Idea to change the waiting period law

Discussion in 'Gun Control' started by kazenatsu, Jul 13, 2021.

  1. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Here's an idea to change the waiting period law.

    Make an exception for customers who have already filed a special form with that particular seller, giving them instant buying status.
    That status could be "turned off" by the buyer, in the extremely unlikely event there became a situation the buyer feared he might do something he would later regret.

    This might help in situations where for example a woman has a creepy stalker, and thinks there is a probability she might want to have some protection in the very near future, but isn't quite ready to do it immediately.

    This would also help reduce the inconvenience to frequent buyers who already have large collections.
     
  2. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    "Change"?
    Get rid of.
    The state cannot delay a citizen in the exercise of his rights unless said delay is based om reasonable supposition or probable clause; any "waiting period" beyond that absolutely necessary to achieve the administrative requirements of a law violate the constitution.

    Under normal circumstances, a NICS check takes a couple minutes; as such 5 or 7 or 10 day waiting period is arbitrary and capricious.
     
  3. Well Bonded

    Well Bonded Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  4. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Okay, but there may not be enough momentum or support to get rid of these laws. So are you willing to support an idea to change them a little bit?

    Sometimes when you can't have everything you want you can at least push a compromise proposal and make it a little bit less worse.

    I'm not sure the other side would support it, but at least they wouldn't have a logical argument to oppose it.

    Being stubborn and refusing to even think of a compromise when you know there is no chance of a win anytime soon is only to your own detriment, wouldn't you agree?
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2021
  5. Moonglow

    Moonglow Well-Known Member

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    I prefer the open market free of govt. oversight.
     
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  6. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Something tells me the Green Party which you support doesn't share your views on that.
     
  7. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    I don't have a waiting period; if my state legislature is ever insane enough to create one, the state will be buried in lawsuits.
    You proceed from a false premise - the anti-gun side isn't interested in compromise.
     
  8. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I wasn't advocating this idea in areas that don't already have these laws.
     
  9. Doofenshmirtz

    Doofenshmirtz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    There is a 10-day wait where I live. Now all we need is a law requiring criminals to give a 10-day notice before committing a crime!

    I understand a 10 day wait for the first gun purchase. Why make people wait 10 days when they already have a gun?
     
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  10. Bob Newhart

    Bob Newhart Well-Known Member

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    Here's a better one - don't have a waiting period.
     
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  11. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yeah, you obviously didn't listen to what I wrote.
     
  12. Bob Newhart

    Bob Newhart Well-Known Member

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    Nope I was just agreeing with TOG 6.

    If you have enough momentum to change it, then you have enough momentum to get rid of it.

    I'll ask you, how many of the gun grabbers here are supporting you? So, you're not going to convince anyone on the opposing side to change the law because the truth is they just want to take all the guns.

    Next, by asking for change in the law you're saying, possibly unintentionally, that the idea was right but the law needs some improvement. They'll gladly put you on the list of people who think wait times are A-OK! Politicians will hear you and think - "Hmm, no one's upset with this law."
     
  13. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That kind of seems like an "I'll either take all or nothing" stance.

    Look, there are several places in the country where you're just not going to get your way, anytime soon. Let's be realistic here.
    What's so bad about taking these laws - where they already exist - and watering them down a little bit, or trying to carve out some totally common sense exceptions?
     
  14. SiNNiK

    SiNNiK Well-Known Member

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    Summarily rejected. No deal.
     
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  15. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It wasn't a compromise for conservatives, it was a compromise for progressives.

    I was only arguing for this idea in places that already have these laws. You would be under no obligation to agree to a deal if you supported this law. You could support this change to the law and still also support repealing the law altogether.
     
  16. SiNNiK

    SiNNiK Well-Known Member

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    Do not make deals with gun grabbers. Go forth and sin no more.
     
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  17. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    You have to understand - the anti-gun left isn't interested in compromise; they will never willfully agree to anything that makes it -easier- for the law abiding to exercise their right to keep and bear arms.
    This is why they kick and scream and whine and cry every time some state enacts a law to that effect or a court strikes one of their pet restrictions.
     
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  18. Chrizton

    Chrizton Well-Known Member

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    I have never seen the virtue of waiting limits. I think they were originally supposed to happen unless states had an automated system for instant checks back in the day but technology has since rendered that moot.
     
  19. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You people do realize that whether or not you personally believe in these limits, still has nothing to do with the idea in the Opening Post, right?


    It's very frustrating, because I'm getting the feeling like everyone in this thread is unable to mentally grasp the proposal and what it means.

    The whole point is this is ALREADY the law in many places. This idea would be like a partial repeal of that law, which many of you already do not approve of. Therefore I don't see a reason you should oppose this idea.

    You people seem to be believe I am somehow arguing in favor of waiting period laws, which I am not.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2021
  20. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Used to be the waiting period was anulled for those who had a CCW here in WA, given that a CCW in WA is only attainable by those who pass an in-depth criminal BGC. Our illustrious gun-haters got rid of that a few years ago, so I doubt they'd agree to your proposal either.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2021
  21. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Let me use an example here. Suppose someone proposed an idea to restore the law to the way it was before that, and then not a single gun rights supporter was even willing to entertain that idea because they stubbornly had their sights set on the whole enchilada.
    That would just be stupidity and stubbornness, wouldn't it?
    "No, I'm not going to support your idea at all because I don't believe in waiting periods"
    Gun rights supporters could have gotten a small concession, but they refused to do so, because of foolish stubbornness and incapability of logical strategy.

    You see what I'm saying, don't you?
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2021
  22. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It appears to be proposing a conditional modification that reduces the waiting period... which we used to have and was gotten rid of. Im suggesting your proposal is likely to be as acceptable to our state regulators as the one we used to have and dont anymore.
     
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  23. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes, that may be true. But this proposal is far more likely to acceptable to these people than a complete total repeal of the waiting period law. Therefore shouldn't those who would prefer the law be totally repealed still be pushing for this proposal?

    That's like you saying you want taxes lowered to 5%. Currently taxes are at 20%, and someone has a proposal to lower the tax rates to 15%. You should totally support that proposal. It would be illogical for you to say that you will refuse to support it just because you think taxes should be at 5%. That proposal will get you a little closer to where you want, so you should support it.
    Supporting that proposal doesn't mean you don't still support the idea of lowering tax rates to 5%.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2021
  24. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Im sure 100% of gun rights supporters in WA would support your proposal. Im also sure it wouldn't be enough for it to pass. We spend $10M/year on mandatory BGCs that have yet to result in a single additional incarceration (1 person was prosecuted with additional charges after shooting someone). Perhaps you're under the impression that gun laws are still being founded upon reason and utility...? ;)
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2021
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  25. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I'm just saying, maybe gun rights supporters could craft proposals that would attempt to appeal to the type of logic held by the other side, even if that logic is flawed.
    This might be the best way to gain some concessions.

    If logic will not work to win an argument, you can at least shift that argument to the arena of logic on the opposing side's territory. Use the type of logic that they agree with, and then they will not be able to put up an argument against it, or if they do it will be very obvious they are not using logic (not even the logic which they claim to agree with).
     

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