was sparked by an ongoing street crew beef in the area, a police source said.

 

I all for an area to discuss firearms sans political talk surrounding them. I vote yes.

 

I am a huge Second Amendment supporter, NRA member, and gun enthusiast. However, this is a political forum. There are a ton of firearm forums out there, many of which I belong to. That is where you will have real discussions on firearms. If you want to talk about firearms in general here, there is the "off-topic" forum. Otherwise, I see no point in a separate firearms forum here at PF. It will just turn political anyway.

 

Yeah. It sounds like fun. I love showing off my funs and talking about them.

 

Bought a Rossi .44 mag lever gun this weekend at the Melbourne Gun Show. Really like. Got a decent deal on it to. Used, $330.00.
It was a toss up between it and a Smith 581 that had been Cerakoted.
It was coated because of some very bad pitting. But at $400 it was a good deal. I just couldn't get passed the pitting. I like my guns to look like as close to new all the time.

 

Good idea, Turtle!

 

I'm pretty well known as an "anti" in re guns, but I would like a separate forum devoted to guns w/o politics being allowed. I will personally promise to be careful not to derail anything. I'm not the nicest or most honest person in the world but I do try to keep my word as to what I say I will do here..

My reason is that I write stories and guns can be an interesting element in them, particularly Westerns, but any genre really

And yes, I am exploiting the forum as free research, that's one of the major reasons people read forums, deal with it. ( We researchers don't just go to one place and we often contribute too). Guns are interesting, no matter how you feel about them and the more people a board has the more possible contributors and "eyes" for advertisers, yes?

I think a guns only subforum as an adjunct to a politics board could get a particular type of poster that the guns only boards might tend to miss

Being bold, I would even go so far as to suggest a historic guns sub/sub forum, as many people who are interested in politics are interested in history and guns have had a great effect on history.

OTOH, maybe not, as that might get right back into politics.

I dunno, this must be one of the more interesting aspects of running one of these boards. I would think you'd want more forums so interesting threads don't get buried and are thus able to attract more posters, OTOH more forums may involve more work and/or expense, so it must be a trade-off, again, I dunno. ( as with so many things)

 

You have to wonder if some parts of the shooters themselves might have still been between the elephant's toes

 

Hopefully. I don't mind killing out of necessity, or taking down animals for herd clearing, pest control, etc...BUT I'm not one of those people that kill something for the sake of killing.