Human Rights Activist Esra Al-Ghamgam Executed By Saudi Arabia

I suggest you watch Bitter Lake again, you obviously need a refresher.

 

I wasn't impressed.. How long did Curtis stay in KSA?

 

Wahhabism is a religion founded in extremism ... This does not mean all of them are extremists but a whole lot are.

Regardless - you completely avoided the content of the article (as usual) which clearly shows Shia persecution in KSA.

 

This fellow grew up in the "KSA" and is a Muslim Ali - al - Ahmed



For more than two centuries, Wahhabism has been Saudi Arabia's dominant faith. It is an austere form of Islam that insists on a literal interpretation of the Koran. Strict Wahhabis believe that all those who don't practice their form of Islam are heathens and enemies. Critics say that Wahhabism's rigidity has led it to misinterpret and distort Islam, pointing to extremists such as Osama bin Laden and the Taliban.


If you go to school in Saudi Arabia, what do you learn about people who are not followers of Wahhabi, of the prophet?
The religious curriculum in Saudi Arabia teaches you that people are basically two sides: Salafis [Wahhabis], who are the winners, the chosen ones, who will go to heaven, and the rest. The rest are Muslims and Christians and Jews and others.

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They are either kafirs, who are deniers of God, or mushrak, putting gods next to God, or enervators, that's the lightest one. The enervators of religion who are they call the Sunni Muslims who ... for instance, celebrate Prophet Mohammed's birthday, and do some stuff that is not accepted by Salafis.

And all of these people are not accepted by Salafi as Muslims. As I said, "claimant to Islam." And all of these people are supposed to be hated, to be persecuted, even killed. And we have several clergy -- not one Salafi clergy -- who have said that against the Shi'a and against the other Muslims. And they have done it in Algeria, in Afghanistan. This is the same ideology. They just have the same opportunity. They did it in Algeria and Afghanistan, and now New York. ..


But the Saudi government has condemned what happened on September 11....

... Yes, Prince Nayif condemned bin Laden, and other princes... Prince Turki condemned bin Laden. They did not condemn that message. They condemned bin Laden. ... Bin Laden learned this in Saudi Arabia. He didn't learn it in the moon. That message that Bin Laden received, it still is taught in Saudi Arabia. And if bin Laden dies, and this policy or curriculum stays, we will have other bin Ladens. ...

Can you show me an example of what the [religious teaching is in the schools?

Well, here, this is a book, hadif, for ninth grade. Hadif is a statement of Prophet Mohammed. This is a book that start for ninth graders. This is talking about the victory of Muslims over Jews. This is a hadif that I truly believe it's not true, as a Muslim:

"The day of judgment will not arrive until Muslims fight Jews, and Muslim will kill Jews until the Jew hides behind a tree or a stone. Then the tree and the stone will say, 'Oh Muslim, oh, servant of God, this is a Jew behind me. Come and kill him.' Except one type of a tree, which is a Jew tree. That will not say that." This is taught for 14-year-old boys in Saudi Arabia.


In middle schools...

In middle schools, yes. Official middle schools. This is a book printed by Saudi government Ministry of Education. (Ed. Note: read some excerpts from these textbooks. https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/saudi/etc/textbooks.html )

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/saudi/analyses/wahhabism.html

 

Very superficial.. Only 40% of Saudis are Wahhabis.... and they most certainly did condemn OBL's beliefs.. He followed the teachings of SayeedQubt and Al Banna.. Both are outlawed in Arabia. They were expelled when Faisel was king in the early 1970s. They were Egyptians who sought sanctuary when the MB fell out with Nasser.

What is this hadif you are talking about?

 

Wahhabism is not extreme. It is simple and conservative.. It was a reform movement to get rid of innovations to Islam brought by the Ottoman Turks.

 

Ali - al - Ahmed is a Shia from Hofuf.. and he has a POV to sell including sucking up to Freedom House which knows NOTHING about Saudi texbooks or Saudi schools.

 

More rights for the minority Shiites in Saudi Arabia. I'm curious, I read somewhere that the Shiites dominate in the areas with the oil wells. If so, and I'm not sure, then maybe she wanted Shiite independence? That would certainly frighten the King enough to kill her - I mean look what at he did to his relatives to grab their funds. When it comes to money, he's ruthless. Some Muslim there.

 

Nope.. Shia are a minority in the Eastern province as well.. Many of them do work for ARAMCO.. many others are successful merchants.. For years they dominated the pearl trade. Most of them are good citizens and have no ax to grind.

If she wants to live somewhere that is exclusively Shia, she should probably move to Iran

 

Why would the Saudi's chant that? They're living in the lap of luxury because of the US and the West - but I wouldn't trust their intents. I personally never look at whats being done to me, because then I would be prejudiced, but I always look at what they are doing to others. As an example:

How are they treating the Alawites in Syria?
How are they treating the Shiites?
How are they treating rich nations compared to poor nations like Yemen?
How are they treating Blacks in Africa?
How are they treating Christians in poor nations like the Philippines, compared to rich nations like the US?

 

For more than two centuries, Wahhabism has been Saudi Arabia's dominant faith. It is an austere form of Islam that insists on a literal interpretation of the Koran. Strict Wahhabis believe that all those who don't practice their form of Islam are heathens and enemies.

 

This is all I need to know about Saudi Arabia and Wahaabism

 

The Saudis treat the Shia in Saudi very well. They have no use for pan Arab socialism but until the assassination of Hairiri they always defended Assad. They give huge amounts in charity to East Africa and have for 50 years.

They have built schools, colleges, hospitals and clinics in Yemen.. Provided them with gasoline and food... economic development.

They also provide huge humanitarian aid and infrastructure development to Indonesia and Pakistan.

 

As I said.. that very superficial.. and its parroted by all the instant experts who have never set foot in Arabia.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shia_Islam_in_Saudi_Arabia#Restrictions_and_persecutions

The Saudi government has often been viewed as an active oppressor of Shiites[31] because of the funding of the Wahabbi ideology which denounces the Shiite faith.[32]

In 1988 fatwas passed by the country's leading cleric, Abdul-Aziz ibn Baz denounced the Shiites as apostates.[33] Abdul-Rahman al-Jibrin, a member of the Higher Council of Ulama sanctioned the killing on Shiites in 1994.[33] According to Vali Nasr, this was still be reiterated in Wahhabi religious literature as late as 2002.[4] By 2007 al-Jibrin wrote that [Shiites] "are the most vicious enemy of Muslims, who should be wary of their plots."[33]

According to a 2009 Human Rights Watch report, Shiite citizens in Saudi Arabia "face systematic discrimination in religion, education, justice, and employment".[34]

Saudi Arabia has no Shiite cabinet ministers, mayors or police chiefs, according to another source, Vali Nasr, unlike other countries with sizable Shiite populations (such as Iraq and Lebanon) . Shiites are kept out of "critical jobs" in the armed forces and the security services, and not one of the three hundred Shiite girls schools in the Eastern Province has a Shiite principal.[4]

Pakistani columnist Mohammad Taqi has written that "the Saudi regime is also acutely aware that, in the final analysis, Shiite grievances [...] stem from socioeconomic deprivation, as a result of religious repression and political marginalization bordering on apartheid."[35]

Testifying before the US Congressional Human Rights Caucus, Ali al-Ahmed, Director of the Institute for Gulf Affairs, stated

Saudi Arabia is a glaring example of religious apartheid. The religious institutions from government clerics to judges, to religious curriculums, and all religious instructions in media are restricted to the Wahhabi understanding of Islam, adhered to by less than 40% of the population. The Saudi government communized Islam, through its monopoly of both religious thoughts and practice. Wahhabi Islam is imposed and enforced on all Saudis regardless of their religious orientations. The Wahhabi sect does not tolerate other religious or ideological beliefs, Muslim or not. Religious symbols by Muslims, Christians, Jewish and other believers are all banned. The Saudi embassy in Washington is a living example of religious apartheid. In its 50 years, there has not been a single non-Sunni Muslim diplomat in the embassy. The branch of Imam Mohamed Bin Saud University in Fairfax, Virginiainstructs its students that Shia Islam is a Jewish conspiracy.[36]

In November 2014 at al-Dalwah village in the eastern province of al-Ahsa, three unknown masked gunmen opened fire at a Husseiniya, or Shi'ite religious center, killing eight and injuring a dozens.[37]

While Saudi citizen circles blamed the Khawarij for the attack, claiming they wanted to start a civil war, a handful of articles in the Saudi press argued that the attack "had not come out of nowhere", that there was anti-Shi'ite incitement in the kingdom on the part of "the religious establishment, preachers, and even university lecturers – and that it was on the rise".[38] The Saudi government/religious establishment, as well as the National media did not comment on the attack.

In January 2016, Saudi Arabia executed the prominent Shiite cleric Sheikh Nimr, who had called for pro-democracy demonstrations, along with fourtyseven other Saudi shia citizens sentenced by the Specialized Criminal Court on terrorism charges.[39]

Since May 2017[40][41][42][43] in response to protests against the government, the predominantly Shia town of Al-Awamiyah has been put under full siege by the Saudi military. Residents are not allowed to enter or leave, and military indiscriminately shells the neighborhoods with airstrikes, mortar[44] and artillery[45] fire along with snipers[46] shooting residents.[47][48][49][50] Dozens of Shia civilians were injured, including a three year old and a couple of residents killed.The Saudi government claims it is fighting terrorists in al-Awamiyah.

Residents also reported soldiers shooting at homes, cars and everyone in streets.[51][52]

During the crackdown the Saudi government demolished several historical sites and many other buildings and houses in Qatif.[53][54][55]

On July 26, 2017, Saudi authorities began refusing to give emergency services to wounded civilians. Saudi Arabia has also not provided humanitarian help to trapped citizens of Awamiyah.[56]

In August 2017, it was reported that the Saudi government demolished 488 buildings in Awamiyah. This demolition came from a siege of the city by the Saudi government, as it continued to try to prevent the citizens of the city from gaining their rights.[57]

20,000 residents were forced to flee from their homes to survive.[58][59]

President of Quran Council[60] and two cousins of executed Nimr al-Nimr were also killed by Saudi security forces in Qatif in 2017.[61][62]

Suppression of religious practice[edit source]
The Saudi government has refused to allow Shiite teachers and students exemption from school to partake in activities for the Day of Ashura, one of the most important religious days for Shiites which commemorates the martyrdom of Muhammad's grandson, Husayn bin Ali, at the hands of the second Sunni Umayyad Caliph, Yazid.[63] In 2009, during Ashura commencements, Shia religious and community leaders were arrested protesting against the government and chanting slogans against Wahhabis.

In 2009 a group of Shiites on their way to perform hajj pilgrimage (one of the five pillars of Islam that all able-bodied Muslims are required to perform once in their lives) in Mecca were arrested by Saudi religious police due to the involvement in a protest against the Saudi government.[37] A fifteen-year-old pilgrim was shot in the chest and an unknown assailant stabbed a Shiite sheikh in the back, shouting "Kill the rejectionist [Shia]".[37]

In Medina[edit source]
Shiite pilgrims go to Jannat al Baqi mainly to visit the grave of Fatima and Ahl al-Bayt who are buried in the cemetery of Jannat al-Baqi' but no visit of other Sahabas in Islam. Many incidences of not following the rules of the place happened by Shiite in this region specifically resulting in the arrest which most of the times were released later. Shiites and Sunni Hanafi, Shafi'is, Barelvis, and Dawoodi Bohra Ismailisusually pray near graves of Ahl al-Bayt but in Wahhabism this act is considered as shirk. In Saudi Arabia, most of the people follow an interpretation of Sunni Islam called Wahhabism, which does not allow practices like praying near graves of Ahl al-Bayt in Jannat al Baqi.

Early 2009, several people grabbed stones, sand from the grave of Fatima (who is daughter of Muhammad and the wife of Ali) in order to make turbahs out of them which is not permissible according certain interpretations of Sunni Islam, like Wahhabism.

Late 2011, a Shiite citizen was charged for not following the law and involved with blasphemy and sentenced to 500 lashes and 2 years in jail; the latter sentence was later reduced.[64] Also late 2011, a prominent Shiite Canadian cleric, Usama al-Attar, was arrested for unknown reasons but possibly because of his criticism of the kingdoms response to uprisings in Yemen and Bahrain.[65] He was released on the same day, declaring the arrest entirely unprovoked.[66]

 

Discrimination in education[edit source]
Much of education in Saudi Arabia is based on Wahhabi religious material. The government has restricted the names that Shiites can use for their children in an attempt to discourage them from showing their identity. Saudi textbooks are hostile to Shiism, often characterizing the faith as a form of heresy worse than Christianity and Judaism.

Discrimination in the workforce[edit source]
Much discrimination occurs in the Saudi workforce as well. Shiites are prohibited from becoming teachers of religious subjects, which constitute about half of the courses in secondary education.[67]Shia cannot become principals of schools.[67] Some Shia have become university professors but often face harassment from students and faculty alike.[67] Shiites are disqualified as witnesses in court, as Saudi Sunni sources cite the Shi'a practise of Taqiyya wherein it is permissible to lie while one is in fear or at risk of significant persecution. Shiites cannot serve as judges in ordinary court, and are banned from gaining admission to military academies,[37] and from high-ranking government or security posts, including becoming pilots in Saudi Airlines.[68]

Amir Taheri quotes a Shi'ite businessman from Dhahran as saying "It is not normal that there are no Shi'ite army officers, ministers, governors, mayors and ambassadors in this kingdom."

 

I can't imagine what reforms the Turks would make, but regardless when you turn back the clock, then you're idolizing your culture and heritage and see it as being superior. This to me is arrogance and self love akin to nationalism. I

I don't mean that people shouldn't have pride in what and who they are, of course they should. But life itself is growth and development - and by that I don't mean goody's like having cars and jets. Nor am I equating progress with the liberal west. I see them as a negation of progress and a return to paganism.

Anyway I'm just rambling on.

 

Every civlization dies, western europe died in the fifties, now it's more a sub american culture.

What's happening in SA is very sad, but to each country, it's own way to rule itself. What appear to us horrible is justice to other people. As long they don't come impose their islam and islamic laws.

 

That is a Russian source.
I got an Iranian source saying it's could be fake:

https://www.yjc.ir/en/news/27612/saudi-arabia-beheads-female-activist-in-public-report

 

Anyone can write in wiki.. Why do you suppose that ARAMCO and the SAG have educated Shia abroad since 1950 .. and they have come up thru the ranks to serve in Saudi ARAMCO management?

Ali al Anhed is a Shia from Hofuf with an ax to grind and a profitable relationship with Freedom House.

 

https://www.dw.com/en/is-saudi-arabia-waging-war-on-its-shiite-minority/a-40045513

Saudis are waging war upon their Shia minority

 

https://foreignpolicy.com/2014/12/03/saudi-arabia-has-a-shiite-problem-royal-family-saud/

Saudis oppress their Shia minority

 

https://www.albawaba.com/news/who-a...opulation-and-why-are-they-protesting-1003300

Shia are mistreated severely under Saudi rule

 

https://www.hrw.org/news/2017/08/24/anti-shia-bias-driving-saudi-arabia-unrest

Anti-Shia bias is driving Saudi military activity

 

https://www.middleeasteye.net/in-de...saudi-shias-are-forced-life-hiding-1174712646

Shia Muslims go into hiding, fearing Saudi persecution